kenzo42

iTrader: (6)

I think when installing my crank seal, all the grease I applied to the inner lip got wiped off.

Should I redo it?

18psi

iTrader: (76)

grease? you don't even need grease there. you're talking about the main seals?

kenzo42

iTrader: (6)

Don't you need grease on the inner lip (pink circle)?
I believe there's a spring inside the seal and applies constant pressure circumferentially to the shaft. It needs a grease so it doesn't spin dry. Is this not right?

18psi

iTrader: (76)

it doesn't actually apply pressure onto the lip of the seal so there's a microscopic gap between the shaft and the seal.

I guess putting grease there is not a bad idea, but that is def not mandatory.

You'll never see grease on those things from the factory.

rleete

iTrader: (21)

And what, exactly does that do? Do you plan on taking it out and greasing it every couple hundred miles?

No grease is necessary except to facilitate installation.

kenzo42

iTrader: (6)

Quote from honda-tech:

Oil seals will machine a slight groove into the shaft it is sealing.
If you replace the seal and the oil still leaks, either the shaft needs to be machined(unlikely) or you can take the garter spring off the seal and tighten it to put a better clamp on the seal to shaft interface.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garter_spring

Of course this all means nothing if you put the seals on dry, that would cause the seal to burn if there was no lube.

18psi

iTrader: (76)

I don't hondatech bro. I'm not a bro.

Ive never put lube on seals and I've replaced more than I can quanitfy.

Just giving my opinion.

Find me an OEM bulletin that states that. I'll be impressed.

rleete

iTrader: (21)

Yeah, right. Silicone or synthetic rubber will machine a steel crankshaft.

Go ahead, pull the other one.

18psi

iTrader: (76)

I laughed at that too. but, it's from Honda tech, so.........not even a bit surprised

Leafy

iTrader: (1)

And for my next demonstration I will use a stick of butter to machine aluminum.

18psi

iTrader: (76)

I used my nipples to port my wastegate

kenzo42

iTrader: (6)

So how does a seal prevent leakage around a spinning shaft? You don't think the inward radial force of the garter spring can score the crank? Does it not hug the spinning shaft?

Serious question. I don't understand how a seal works.

18psi

iTrader: (76)

its not like there is some crazy amount of oil or pressure inside there that the seal has to hold back.

the seal simply prevents oil from sloshing out

if the seal was actually pressing against the shaft, it would get worn down/out in a matter of minutes

rleete

iTrader: (21)

Actually, I have seen a seal much too small forced onto a shaft wear through the inner ring, allowing the garter to score the shaft. That, however, was a one time deal, and caused by improper sizing.

The seal does "hug" the shaft, and that is how it seals. It just doesn't do it very tightly, and certainly won't mar the shaft at all in normal conditions. There are charts that I use to size the seals depending on how tight a seal I need vs. the friction/heat a tighter seal creates.

kenzo42

iTrader: (6)

After reading about this, I believe you guys are mistaken.

Google "groove crank seal" and you'll find pages and pages where this has happened. It appears Speedy Sleeve is a product that can remedy this...or just place it in deeper.

Horton

You guys are wrong. Seals wear shallow grooves into cam shafts and crank shafts all the time. Totally normal.

curly

iTrader: (25)

Yeah, that's actually no joke.

And the seals are oiled. If there was no oil behind it, you wouldn't need a seal. It's good practice to put a little oil on all surfaces and it'll stay lubricated until the motor makes it's own oil pressure.

18psi

iTrader: (76)

you're saying there's oil pressure on the seals? not sure if serious.

williams805

iTrader: (2)

I grease all cam crank seals on the inner lip during install. I also use permatex non hardening stuff on the outside, although never had a factory seal leak around the outside.

Oil vapor and splash takes care of lubrication after start up. Yes the seal touches the shaft. This is not Archimedes scroll days fellas. Yes I've personally seen seals wear groves in steel. I once ran an aluminum pulley (different application) in which the pulley made the contact with the seal. Lucky it was only a prototype pulley because the aluminum had a significant groove where the seal was riding after about 5k miles.

To answer the question, if there is some oil or grease on it, it's fine. You see some of these guys do nothing at all and have no ill effects. You are fine. Also, I've never been able to pull a crank seal without damaging so if you must redo it, buy a new seal.

Come to think of it, I've pulled seals out of the box that were pre greased.

kenzo42

iTrader: (6)

On my accord the balance shaft seal would pop out so Honda put a retainer to prevent that from happening bc oil pressure