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Old 03-17-2015, 03:18 PM   #1641
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No VVT control, no knock control. If I was doing a nice NA build this MS2 would be perfect, but I'm not.

Listed for sale now.

MS2e PNP for '99-00

Now I have to decide what to do next, though I'm not going to be ready to buy anything until 1. my current MS2 sells and/or the end of May rolls around (at the earliest). Not in a particular hurry since, well, my car probably won't be running before August at the earliest.
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Old 03-17-2015, 04:30 PM   #1642
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Perhaps I've found my answer, just posted this morning:

MSPNP Pro - now for '99-'00 Miatas
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Old 03-17-2015, 05:09 PM   #1643
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the timing - it could not be more perfect
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Old 03-17-2015, 05:10 PM   #1644
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Ed humor me. I want to build another ms3. And the whole 99-00 with VVT sounds fun.
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Old 03-17-2015, 05:10 PM   #1645
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Half the price too.
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Old 03-17-2015, 05:17 PM   #1646
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It's certainly super tempting. We'll chat about it more, I'm not buying anything for a bit. Need to make some more money before I spend more. I super appreciate the offer though, very interested in having you do it.

I've really been thinking about moving all my ABS stuff over from the MSM... I have literally every single thing I need in order to do it, except the corner I sent to G, but I could probably get him to send it back to me or source another one elsewhere. Oh yeah, I guess I'd need the rear upright as well since mine got bent in the accident again

Thoughts? The tub will be stripped anyway, it really doesn't seem like all that much work since everything else is already out. While I'm in there.....

Retrofit ABS into NB
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Old 03-17-2015, 05:31 PM   #1647
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Do you need it? Reading ogracing brake question thread the OEM ABS isn't that great for track days and stuff. Hot brake pads don't like to take a beating. I think it makes a ton of sense in auto-x but for the track not as much. Also seems like one of those things you could do later without much extra work.
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Old 03-17-2015, 05:47 PM   #1648
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Quote:
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Do you need it? Reading ogracing brake question thread the OEM ABS isn't that great for track days and stuff. Hot brake pads don't like to take a beating. I think it makes a ton of sense in auto-x but for the track not as much. Also seems like one of those things you could do later without much extra work.
Despite what OGR says, I know people who use ABS all the time on the track without destroying stuff.

IMHO the real value is just in having it there as a backup. Don't hammer on the ABS into every corner -- instead drive the car like before the ABS went in, but it's there to take over and prevent flatspotting a set of expensive tires. It's also very nice to have in the wet.

As for doing the conversion now, if you want to use the factory front-to-rear hardline then that's MUCH easier to put into a shell. There's no way it'll go past the tranny when it's installed, so I wound up bending, cutting, and re-flaring the original hard line in mine. It worked OK, but a factory line would have been better.

The uprights are also a significant work savings to put in the first time. Even if you decide to defer the rest of the work until later, I'd swap them to start with.

Are you transplanting the MSM diff? IIRC, the MSM axles are specific to that diff, so if you're using an older diff then you'll need to make sure you have axles with ABS rings. You might be able to take the rings off the MSM axles and put them on the older ones, dunno.

--Ian
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Old 03-17-2015, 05:48 PM   #1649
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^^^i like what he said better than what I said.
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Old 03-17-2015, 06:05 PM   #1650
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Quote:
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I have literally every single thing I need in order to do it, except the corner I sent to G, but I could probably get him to send it back to me
Absolutely! Say the word and I'll get it boxed up. I haven't installed it yet and I'm in no mad rush to do so. I bought it because it was convenient and I knew I'd eventually need one. I'm happy to send it back
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Old 03-17-2015, 06:47 PM   #1651
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Despite what OGR says, I know people who use ABS all the time on the track without destroying stuff.

IMHO the real value is just in having it there as a backup. Don't hammer on the ABS into every corner -- instead drive the car like before the ABS went in, but it's there to take over and prevent flatspotting a set of expensive tires. It's also very nice to have in the wet.

As for doing the conversion now, if you want to use the factory front-to-rear hardline then that's MUCH easier to put into a shell. There's no way it'll go past the tranny when it's installed, so I wound up bending, cutting, and re-flaring the original hard line in mine. It worked OK, but a factory line would have been better.

The uprights are also a significant work savings to put in the first time. Even if you decide to defer the rest of the work until later, I'd swap them to start with.

Are you transplanting the MSM diff? IIRC, the MSM axles are specific to that diff, so if you're using an older diff then you'll need to make sure you have axles with ABS rings. You might be able to take the rings off the MSM axles and put them on the older ones, dunno.

--Ian
The other thing is that this car is still very much going to be driven on the street, and I feel like ABS is a must-have for street driving. Never know when you'll encounter crud on the road or a rainstorm or an idiot driver (OK that one you DO know and the answer is ALL OF THE TIME).

I will be transplanting the entire MSM rear subframe, diff, axles, etc. Everything but the passenger rear control arms which were likely bent in the accident along with the aforementioned upright.

Really really thinking about this. I do remember seeing Muoto's terrifyingly FUBAR'd 11.75" Wilwoods though, attributed to ABS.
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Old 03-17-2015, 07:10 PM   #1652
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Really really thinking about this. I do remember seeing Muoto's terrifyingly FUBAR'd 11.75" Wilwoods though, attributed to ABS.
If you don't engage it, the ABS system behaves like any other brake system. If you're really worried you can turn it off when you take it out on track.

Since I had taken the cruise out (after melting it at laguna) I used the cruise control switch on my dash to control power to the ABS computer, so I can turn it on/off at will.

--Ian
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Old 03-17-2015, 07:19 PM   #1653
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Exactly. You want the ABS, it's easy enough to disable if you want to go cave-man-mode.

You can still learn to threshold brake with ABS. If it's saving your tires at the end of every straight, you're doing it wrong.
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Old 03-17-2015, 07:29 PM   #1654
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The other side of it is cost though. I mean, I have most of the parts but another $200 to G plus shipping for my upright back, plus another rear upright........

..........

I guess that's not really ALL that much, maybe $400 total, probably a bit less.....

Then there's the simple engine bay....

Oi.
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Old 03-17-2015, 07:40 PM   #1655
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Do it.
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Old 03-17-2015, 07:50 PM   #1656
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Crusher had switchable ABS.

I have just decided to name your car "Blusher." You want Blusher to be all it can be, right? ABS.
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Old 03-17-2015, 07:52 PM   #1657
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Blusher?

Not sure what to do with that.

I guess if I have Aidan build me an MS3 instead of buying one from somewhere else, that'd pay for the ABS conversion.......
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Old 03-17-2015, 08:05 PM   #1658
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Do it.
Yes, give me back my money

There is no possibly way you could have come here and expected us to tell you NOT to do this, right?
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Old 03-17-2015, 08:25 PM   #1659
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haha... Well, I mean, when i was talking 6-pistons y'all talked me out of it, thought maybe this would turn out the same way....

I don't have to make a decision now though... I have to finish the S2000 and get a paycheck or two before I drop more monies on this thing.

Anyone want an MS2e? I think it's time to go visit Clubricer.
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Old 03-17-2015, 08:55 PM   #1660
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That's because we're all about function, see. 6 piston? Don't need'em. ABS? Solid investment. Especially since you have the majority of what you need anyway.
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