My own little DIY build thread, yay!
04-05-2007, 10:16 AM
#21
2 Props,3 Dildos,& 1 Cat
iTrader: (8)
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Fake Virginia
Posts: 19,338
Total Cats: 573
stock NB fuel system with 550s should be fine for just shy of 300 rwhp from what I understand....
and I hope you're getting the .64 A/R turbine on that tater.
and I hope you're getting the .64 A/R turbine on that tater.
Reply
0
0
04-05-2007, 10:29 AM
#22
Boost Czar
iTrader: (62)
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chantilly, VA
Posts: 79,493
Total Cats: 4,080
Yeah, speaking of different fueling demands....
The 255 lph is too much for the factory fpr in the NA, which runs 35 psi fuel pressure at idle. The NB runs static 60 psi fuel pressure, and is a totally different fueling system. It doesn't have the same return fpr that the NA does, and doesn't become overwhelmed.
If I had an NB and needed a pump, I'd get what would give the most fuel at 60 psi, and that's the 255 lph.
The limited data shows that quantity, not pressure, is what's important in the NB to keep the rail fully pressurized.
The 255 lph is too much for the factory fpr in the NA, which runs 35 psi fuel pressure at idle. The NB runs static 60 psi fuel pressure, and is a totally different fueling system. It doesn't have the same return fpr that the NA does, and doesn't become overwhelmed.
If I had an NB and needed a pump, I'd get what would give the most fuel at 60 psi, and that's the 255 lph.
The limited data shows that quantity, not pressure, is what's important in the NB to keep the rail fully pressurized.
P90Puma, sorry for coming off so strongly, but I get into this debate a lot, I'm trying to stop a lot of the myths created by M.net members.
Rusman, sorry for this going off topic! Can't wait to see what you come up with, always loved the ride, sounds like an awesome plan.
Reply
0
0
04-05-2007, 10:30 AM
#23
I'm Miserable!
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Hamilton Ontario
Posts: 70
Total Cats: 0
WTF dude havent you read single post here.
We know how to do miatas. You might know DSM's but we are completely different. We didnt come with 400+ cc injectors from the factory and we dont weight a metric ton or more, so we rarely need more than 300 whp to show DSMs why they are not the best platform.
We know how to do miatas. You might know DSM's but we are completely different. We didnt come with 400+ cc injectors from the factory and we dont weight a metric ton or more, so we rarely need more than 300 whp to show DSMs why they are not the best platform.
300whp in a miata is a 11sec car at BEST. Last time I checked that is ******* slow when it is compared to a dsm.
Since when are miata's completely different, It's a ******* 4 cylinder.
Reply
0
0
04-05-2007, 10:33 AM
#24
I'm Miserable!
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Hamilton Ontario
Posts: 70
Total Cats: 0
I've still read a few 99-00 members that have had trouble with the 255. Although others (POPSTOY) who insist they absolutely needed it to maintain 60psi to redline. I dunno, but still, that's more than enough pump.
P90Puma, sorry for coming off so strongly, but I get into this debate a lot, I'm trying to stop a lot of the myths created by M.net members.
Rusman, sorry for this going off topic! Can't wait to see what you come up with, always loved the ride, sounds like an awesome plan.
P90Puma, sorry for coming off so strongly, but I get into this debate a lot, I'm trying to stop a lot of the myths created by M.net members.
Rusman, sorry for this going off topic! Can't wait to see what you come up with, always loved the ride, sounds like an awesome plan.
No worries, that's what forums are for. One person has an opinion, another person has another.
Whoever needs some info always has to look past the biases.
Reply
0
0
04-05-2007, 10:55 AM
#25
Elite Member
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Central California
Posts: 2,543
Total Cats: 4
Go ahead and show us up then if you know so much. Do a miata Right and put a big Turbo on it and tune for 400hp at 6k rpm and start spooling at 5.5k. On the other hand, that would basically ruin the whole point of the miata which is to be a road and track car that needs a broad range of power and not just massive top end for the strip.
Basically what I am saying is that there is a whole lot more to these cars than how fast they can go in a straight line, and if that is what matters to you then you got the wrong car.
Oh and by the way, have you ever ridden in an 11 second car? That is not exactly slow.
Basically what I am saying is that there is a whole lot more to these cars than how fast they can go in a straight line, and if that is what matters to you then you got the wrong car.
Oh and by the way, have you ever ridden in an 11 second car? That is not exactly slow.
