Turbo build 1.6 or 1.8??
12-22-2009, 09:11 AM
#21
I love my 1.6 ...i think it revs quicker everything it lightweight & balanced . its making 289rwhp @ 17psi, but i could list what it doesnt have quicker than what it does... if i had to do it all again id still go 1.8 ,because the old saying is true...theres no replacement for displacement. if you start with a motor naturally making more horsepower it already has a head start when going supernatural.its not all ways higher ultimate power , but added displacement= quicker spool= a more aggressive powerband= female passengers cumming quickly upon swift acceleration! ++
Mor info plzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.
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12-22-2009, 09:45 AM
#22
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I think your point here is that with the extra power of the 1.8, you are going to be closer to having stock rod bendage and holed pistons, since they are effectively the same stock parts? Good point. But I was probably getting ~225whp on the right day when I twisted up the mbc on the B6, how close was I to failure?
My point is really more this: It's not a simple cheap swap like everyone makes it out to be if you add up the costs, especially if you have 1.6L components already. If you're going to bother swapping, you obviously want more power, so why would bother swapping in the lesser of the 1.8L components. Surely you can toss a cheap block in there, but you're talking a 3-4 hundred bucks for a motor and then the $100 swap kit in the least. And you're still left with a stock motor that people love to bend rods in at relatively low boost levels.
If you're looking for the best setup, yes, the 1.8L is the better platform by far, there is an overwhelming scientific consensus of this fact. But IMHO don't see the cost:benefit for power levels under 230-250rwhp a 1.6L can do it if setup properly, just not as well.
If you're going to build a motor, you'll be silly not to build the 1.8L as well, but just don't expect it to be "cheap" like everyone makes it out to be. What's a good '99 worth nowadays...$4-500?
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12-22-2009, 10:13 AM
#23
check my build thread for my receipts from the engine builder. It appears that I got a really good deal. Then 400 for my 99 head, 300, rods, 350 pistons and rings, 300 for 1.8 turbo mani, $350 invested in six speed (I hope it works), 550 injectors cleaned and flowed 130, donor motor for 600 (which included a FM swap kit, ACT xtreme pp and clutch), billet oil gear 100, begi thermostat reroute housing 100 (after shipping), still have to buy water lines, oil lines , fluids, miscellaneous
I will reuse my DP, try to sell my 1.6 FM manifold for close to what I paid for the 1.8 begi, sell my garrett 2554 and replace it with a china 2860 (keeps cost down)
Sure I'll recoup some of my costs by selling left over parts, but this was starting with a turboed 1.6 making 210 HP
I will reuse my DP, try to sell my 1.6 FM manifold for close to what I paid for the 1.8 begi, sell my garrett 2554 and replace it with a china 2860 (keeps cost down)
Sure I'll recoup some of my costs by selling left over parts, but this was starting with a turboed 1.6 making 210 HP
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12-23-2009, 12:18 AM
#24
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I have a '99, but the 1.6L is a much "nicer" motor. The '99 sounds thrashy and agricultural, where the 1.6 is a lot smoother and zippy, more like a 4A-GE. The 1.6 has some low-comp piston options at low, low OE prices, from the 323 GTX or an automatic Miata.
Miatas are great because they are really good for how much they cost. So keeping it cheap, simple and fun is smart. If you think you'll have the discipline to be satisfied with the simplicity, low cost, fun and good-enough performance of a moderate-effort 1.6L build, it's the way to go.
If you think you'll follow Savington and BBundy down the rabbit hole, definitely start by building the 1.8 you'll eventually want, mixing and matching blocks and heads as discussed above. Do pistons and rods the first time, so the stock ones don't take out the block, crank and head when they let go, forcing you to start all over.
Miatas are great because they are really good for how much they cost. So keeping it cheap, simple and fun is smart. If you think you'll have the discipline to be satisfied with the simplicity, low cost, fun and good-enough performance of a moderate-effort 1.6L build, it's the way to go.
