Oil and water lines
05-31-2007, 02:48 PM
#1
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Oil and water lines
I've been doing research on these for a while and I've still got a few questions.
1. Inline restrictors? I assume ATP has them? .060" is the size I've heard for the T25.
2. Distribution block? Is it necessary? Can I just run the lines directly to the turbo from the thermostat and the oil plug in the side of the block?
3. What's everyone used for water lines? I know the oil line setup is -4AN feed, -10AN drain, braided SS w/ teflon cores. Can I just use standard high-temp heater hose with heat shields/sleeves, or should I man up and use braided SS for all 4 lines? What size am I looking for for the water lines? Different sizes for feed and drain, or is the same size fine?
4. As far as hooking up to the water lines, I just use tees, right?
1. Inline restrictors? I assume ATP has them? .060" is the size I've heard for the T25.
2. Distribution block? Is it necessary? Can I just run the lines directly to the turbo from the thermostat and the oil plug in the side of the block?
3. What's everyone used for water lines? I know the oil line setup is -4AN feed, -10AN drain, braided SS w/ teflon cores. Can I just use standard high-temp heater hose with heat shields/sleeves, or should I man up and use braided SS for all 4 lines? What size am I looking for for the water lines? Different sizes for feed and drain, or is the same size fine?
4. As far as hooking up to the water lines, I just use tees, right?
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05-31-2007, 02:54 PM
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1. Make sure your T25 needs a restrictor before you use one. Is it BB or sleeve bearing?
2. Distribution blocks are only "necessary" if you want to clean up the look of the routing of the lines.
3. Yes, just use standard, high-temp heater hose with sleeves. Just use whatever size diameter will fit the water pump inlet/outlet that you're taping into.
4. I'm not sure what you mean...there's a place just underneath and to the right of the water pump pulley where you "tap" into the coolant system. At least that's the way it's been done for the last 100 years on turbo'd Miatas (unless you're doing a coolant re-route or some other such funkiness). If you search, you'll find a picture that has been posted/referenced several times with arrows pointing to the outlets.
2. Distribution blocks are only "necessary" if you want to clean up the look of the routing of the lines.
3. Yes, just use standard, high-temp heater hose with sleeves. Just use whatever size diameter will fit the water pump inlet/outlet that you're taping into.
4. I'm not sure what you mean...there's a place just underneath and to the right of the water pump pulley where you "tap" into the coolant system. At least that's the way it's been done for the last 100 years on turbo'd Miatas (unless you're doing a coolant re-route or some other such funkiness). If you search, you'll find a picture that has been posted/referenced several times with arrows pointing to the outlets.
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05-31-2007, 03:26 PM
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I found Braineack's photo. It was confusing the first time. I see what you do now. You drop the entire line to turbo to line system in place of that one small hose. What size hose has everyone used for that setup? Should I be worried about starving the turbo of coolant with too small a hose?
The T25 is a sleeve bearing, I'm pretty sure. It's definitely not a BB.
The T25 is a sleeve bearing, I'm pretty sure. It's definitely not a BB.
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05-31-2007, 04:25 PM
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It's been too long since I installed the turbo...just bring a sample of the hose to your auto parts store.
If the T25 is a sleeve bearing turbo, I sure as hell wouldn't be running a restrictor on it unless specified by the manufacturer (or I was getting a lot of smoke). I was under the impression only the newer, ball-bearing cartridge Garretts were requiring restrictors.
If the T25 is a sleeve bearing turbo, I sure as hell wouldn't be running a restrictor on it unless specified by the manufacturer (or I was getting a lot of smoke). I was under the impression only the newer, ball-bearing cartridge Garretts were requiring restrictors.
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05-31-2007, 07:33 PM
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The coolant lines are 5/16", and you use the barbs from the t-stat housing to access the water. I would recommend using something very high temp for all the lines around the turbo, if you just use heater hose with barb fittings on the turbo, it will fail before too long. I suggest using the oil restrictor, because of the oil pressure our cars produce.
-Michael-
-Michael-
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06-01-2007, 10:56 AM
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I don't understand why people are just suggesting using restrictors for all turbos, sleeve or BB, across the board.
I have a sleeve bearing turbo that runs a -4AN line (.25"), no smoking. But I'm not running around say no turbo requires a restrictor.
I think the original poster (as well as the OP in the other thread currently asking about oil feed lines) needs to do more research on their specific turbo before jumping to conclusions.
