Idle setup q...
#1
Idle setup q...
Ok, I'm going through the idle setup manual and everything goes great until the car warms up so much that the fan kicks on. Then the idle starts to surge and I can't correct it with the idle closed loop settings (proportional, intergal and differential gain)... Up until then, I have a nice stable idle at around 950 rpm and AFR's around 15.
What do I do when the damn fan kicks on and I can't catch the surging?
Thanks,
-Todd
What do I do when the damn fan kicks on and I can't catch the surging?
Thanks,
-Todd
#4
Its probably a lean spot just above your idle cell. Pay careful attention to how the fuel cells are spaced and what MAP you are at. Because the computer interpolates between every cell you can run into issues with raising one cell to much without raising others. With your car maybe the extra load of the fans causes the engine to go into a much leaner condition because the next cell up is actually too lean, and your idle cell is too rich. This causes the motor to loose power and then loose RPM's dropping into the rich area again which makes it gain power. The oscillations start from there and just grow.
Most idle problems like that are fuel MAP related, but the PID settings can also play a role.
Best,
Travis
Most idle problems like that are fuel MAP related, but the PID settings can also play a role.
Best,
Travis
#5
Tweaking the fuel cells around idle helped a lot with some wandering that was occurring when I had my headlights on... But, no matter what I do, it goes nuts when the fans kick in.
As a last ditch effort, I raised my target RPM to 1100 at 90c, no difference. It goes nuts, then dies if I don't jump on it.
I've attached my map...
Thanks!
-t
As a last ditch effort, I raised my target RPM to 1100 at 90c, no difference. It goes nuts, then dies if I don't jump on it.
I've attached my map...
Thanks!
-t
#7
I don't have mine sorted yet, but this gave me a good understanding behind the theory of how PID controllers work:
PID controller - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
In particular this section:
PID controller - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Keep us updated with how you go! I'll do the same when my engine is back together and I get to fiddle with this stuff again.
PID controller - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
In particular this section:
PID controller - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Keep us updated with how you go! I'll do the same when my engine is back together and I get to fiddle with this stuff again.
#8
Did you set up your open loop idle values correctly? They are a little way off .
You must read this thread https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/t40771/
You must read this thread https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/t40771/
#10
Did you set up your open loop idle values correctly? They are a little way off .
You must read this thread https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/t40771/
You must read this thread https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/t40771/
It's actually not bad right now... As long as the fans stay off, it idles happily along at around 1000 rpm and is quite driveable (no stalling, surging, etc...)
Thanks!
-t
Last edited by micagreenmachine; 12-16-2009 at 08:51 PM.
#11
Wow... Much better... Once I got open loop set well, closed loop was much easier. It isn't even too bad when I turn on the A/C. Tweaking the fuel so it doesn't go lean with an increase in MAP was a big help too.
A little more tweaking is needed, but I can live with it the way it is for a while.
A little more tweaking is needed, but I can live with it the way it is for a while.
#13
Adjusted my base idle value
Leaned out the idle area (0-60kPa/1-1500rpm), but made adjustments in the tuning table to smooth out the idle area a bit and get rid of any really lean or rich spots right around idle speed/map
Re-adjusted the idle screw, it was too far out (too far counter-clockwise)
I just had them way out of whack, especially the idle screw... Serves me right for trying to rush through it the first time. It's idling around 900rpm (warm) at 14.5ish AFR now and the fan coming on doesn't freak it out any more. I'll tackle the cold idle this afternoon.
Leaned out the idle area (0-60kPa/1-1500rpm), but made adjustments in the tuning table to smooth out the idle area a bit and get rid of any really lean or rich spots right around idle speed/map
Re-adjusted the idle screw, it was too far out (too far counter-clockwise)
I just had them way out of whack, especially the idle screw... Serves me right for trying to rush through it the first time. It's idling around 900rpm (warm) at 14.5ish AFR now and the fan coming on doesn't freak it out any more. I'll tackle the cold idle this afternoon.
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