If you think you'll follow Savington and BBundy down the rabbit hole, definitely start by building the 1.8 you'll eventually want, mixing and matching blocks and heads as discussed above. Do pistons and rods the first time, so the stock ones don't take out the block, crank and head when they let go, forcing you to start all over.
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12-23-2009, 09:55 AM
#25
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gt2860rs, Flyin miata manifold,intermediate & downpipe ,no *****( CATLESS)Flyin miata 2.5 dual exit exhaust. 8.5:1, 0.040Wiseco pistons, Belfab rods, Fidanza flywheel, Xtd 6 puck with a double fingered pressure plate, Supertech 1mm oversized valves, valvespings, 3angle valvejob, self porting, polishing on the exhaust side,Hondata heatshield intake gasket, Moss oversized fuelrail, 255 Walbro, dsm 2ndgen 450's, Aem rising-rate fuel pressure regulator, Godspeed intercooler(left over from the E-bay mistake) Begi intercooler piping & coolant re-route, last and certainly not least Megasquirt PnP & Tuning by Ed @Balanced Performance(Greatguys). 
****if your in Atlanta DO NOt go to MainStream Performance i have a 323gtx 7.8:1 piston & Two sets of melted wisecos that say why!*****https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/ima...ilies/vash.gif
****if your in Atlanta DO NOt go to MainStream Performance i have a 323gtx 7.8:1 piston & Two sets of melted wisecos that say why!*****https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/ima...ilies/vash.gif
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12-23-2009, 10:03 AM
#26
gt2860rs, Flyin miata manifold,intermediate & downpipe ,no *****( CATLESS)Flyin miata 2.5 dual exit exhaust. 8.5:1, 0.040Wiseco pistons, Belfab rods, Fidanza flywheel, Xtd 6 puck with a double fingered pressure plate, Supertech 1mm oversized valves, valvespings, 3angle valvejob, self porting, polishing on the exhaust side,Hondata heatshield intake gasket, Moss oversized fuelrail, 255 Walbro, dsm 2ndgen 450's, Aem rising-rate fuel pressure regulator, Godspeed intercooler(left over from the E-bay mistake) Begi intercooler piping & coolant re-route, last and certainly not least Megasquirt PnP & Tuning by Ed @Balanced Performance(Great guys). id start with a 
1.8 ****if your in Atlanta DO NOt go to MainStream Performance i have a 323gtx 7.8:1 piston & Two sets of melted wisecos that say why!*****https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/ima...ilies/vash.gif
id start with a 1.8 ****if your in Atlanta DO NOt go to MainStream Performance i have a 323gtx 7.8:1 piston & Two sets of melted wisecos that say why!*****https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/ima...ilies/vash.gifSigh I need head work.
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12-23-2009, 10:22 AM
#27
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truthfully i dont know what made what horsepower because i did multiple upgades during each build, but it dyno'ed @ 276rwhp before the 1mm valves @18psi. A bad tune melted the pistons, i rebuilt it 0.060 over, 1mm over-valves,and coolant re-route and it retuned at 289@17psi.... so it could be the little bump in displacement, the fact that it runs 30 degrees cooler@ 170, or the valves or a percentage of all the above...
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12-23-2009, 10:34 AM
#28
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Oh yeah i did notice going from standard bore to 0.040 to 0.060 it got to its peak hp a little quicker in the powerband eachtime
...so going back to the root question adding displacement is always an advantage if i had to do it again, id go from 1.6 to 1.8 first then modify .if anything it would be the same power, less effort.
...so going back to the root question adding displacement is always an advantage if i had to do it again, id go from 1.6 to 1.8 first then modify .if anything it would be the same power, less effort.
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12-23-2009, 12:36 PM
#32
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they rose in the same relation to eachother. something like a larger motor with better spool characteristics .it reached higher numbers in both with less psi & rpm .....i didnt mean it was peaking then falling @higher rpms...a mix up in context maybe
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