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Old 05-13-2015, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by jko
Noob question here.

I'm on a stock powered 1.8 NA using OEM calipers and Napa 'spec miata' blank rotors with Carbotech XP10 pads front and rear. I keep having this brake 'issue' where after a 30 min session or two I will have a longer pedal, but little change in braking performance. The longer pedal will last for the rest of the day, but seems to mostly disappear over night, with maybe a few lingering effects the next day. I was always convinced it was boiling brake fluid, but whenever I bleed them there are little to no bubbles anywhere. I also switched from OEM brake lines to SS brake lines (thinking it was the rubber lines expanding) but there was little change in this behavior.

However, judging from your quote above, does this sound like a rotor issue more than a pad/fluid/brake line issue? Obviously I'm not too shocked judging from the quality of rotor I am using.
The NAPA blanks are actually pretty good. Probably not the issue. You're just fading the pads or cooking the fluid. If it's under 150whp, it's fluid not cooked pads. As mentioned before in this thread, fresh fluid is a big deal. We bleed after every weekend and if an we run an enduro Saturday, we bleed Saturday night. Completely change the fluid a few times a year. Use quality DOT 4 fluid like virtually every Miata specific vendor carries. Some are slightly better than others but all are vastly better than generic LAPS branded mystery juice. We have had excellent results with Motul RBF600 but there are several good choices.

When flushing the system, always start by draining the master and cleaning and grit or silt in the bottom of the reservoirs. We use IPA (Isopropyl Alcohol) then fill and begin bleeding.
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Old 05-13-2015, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted by OGRacing
I'm not thinking it's a rotor issue. a rotor issue will go away and come back during in between turns. if yours last over night i'm leaning towards fluid. i also think the heat is caused by the pad. i think your using too low of a tq compound, combined with some not so fantastic fluid. Lower tq pads have a tendency to get surrounding components hotter. the pads are in use longer vs. a high tq pad, and the heat has more time to leach into the caliper.

What pads are you using on the rear?
what fluid are you using?
Got it. I am using Carbotech XP10's both front and rear on NT01's. As for the not so fantastic fluid, you caught me there... I've just been using the Valvoline Dot3/4 fluid that you find at Autozone. Some local spec miata guys said they were using it fine so I figured I could use it too, and the lack of bubbles during my bleeds seemed to confirm that. I'm going to go back to the ATE brake fluid and give that a try.

Originally Posted by emilio700
The NAPA blanks are actually pretty good. Probably not the issue. You're just fading the pads or cooking the fluid. If it's under 150whp, it's fluid not cooked pads. As mentioned before in this thread, fresh fluid is a big deal. We bleed after every weekend and if an we run an enduro Saturday, we bleed Saturday night. Completely change the fluid a few times a year. Use quality DOT 4 fluid like virtually every Miata specific vendor carries. Some are slightly better than others but all are vastly better than generic LAPS branded mystery juice. We have had excellent results with Motul RBF600 but there are several good choices.

When flushing the system, always start by draining the master and cleaning and grit or silt in the bottom of the reservoirs. We use IPA (Isopropyl Alcohol) then fill and begin bleeding.
Maybe it is the fluid then. As I mentioned above in this post, I have just been using the Valvoline Dot3/4 fluid due to some other spec miata guys experience... The lack of bubbles throws me off though, I do a bleed before/after each weekend and don't see anything unusual at all. A bleed for me usually means 2-3 master cylinders worth of fluid spread out throughout the 4 corners. I will try go back to the ATE stuff and do a full flush. I need to replace a front brake line (found some rubbing on the vinyl coating of my Supermiata brake lines so I just ordered a new set) so this is probably a good time to do the flush.
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Old 05-13-2015, 05:13 PM
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Originally Posted by jko
Got it. I am using Carbotech XP10's both front and rear on NT01's. As for the not so fantastic fluid, you caught me there... I've just been using the Valvoline Dot3/4 fluid that you find at Autozone. Some local spec miata guys said they were using it fine so I figured I could use it too, and the lack of bubbles during my bleeds seemed to confirm that. I'm going to go back to the ATE brake fluid and give that a try.
yea we can't use spec miata as a "what to use" for brakes. generally they use the other cars as brakes. bang into fenders n such. on your next set of pads try the pfc 11's. a bit higher tq should match the larger wheels your running. also when buying fluid i would advise to try something with less compress-ability then ATE. the motul 600 is cheap, you can try the PFC fluid. it has some extreme temperature before it boils.( nearly 600*) dry and it's compress-ability is better than CRF. if your dead set on ATE then we have that in stock as well.
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Hopefully so, but let's hope it's never necessary. Experiencing your safety gear in action is ... not optimal.
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Old 05-13-2015, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by ThePass
Ooh monoblock caliper..

11.8" diameter and almost 1" thick rotors.