I have a sleeve bearing turbo that runs a -4AN line (.25"), no smoking. But I'm not running around say no turbo requires a restrictor.
I think the original poster (as well as the OP in the other thread currently asking about oil feed lines) needs to do more research on their specific turbo before jumping to conclusions.
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06-01-2007, 03:08 PM
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Did you even read my post? I've done the research. No restrictor required for a -3AN line, but good luck finding a M10x1.25 to -3AN line. -4 is a lot more common, but it needs a restrictor. Some use .125, some use .060. Most of the posts I've seen say that sleeve bearing T25s like a .060 restrictor.
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06-01-2007, 03:35 PM
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http://www.summitracing.com
36" -3AN SS Line (EAR-63011736) $22
-3AN to 7/16-24 Inverted Flare Union Adapter (EAR-591932) $13
http://www.paragonperformance.com/ADPTRS7.html
m10 x 1.50 to -3AN Adapater Fitting (PP-2966) $17
-----
$52 plus shipping for oil supply
36" -3AN SS Line (EAR-63011736) $22
-3AN to 7/16-24 Inverted Flare Union Adapter (EAR-591932) $13
http://www.paragonperformance.com/ADPTRS7.html
m10 x 1.50 to -3AN Adapater Fitting (PP-2966) $17
-----
$52 plus shipping for oil supply
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06-01-2007, 06:09 PM
#11
anplumbing.com
591932 -3 AN 7/16-24 I.F. Steel Brake Adapter 2 per pkg for 10.99
or 1 for half that price. Just enter .5 in the item value box when ordering.
Just another option, wouldn't be worth paying the extra $9 shipping just for that part. I can't seem to find a M10x1.5 to -3AN fitting on their site though, might be worth a call.
591932 -3 AN 7/16-24 I.F. Steel Brake Adapter 2 per pkg for 10.99
or 1 for half that price. Just enter .5 in the item value box when ordering.
Just another option, wouldn't be worth paying the extra $9 shipping just for that part. I can't seem to find a M10x1.5 to -3AN fitting on their site though, might be worth a call.
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06-06-2007, 09:16 PM
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Bump to the top. Three questions:
1. Do I need a 36" oil feed? I'm going to tap into the galley plug next to the dipstick on my motor (early 1.8) so I'm thinking 3 feet may be overkill.
2. How long do I need for the drain line? -10AN, 18" or 20"?
3. For the coolant lines, my idea is to run standard 5/16" heater hose, but wrap it in some Thermotec sleeving and use the hose clamps to keep the sleeving in place. Should be a little less pricey than stainless steel and do just as good a job at keeping the rubber in decent condition.
1. Do I need a 36" oil feed? I'm going to tap into the galley plug next to the dipstick on my motor (early 1.8) so I'm thinking 3 feet may be overkill.
2. How long do I need for the drain line? -10AN, 18" or 20"?
3. For the coolant lines, my idea is to run standard 5/16" heater hose, but wrap it in some Thermotec sleeving and use the hose clamps to keep the sleeving in place. Should be a little less pricey than stainless steel and do just as good a job at keeping the rubber in decent condition.
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06-06-2007, 09:23 PM
#13
You won't need 36" for the oil feed. Use a piece of string and measure out the path you want the line to go or use a rag tape out of your moms sowing kit.
Buy two feet of drain line and cut it down to what you need, it comes in foot lengths anyway. My HKS line is now 18" i believe, the BEGI mani should be less than that I would think.
The thermotec idea sounds good to me. anplumbing does sell 1 ft lengths of stainless tubing for $5 i think if you wanted to get into that though.
Buy two feet of drain line and cut it down to what you need, it comes in foot lengths anyway. My HKS line is now 18" i believe, the BEGI mani should be less than that I would think.
The thermotec idea sounds good to me. anplumbing does sell 1 ft lengths of stainless tubing for $5 i think if you wanted to get into that though.
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06-06-2007, 09:47 PM
#15
No wonder I can never find this thread when I do a title search... I spelled restrictor wrong (MODS PLEASE FIX SPELLING IN THIS THREAD'S TITLE!):
https://www.miataturbo.net/forums/showthread.php?t=6116
That was my solution and a good discussion.
As for the feed line, how are you going to route it?