Reply
0
0
04-05-2007, 11:56 AM
#28
cjernigan said
"The 255 over powers the stock regulator which creates all kinds of problems involving running rich."
P90Puma said
"People run out of fuel using the 190 switch to 255 and are fine."
P90Puma, you need to re-read until you understand the problem
About running the stock regulator with an adjustable, are well all on the same page here? You run the stock regulator with a rising rate but if you are adding a 1:1 adjustable using the stock is counterproductive. I don't think that we are all using the same nomenclature...
"The 255 over powers the stock regulator which creates all kinds of problems involving running rich."
P90Puma said
"People run out of fuel using the 190 switch to 255 and are fine."
P90Puma, you need to re-read until you understand the problem
About running the stock regulator with an adjustable, are well all on the same page here? You run the stock regulator with a rising rate but if you are adding a 1:1 adjustable using the stock is counterproductive. I don't think that we are all using the same nomenclature...
Reply
0
0
04-05-2007, 01:07 PM
#29
I'm Miserable!
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Hamilton Ontario
Posts: 70
Total Cats: 0
Go ahead and show us up then if you know so much. Do a miata Right and put a big Turbo on it and tune for 400hp at 6k rpm and start spooling at 5.5k. On the other hand, that would basically ruin the whole point of the miata which is to be a road and track car that needs a broad range of power and not just massive top end for the strip.
Basically what I am saying is that there is a whole lot more to these cars than how fast they can go in a straight line, and if that is what matters to you then you got the wrong car.
Oh and by the way, have you ever ridden in an 11 second car? That is not exactly slow.
Basically what I am saying is that there is a whole lot more to these cars than how fast they can go in a straight line, and if that is what matters to you then you got the wrong car.
Oh and by the way, have you ever ridden in an 11 second car? That is not exactly slow.
I am not going to put a big turbo on my miata, that is not why I bought the car. All I am saying is that I am surprised MORE people don't do it.
There is nothing wrong with 4krpm spool, you are staying in boost most of the time anyways.
I bought my miata for a trackday/daily driver car, not to drag race. All I am saying is that a miata could be at 500whp and be a better trackday car then one at 300whp.
I will probably not be keeping the miata for long after I graduate. I will build a seven.
Reply
0
0
04-05-2007, 01:16 PM
#31
I'm Miserable!
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Hamilton Ontario
Posts: 70
Total Cats: 0
cjernigan said
"The 255 over powers the stock regulator which creates all kinds of problems involving running rich."
P90Puma said
"People run out of fuel using the 190 switch to 255 and are fine."
P90Puma, you need to re-read until you understand the problem
About running the stock regulator with an adjustable, are well all on the same page here? You run the stock regulator with a rising rate but if you are adding a 1:1 adjustable using the stock is counterproductive. I don't think that we are all using the same nomenclature...
"The 255 over powers the stock regulator which creates all kinds of problems involving running rich."
P90Puma said
"People run out of fuel using the 190 switch to 255 and are fine."
P90Puma, you need to re-read until you understand the problem
About running the stock regulator with an adjustable, are well all on the same page here? You run the stock regulator with a rising rate but if you are adding a 1:1 adjustable using the stock is counterproductive. I don't think that we are all using the same nomenclature...
When I say AFPR I mean a 1:1 rising rate fuel pressure regulator that you set whatever base pressure you want.
Why would you run a stock damper in conjunction with this setup?
Reply
0
0
04-05-2007, 01:24 PM
#33
Using a 1:1, ditch the stock unit.
Using a X:1, keep stock.
That seem right?
That's how I've always understood it and how I have always installed them. I think people are just using different acronyms interchangeably.
Reply
0
0
04-05-2007, 01:25 PM
#34
Boost Czar
iTrader: (62)
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chantilly, VA
Posts: 79,493
Total Cats: 4,080
Cause it works, and you dont have to do anything, and have no worries of failure. The FMU plumbs into the return line and that's it. Then you dont need to spend extra $$$ to set the idle pressure, 0~hg. pressure, & boost rise, you only need to worry about boost rise. When the OEM FPR already does half the work. (35psi idle, 50psi at ~0hg.) This way when you are out of boost you still run exactly like stock.
Corky Bell, who wrote "maximum boost," helped develop the AFPR in the 70s and has been using it on his miata turbo kits since the early 90s. That's how he did it one his first miata turbo kits, and how he still does it.