But dat cost though - $3,000 USD
I see cross bolts on the PU calipers, so probably not monoblock.
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Old 05-14-2015, 06:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Leafy
I see cross bolts on the PU calipers, so probably not monoblock.
Those look like just small bridge bolts to me.

-Ryan
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Old 05-14-2015, 09:12 PM
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And to clarify, 949Racing uses the same awesome 11.75 rotors, tophats, and calipers that come from V8Roadsters. I really like mine and both vendors are great to deal with. Both offer the replacement rotors very inexpensively (~$35), and 949 also sells upgraded curved vane rotors if you desire.

The Trackspeed 11.75 kit is different and uses a different tophat and bracketry, from what I understand from their website and forum posts.
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Old 05-14-2015, 09:14 PM
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I thought the v8r kit used different hats. And uses dynapros? That needs to be checked though.
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Old 05-14-2015, 09:31 PM
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My V8R kit has the Dynalite and the same hats pictured on the 949 site. And the owner of V8R who is local to me told me personally that he supplies them for 949 Racing and that he thinks Emilio is a great guy.
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Old 05-14-2015, 09:36 PM
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Front Big Brake Kit - V8 Roadsters

Dynapro, custom hats that supposedly don't need spacers.
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Old 05-14-2015, 09:37 PM
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We use V8R brackets & hats. DL4's. I'm still not convinced the DP6 lug mount is a worthwhile upgrade. The little time I spent with them didn't reveal any significant difference in feel, pad life or fade resistance. On paper at least, the 6712 plate (DP6) should have something like 15% longer pad life over the 7112 plate (DL4).

By early 2016 we should have our own, much lower cost 11.0 and 11.75 hardware with matching rear bits. Not a high priority just now since the V8R stuff works. Busy getting the crossflows, billet coaxial perch shock mounts and a bunch of other new top sekrit widgets into production before the end of the year.
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Old 05-14-2015, 09:39 PM
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Looks like we were both right
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Old 05-15-2015, 02:53 AM
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V8R used the dynalite 4 (DL4) in the past, and that is the version 949 sells. V8R continued development and moved on to the dynapro 4 (DP4) lug mount, and most recently designed new brackets to switch to the DP4 radial mount. The DP4 and DL4 use the same pads (7112). 949 continues to sell V8R's DL4 kit.

Anyone with a DL4 kit can upgrade to a DP6 caliper as wilwood makes a lug mount version of that caliper with the same lug mount width/offset as the DL4, but like Emilio stated, real world benefits are questionable.

I would be interested to back-to-back a DL4 lug mount kit with a DP4 radial mount kit, since on paper both the caliper itself and the mount design should be more rigid, but doing a proper same day back to back is not very feasible.

-Ryan
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Old 05-15-2015, 12:40 PM
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If people are not seeing a big difference between the pro and light, which one is easier to rebuild?


Originally Posted by emilio700
We use V8R brackets & hats. DL4's. I'm still not convinced the DP6 lug mount is a worthwhile upgrade. The little time I spent with them didn't reveal any significant difference in feel, pad life or fade resistance. On paper at least, the 6712 plate (DP6) should have something like 15% longer pad life over the 7112 plate (DL4).

By early 2016 we should have our own, much lower cost 11.0 and 11.75 hardware with matching rear bits. Not a high priority just now since the V8R stuff works. Busy getting the crossflows, billet coaxial perch shock mounts and a bunch of other new top sekrit widgets into production before the end of the year.
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Old 05-15-2015, 01:06 PM
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Originally Posted by tazswing
If people are not seeing a big difference between the pro and light, which one is easier to rebuild?
Never rebuilt anything other than the DL4 and that's easy. I assume they are are about the same.
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Old 05-17-2015, 05:24 PM
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Would this big brake kit be a good buy?

Big brake build thread - don't try this at home... - ClubRoadster.net
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Old 05-17-2015, 06:26 PM
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Originally Posted by aidandj

Attached Thumbnails Anyone have any brake questions?-dbdad75465dbbdd6285efa80b2014d35bad8be41359c71f46b29ce68d7c65d05.jpg  
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Old 05-17-2015, 06:35 PM
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Originally Posted by aidandj
That really hurt
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Old 05-17-2015, 09:14 PM
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Originally Posted by aidandj
I read the thread.

I'm picturing the OP in my head.

He looks something like this:




17+ lbs for the rotor alone? El oh el.

Someone should ask him if he is planning to get his shocks revalved because he is gaining so much unsprung weight. And ask him how much slower he expects his 0-60 times will be with all of the additional rotational mass.
Attached Thumbnails Anyone have any brake questions?-chinese-crested-hairless-dog-large-msg-137969605281.jpg  
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Old 05-17-2015, 09:18 PM
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And they are camaro pieces, so I feel like pads and rotors would be even more expensive to replace.
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Old 05-17-2015, 10:25 PM
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Guys, you are forgetting that, whenever he has "raced", that he has also never lost a "match"
Dude is certified retard.
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