Anyone have any brake questions?
09-11-2015, 11:18 PM
#564
Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Purga, Queensland, Australia
Posts: 86
Total Cats: 10
Go back to basics.
1. Are you running OEM brake lines? Braided are better than OEM hoses as they expand less.
2. Fluid how old is it? Fluid absorbs moisture, water is bad in any hydraulic line, plus it lowers the boiling point of the fluid.
3. Did you machine the rotors before installing new pads? If the new pads are more 'aggressive' then not a big issue however if the installed compound is less aggressive then the new pad material may not take to the rotor.
I keep pads and rotors matched at home, this way if I change pad types I change the rotors as well. I have a set of rotors for the front for Winmax W5's and Winmax W6.5's and the rears are always Winmax W3's.
1. Are you running OEM brake lines? Braided are better than OEM hoses as they expand less.
2. Fluid how old is it? Fluid absorbs moisture, water is bad in any hydraulic line, plus it lowers the boiling point of the fluid.
3. Did you machine the rotors before installing new pads? If the new pads are more 'aggressive' then not a big issue however if the installed compound is less aggressive then the new pad material may not take to the rotor.
I keep pads and rotors matched at home, this way if I change pad types I change the rotors as well. I have a set of rotors for the front for Winmax W5's and Winmax W6.5's and the rears are always Winmax W3's.
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09-12-2015, 02:39 AM
#565
1. No. Goodridge SS lines
2. 1 day old amsoil 500 synthetic
3. no. new centric rotors
I took the car out for another drive... I had not changed anything since it was super spongy and didn't stop.
So for some reason the car stops well now. Not super awesome, but I have no idea what is going on.
The pedal still sinks a bit, then it's progressively firm as I push harder. I'll try bleeding some more. If this makes any difference, I can push the brake pedal more than a half inch before the brake lights go on. There is so much dead space... I'll look up how to adjust the pedal.
I'm still going to put XP8 pads on it, and change the fluid to ATE 600 or whatever the blue good stuff is.
2. 1 day old amsoil 500 synthetic
3. no. new centric rotors
I took the car out for another drive... I had not changed anything since it was super spongy and didn't stop.
So for some reason the car stops well now. Not super awesome, but I have no idea what is going on.
The pedal still sinks a bit, then it's progressively firm as I push harder. I'll try bleeding some more. If this makes any difference, I can push the brake pedal more than a half inch before the brake lights go on. There is so much dead space... I'll look up how to adjust the pedal.
I'm still going to put XP8 pads on it, and change the fluid to ATE 600 or whatever the blue good stuff is.
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09-12-2015, 05:33 PM
#568
So when I replaced the brake lines with the Goodridge SS kit, I did a bleed for each corner, cycling the ABS unit, having jumped two pins in the diagnostic area...
Oh, and I have that Motive pressuriser thing for a single person bleed. I only pump it to around 6-7psi, otherwise the fluid really squirts.
That was about 2 months ago.
When I did this brake job, I didn't cycle the abs unit, but I bled each corner, spending extra time on the corner where I replaced the caliper, tapping the caliper reservoir lightly with a small plastic mallet.
My final stop, while bedding the brakes, when I experienced fade, the pedal moved downwards maybe one inch, and the front brakes (i couldn't tell if the rears did this) emitted a grey puff of smoke. I didn't apply the brakes after that. Don't know if that means I boiled fluid at all... no leaks, I checked
Oh, and I have that Motive pressuriser thing for a single person bleed. I only pump it to around 6-7psi, otherwise the fluid really squirts.
That was about 2 months ago.
When I did this brake job, I didn't cycle the abs unit, but I bled each corner, spending extra time on the corner where I replaced the caliper, tapping the caliper reservoir lightly with a small plastic mallet.
My final stop, while bedding the brakes, when I experienced fade, the pedal moved downwards maybe one inch, and the front brakes (i couldn't tell if the rears did this) emitted a grey puff of smoke. I didn't apply the brakes after that. Don't know if that means I boiled fluid at all... no leaks, I checked
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09-14-2015, 09:55 AM
#569
So when I replaced the brake lines with the Goodridge SS kit, I did a bleed for each corner, cycling the ABS unit, having jumped two pins in the diagnostic area...
Oh, and I have that Motive pressuriser thing for a single person bleed. I only pump it to around 6-7psi, otherwise the fluid really squirts.
That was about 2 months ago.
When I did this brake job, I didn't cycle the abs unit, but I bled each corner, spending extra time on the corner where I replaced the caliper, tapping the caliper reservoir lightly with a small plastic mallet.
My final stop, while bedding the brakes, when I experienced fade, the pedal moved downwards maybe one inch, and the front brakes (i couldn't tell if the rears did this) emitted a grey puff of smoke. I didn't apply the brakes after that. Don't know if that means I boiled fluid at all... no leaks, I checked
Oh, and I have that Motive pressuriser thing for a single person bleed. I only pump it to around 6-7psi, otherwise the fluid really squirts.
That was about 2 months ago.
