hector

Wait, how much work is it to get the dry sump stuff from the local shop to work on the NA? I mean you're an engineer, so engineer something!

And some progress pics. It's not cold enough in Worcester for you to be doing nothing.

Leafy

iTrader: (1)

Yeah keeping that. With the astro T5 that gets me about 76mph in 2nd, which I need.

Hector I was waiting on the ranger oil pan to ship in. They're $100 from a junk yard and the closest one was 35miles away, or I could just order a brand new one from tasca ford for $130, it was a pretty easy choice there.

hector

Ok waiting on update. BTW, what is it that you are building? 2L or 2.5L? I don't know the MZR well enough by looking at the picture. Did you get a MX5 engine since its L mounted and has most of the auxiliary components in the right configuration? That was my thinking but MX5 engines are 2L and much more costly than 2.3L engines from the 3's.

Leafy

iTrader: (1)

2.5 liter, from a focus. Same block as the 2.3 but bored out and with a longer stoke and the best flowing mzr/duratec head. All the motors are basically the same, this one has the extra mounts on the timing cover to use it in a fwd car. But as I just found out its missing the holes for the Ranger pickup tube supports.

Speaking of which, it doesn't matter because the Ranger pan doesn't work. The bump to clear the oil pump and pickup tube falls directly into the power steering lines. Might work on a manual rack. Looks like I'm back to needing dry sump.

hector

So Mazda and Ford have the same stamping on the engine block? That's important as the SM rules say the block must be stamped the same as any engine used in the car line. Or at least they used to say that. Haven't checked in a while.

Random questions:

Do you think omitting the VVT is negligible for turbo since 2.5L or is another at play here? Maybe better head flow from Duratec is worth it? Less **** to worry/tune?

When you mentioned weight between the BP and MZR, was that a quote from somewhere or did you weigh the long blocks?

Have you called around to see if the Cosworth dry sump kit is actually available? Vivid shows it on the website for like $2700. Steep but self contained with oil pan.

Can't you modify the oil pan for clearance with the PS lines?

glade

iTrader: (2)

2.0 vs 2.5 Duratec/MZR | Moto-East ECU Tuning. Mazda Miata MX-5 / Mazdaspeed 3/6/CX-7 DISI, Subaru BRZ/FR-S Tuning. EcuTek, Delta Force, NA, Turbo and Supercharged Tuning.


I assume you've done you're research, but this was an eye opener for me

2manyhobyz

iTrader: (4)

Does the 2.5 from the Focus come with or without the balance shafts? From what little I started reading (search turbo ranger) the ranger block doesn't use balance shafts.
I'm surprised you use a powered rack. I thought the early manual racks had a slightly better ratio.

Leafy

iTrader: (1)

The 2.5 has balance shafts. I already deleted them. It takes literally 5 minutes to delete them with the motor hanging on an engine stand with the oil pan already off. Stupid blockoff plate for it costs $35 though. The 2.5 does have VVT on the intake only, and using the NC miata manifold gets me VICS as well. The TB outlet on the NC manifold is a little less than optimal but doesnt seem to be an issue. The complete lack of aftermarket manifolds for the motor short of getting formula atlantic ITBS and using a plenum for boost is weird.

That weight quote I snagged from some Locust or Lotus 7 site, they are starting to move to these motors. These motors are also huge for classic ford swaps in europe which is where I'm going to have to get most of the pimpy parts from. I'm kind of torn between waiting to see if the dollar picks up vs the pound or just ordering parts. The Cosworth dry sump probably wont work because of the steering rack. I'm looking at the Pace system, which costs ~1300pounds. But I'm also considering the turbosport dry sump pan because its got more clearance by the rack lines and then the smallest nutter racing 3 stage pump and a custom mount which will be the biggest pain. I could always go full stupid with the $5k SBD drysump system that is mega pimptastic, but thats dumb.

2manyhobyz

iTrader: (4)

That's great, it's nice to hear they are that easy to deal with. Maybe somebody has already researched this, do you see any advantage to running a 2.3 crank and have rods made to improve the rod ratio for even more advantage at the top end. I hear over in europe this is popular for the 2ltr.

Leafy

iTrader: (1)

I dont think many of the euro guys mess with anything besides the 2.0. The builders up there seem to have settled onto the 2.3 as not having as much potential and they dont have many 2.5s over there. Of course there's a ton of engine builders with turn key 200hp+ N/A 2.0 solutions and a handful with 280hp+ pump gas turn key solutions. Right now the plan is to run the stock 2.5 minus balance shafts for a couple years until I decide what direction I want to go. Mondo sized turbo on a built 2.5, keep the 6758 and go to a 2.0 and different gearing, or shoot for one of those crazy over 300whp n/a builds and remove all the weight.

noname4me

Have you looked Raceline in the UK for the dry sump kit? I believe there kits are much more reasonable than SBDev. Raceline - Duratec parts and tuning

BTW... I mentioned the idea of doing a MZR swap with a dry sump kit months ago on this forum and no one responded to the idea. Glad to see that you are actually trying it out. I ended up thinking about the MZR swap because there are options to swap over to a T5/TKO type transmission if one builds the MZR with boost past what a NC 6spd can handle... Quad4Rods, Quicktime (RM-8090), and Welcome to Mulberry Fabrications Ltd - Mulberry Fabrications are some options to look at. There are pro's/con's of each option, but at least there are solutions available short of having a completely custom adapter plate made.

Good luck with your project!

Leafy

iTrader: (1)

Thanks. Hadnt seen that 3rd bell housing option before. I was planning to use quad4rods one with the focus stater and turn the flex plate into a 6.5" clutch and fw.

The race line dry sump won't work for me. Steering rack is in the way. I'm trying to get responses from turbo sport and pace to get me dimensions of their pans to see which one will work.

glade

iTrader: (2)

9 days........any updates?

Leafy

iTrader: (1)

Turbosport dry sump pan should get here tomorrow. Ranger coolant adapter fits mint, just as good if not better than the european coolant rail options for 1/10th the prince.

aidandj

iTrader: (5)

Damn, i was hoping you were gonna guinea pig the ranger pan.

Leafy

iTrader: (1)

Attempted and returned. not going to happen. No that uses the stock oil pump will work. Any reasonable pickup tube installed on the pump hits the steering rack without an oil pan on it.

aidandj

iTrader: (5)

So this is pretty much a drysump only option?

Or custom pickup?

You're sticking with stock subframe right? No cutting or clearancing?

Leafy

iTrader: (1)

Dry sump only, or I guess some kind of external oil pump wet sump ****, but **** that you're a tank and some lines away from dry sump at that point.

We'll see where the front pickup lands on the dry sump, subframe might get some hammah work. Its looking to drop right down between the subframe and the rack and be real close all around.

aidandj

iTrader: (5)

Damn. That sucks. Swap is going to be cool anyways, but dry sump only option makes it suck.

Decided on a turbo yet.

Leafy

iTrader: (1)

I mean dry sump doesnt make it suck that bad, its a real upgrade and uses an off the shelf cast dry sump pan. It'll still be cheaper than a K swap with a t5 (and wont result in having like 9 adapter plates bolted together to make that happen and doesnt rely on begin making parts), and still way cheaper than a ls swap. It does mean I have to do more work if I ever had intentions of turning this into a bolt and go setup, like including the options for pre-made oil lines.