Corky Bell, who wrote "maximum boost," helped develop the AFPR in the 70s and has been using it on his miata turbo kits since the early 90s. That's how he did it one his first miata turbo kits, and how he still does it.
Reply
0
0
04-05-2007, 01:41 PM
#36
I'm Miserable!
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Hamilton Ontario
Posts: 70
Total Cats: 0
Aeromotive
All disagree with you. They say it means adjustable.
A real AFPR does not need a stock damper/regulator.
Rising rate, I mean the fuel pressure rises at a 1:1 rate with boost. This is how the ENTIRE rest of the internet describes an RR AFPR, I guess on the miata forums this has a different meaning. Go to a supra forum, 240, dsm, whatever forum and say AFPR, 99% of the people will say adjustable, because that is what it means.
Reply
0
0
04-05-2007, 01:48 PM
#37
Boost Czar
iTrader: (62)
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chantilly, VA
Posts: 79,493
Total Cats: 4,080
Adjustable FPR, Aux. FPR, Super FMU, FMU, Rising Rate FPR, Multi-Role FPR....all the same damn thing.
FWIW, I believe Keith at Flyin' Miata coined Auxiliary Fuel Pressure Regulator, as people got confused with Fuel Managment Unit and the Link.
FWIW, I believe Keith at Flyin' Miata coined Auxiliary Fuel Pressure Regulator, as people got confused with Fuel Managment Unit and the Link.
Reply
0
0
04-05-2007, 01:50 PM
#38
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: WA
Posts: 504
Total Cats: 0
Wow, my thread went way off topic, but it's cool I don't mind.
It didn't really blow, it started smoking lately and one night, something started knocking in the head, didn't want to take my chances and decided to do a full rebuild.
I might not buy the RS turbo, does anyone know where I can get a new compressor wheel? If I find one I'll probably keep the turbo for now and maybe upgrade later.
I don't want/need a bigger turbo than that. Once you start going to 300+ numbers the $$ goes into 10k, if you count the new tranny, standalone, more head work, etc. I like the fast response of my turbo right now, I mostly use my car for drifting, I don't think I would like a much bigger turbo. But I still want some room to play with the RS which is good for about 350hp.
maybe I missed this in another thread but how did your engine blow?? Poor tuning, super high miles?
I might not buy the RS turbo, does anyone know where I can get a new compressor wheel? If I find one I'll probably keep the turbo for now and maybe upgrade later.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Hounos View Post
i wouldn't spend ~$1k on a turbo only slightly more capable than the one you have now. your 2560 would be just fine at 250whp.
Hence my comment about the disposable income. If I was going to spend 1k on a turbo, why not go for one alot better then what you have currently.
Originally Posted by Al Hounos View Post
i wouldn't spend ~$1k on a turbo only slightly more capable than the one you have now. your 2560 would be just fine at 250whp.
Hence my comment about the disposable income. If I was going to spend 1k on a turbo, why not go for one alot better then what you have currently.
Reply
0
0
04-05-2007, 02:00 PM
#40
The BEGI unit that most are refering to is both auxilery and adjustable, the 202X series.
http://www.bellengineering.net/Pages/products_FPR.html
"WE" all understand what is meant by AFPR here, you are the one that is having trouble with the terminology. We don't care what the DSM, Supra, 240or Yugo crowd thinks. Look at the banner, it says MIATAturbo.net.
Jay
http://www.bellengineering.net/Pages/products_FPR.html
"WE" all understand what is meant by AFPR here, you are the one that is having trouble with the terminology. We don't care what the DSM, Supra, 240or Yugo crowd thinks. Look at the banner, it says MIATAturbo.net.
Jay
AEM
Aeromotive
Google
All disagree with you. They say it means adjustable.
A real AFPR does not need a stock damper/regulator.
Rising rate, I mean the fuel pressure rises at a 1:1 rate with boost. This is how the ENTIRE rest of the internet describes an RR AFPR, I guess on the miata forums this has a different meaning. Go to a supra forum, 240, dsm, whatever forum and say AFPR, 99% of the people will say adjustable, because that is what it means.
Aeromotive
All disagree with you. They say it means adjustable.
A real AFPR does not need a stock damper/regulator.
Rising rate, I mean the fuel pressure rises at a 1:1 rate with boost. This is how the ENTIRE rest of the internet describes an RR AFPR, I guess on the miata forums this has a different meaning. Go to a supra forum, 240, dsm, whatever forum and say AFPR, 99% of the people will say adjustable, because that is what it means.
Reply
0
0