When I did this brake job, I didn't cycle the abs unit, but I bled each corner, spending extra time on the corner where I replaced the caliper, tapping the caliper reservoir lightly with a small plastic mallet.
My final stop, while bedding the brakes, when I experienced fade, the pedal moved downwards maybe one inch, and the front brakes (i couldn't tell if the rears did this) emitted a grey puff of smoke. I didn't apply the brakes after that. Don't know if that means I boiled fluid at all... no leaks, I checked
you might have some air in your abs unit. if all of that checks out i would ditch the carbos. you wouldn't be the first customer i've worked with that hated their street compound offering. if you don't care about dust and noise tryout the hawk street/race pad. (R) compound. they are basically a dtc-30 that start working at cold. they are noisy though but will be OK for track days.
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09-14-2015, 11:19 AM
#570
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I installed my TSE Gen2 11.75" BBK and M-Tuned rear BBK (sport rotors with non-sport 1.8 calipers spaced out) a few nights ago. I'm running Carbotech XP10 front and XP8 rear. It's 2400 lb (with driver), 225/45/15 Version 2 RS3 on 15x9's. I absolutely love the pedal feel. There's still the first 1/2" or so that is dead, just like every other passenger car I've driven, but after that it hits a brick wall and the pedal is much easier to modulate than the stock brakes. Is this first bit of dead pedal because of the booster? Or just compliance in the system?
My issue is that the input force for lock up is way way way too low. When the brakes are warm, I'd estimate a lock up force of around 25-30 lbs. I'm trying to weigh the differences between swapping a 1" master cylinder, or deleting the booster and swapping to a 3/4" master and increasing the pedal ratio. I really like the linear feel of a non-boosted system (I've driven FSAE cars for years) and I've never understood why there's only a few people on this forum that have deleted it. I also generally like high force inputs, so I'm not sure the ~25% increase in input force will be adequate from the 1" master.
Does anyone have experience with a similar setup, and deleting the booster?
My issue is that the input force for lock up is way way way too low. When the brakes are warm, I'd estimate a lock up force of around 25-30 lbs. I'm trying to weigh the differences between swapping a 1" master cylinder, or deleting the booster and swapping to a 3/4" master and increasing the pedal ratio. I really like the linear feel of a non-boosted system (I've driven FSAE cars for years) and I've never understood why there's only a few people on this forum that have deleted it. I also generally like high force inputs, so I'm not sure the ~25% increase in input force will be adequate from the 1" master.
Does anyone have experience with a similar setup, and deleting the booster?
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09-14-2015, 02:04 PM
#571
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Having driven a dozen or so cars on various BBKs with/without master cylinder upgrades, at this point I consider the 1" master a mandatory part of a BBK upgrade. It takes a "good" setup with decent feel and makes it "excellent".
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09-16-2015, 02:42 PM
#572
remember larger MC = More pedal pressure needed to equal same line pressure as a smaller MC.
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09-17-2015, 11:24 AM
#574
SADFab Destructive Testing Engineer
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<p>I've got one.</p><p>Read places that Hawk DTC-60's have the 3 hole backing plate. Even got a picture from a friend who had them. So I did some (not enough obviously research) and purchased these:</p><p>
</p><p>HB540G.490. Apparently these are a version of the DTC-60's that only have the center hole.</p><p>What part number am I looking for to get the 3 backing plate hole and are the ones I posted good to put in a dynalite?</p>
</p><p>HB540G.490. Apparently these are a version of the DTC-60's that only have the center hole.</p><p>What part number am I looking for to get the 3 backing plate hole and are the ones I posted good to put in a dynalite?</p>
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09-17-2015, 11:55 AM
#575
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09-17-2015, 12:31 PM
#577
yep
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09-29-2015, 11:53 AM
#579
going to bump this guy. getting a lot of questions floating around that we have already covered.
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10-07-2015, 07:41 AM
#580
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I got one for you,
I just picked up a new brake setup for the car
-- Willwood fronts (Bobcat) / Rear sport brakes (Carb 1521) / SS lines
Unfortunately the Fronts are only 11".. but I got everything for $450, so I impulse bought it like an idiot.
A lot of local "internet racing" discussion has been floating around about how the back end is going to come around and how I'm going to die braking into Turn 7 and 17 (Sebring). I've yet to track this setup.
The rears are pretty much the same size as the fronts, so I can see where they are coming from. However, I don't know if i'm convinced.
I did end up buying a prop-valve to adjust some of the force away from the back.
Should I be overly concerned about this? What proportioning would you recommend?
I just picked up a new brake setup for the car
-- Willwood fronts (Bobcat) / Rear sport brakes (Carb 1521) / SS lines
Unfortunately the Fronts are only 11".. but I got everything for $450, so I impulse bought it like an idiot.
A lot of local "internet racing" discussion has been floating around about how the back end is going to come around and how I'm going to die braking into Turn 7 and 17 (Sebring). I've yet to track this setup.
The rears are pretty much the same size as the fronts, so I can see where they are coming from. However, I don't know if i'm convinced.
I did end up buying a prop-valve to adjust some of the force away from the back.
Should I be overly concerned about this? What proportioning would you recommend?
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