Mine currently comes out of the block w/a 90* fitting pointing forward and routes in front of the DP (under the turbine) and then up the fender side coming into the turbo from the side w/a 90* fitting at the CHRA.
The other ways are:
Straight up the dipstick and over the top.
Up the dipstick, back across the firewall, loop through the brake reservoir hardline and in from the fender side.
Check out the two engine pics in my vbGarage for the more common routing:
https://www.miataturbo.net/forums/vb...o=view&id=1012
Don't forget, -Xan braided lines don't bend very well. The way I have it now is as tight a bend as I'd recommend anybody go.
Drain hose is super cheap... I think I used about 8" total, but my drain flange is pretty long.
You should make friends with your local hydraulic supply store. Just look in the yellow pages under "hose, hydraulic, rubber".
In fact, HERE IS A SHOP YOU NEED TO GO VISIT: http://www.rbisj.com/
https://www.miataturbo.net/forums/showthread.php?t=6116
That was my solution and a good discussion.
As for the feed line, how are you going to route it?
Mine currently comes out of the block w/a 90* fitting pointing forward and routes in front of the DP (under the turbine) and then up the fender side coming into the turbo from the side w/a 90* fitting at the CHRA.
The other ways are:
Straight up the dipstick and over the top.
Up the dipstick, back across the firewall, loop through the brake reservoir hardline and in from the fender side.
Check out the two engine pics in my vbGarage for the more common routing:
https://www.miataturbo.net/forums/vb...o=view&id=1012
Don't forget, -Xan braided lines don't bend very well. The way I have it now is as tight a bend as I'd recommend anybody go.
Drain hose is super cheap... I think I used about 8" total, but my drain flange is pretty long.
You should make friends with your local hydraulic supply store. Just look in the yellow pages under "hose, hydraulic, rubber".
In fact, HERE IS A SHOP YOU NEED TO GO VISIT: http://www.rbisj.com/
Last edited by samnavy; 06-06-2007 at 10:03 PM.
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06-06-2007, 10:24 PM
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Sam, I'm going to go with a -10AN stainless line for the oil drain. I don't trust rubber hoses with oil that may get up to 250, 260 degrees. You only used 8" of line? I've commonly heard the 18-20" figure thrown around. What gives?
I haven't decided exactly how to run the oil line yet; hopefully my manifold and downpipe arrive on Friday so I can get them installed and measure and plan the exact routings. Then I can get all the fittings and crap ordered on Monday.
I haven't decided exactly how to run the oil line yet; hopefully my manifold and downpipe arrive on Friday so I can get them installed and measure and plan the exact routings. Then I can get all the fittings and crap ordered on Monday.
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06-06-2007, 11:43 PM
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Savington, braided stainless lines still are rubber on the inside...they're just wrapped in braided steel for some external heat resistance. They're not going to withstand internal temps any higher than high-temp synthetic rubber/silicon...~300°F.
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06-07-2007, 12:01 AM
#18
Sam, I'm going to go with a -10AN stainless line for the oil drain. I don't trust rubber hoses with oil that may get up to 250, 260 degrees. You only used 8" of line? I've commonly heard the 18-20" figure thrown around. What gives?
I haven't decided exactly how to run the oil line yet; hopefully my manifold and downpipe arrive on Friday so I can get them installed and measure and plan the exact routings. Then I can get all the fittings and crap ordered on Monday.
I haven't decided exactly how to run the oil line yet; hopefully my manifold and downpipe arrive on Friday so I can get them installed and measure and plan the exact routings. Then I can get all the fittings and crap ordered on Monday.
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06-07-2007, 10:53 AM
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Teflon's not going to be any better than rubber in that regard, right?
Why don't you find some braided stainless on some site that list material specs. Actually, I just looked at some on Summit's page and they show a max temp of 300°F, same as high-temp, synthetic rubber. I guess the braided might look a little nicer, so do what you want, I was just trying to let you know you shouldn't expect braided stainless to have a higher temp threshold than any other good oil drain hose.
Maybe McMaster has some higher-temp stuff?
Why don't you find some braided stainless on some site that list material specs. Actually, I just looked at some on Summit's page and they show a max temp of 300°F, same as high-temp, synthetic rubber. I guess the braided might look a little nicer, so do what you want, I was just trying to let you know you shouldn't expect braided stainless to have a higher temp threshold than any other good oil drain hose.
Maybe McMaster has some higher-temp stuff?
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