miataturbo.net-like debauchery thread (about the ND or something) - Page 145 - Miata Turbo Forum -Boost cars, acquire cats.

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Old 09-27-2016, 10:53 PM   #2881
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chilicharger665 View Post
So, if you don't mind, I would like to throw out some of my thoughts on the suspension issue.

Is the toe steer immediately made worse by any lowering at all? You can't even drop it an inch before it goes whacky?
If so, how about running 15's and using their shorter profile to drop the car and not lower the ride height much, if at all? For instance, you run a 245/40/17 currently for track stuff. Running a 245/40/15 would make the car 2 inches lower and then the toe steer could be left in its happy zone. If this thinking deeply flawed? If the toe steer could be negated by not dropping the suspension height, would your ND Xidas be able to be revalved to take advantage of that and get the ride quality back?

I am sure the ride isn't that bad, but by how far did you miss your ride goals with the ND Xidas?
No, no, no ,no and no. Stop thinking so hard about it. I instantly regret ever mentioning it in reference to the S2000 rear toe steer in the other thread. can o worms and I deserve the wrath. My apologies.
Seriously, forget I said it.

Just buy an ND, throw whatever lowering stuff you like on there, add some toe in on the rear and go have fun.

Edit: If you put 15's on an ND I'll neg prop you every time you post from now on I swear.
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Old 09-28-2016, 09:10 AM   #2882
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Edit: If you put 15's on an ND I'll neg prop you every time you post from now on I swear.
So I should run 14's? Got it.
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Old 09-28-2016, 11:10 AM   #2883
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Originally Posted by emilio700 View Post
Edit: If you put 15's on an ND I'll neg prop you every time you post from now on I swear.
Even if I buy some 15x9 6UL's from you?

Thanks for all the explanation to someone who has enough money to buy things, but is not smart enough to do things right...
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Old 09-28-2016, 11:27 AM   #2884
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Just to add gas to the fire, the NC had toe out under droop IIRC which made it incredibly sketchy drive in high speed corners where the car gets unloaded. The ND's geometry change made this significantly more compliant.

Not doubting Emilio's ability, but the turnaround for the ND Xidas was extremely quick. I'm sure that given some time, we'll see a similar type of development (in terms of change, not the actual technology/engineering) that we saw between the first and second generations of the NA/NB Xidas. No one will argue that the Gen 1 is an inherently bad setup; it's just that the Gen 2s are that much better. The ND is a good car and the pointy-end race technology will only make it better over time.
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Old 09-28-2016, 11:53 AM   #2885
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No one will argue that the Gen 1 is an inherently bad setup; it's just that the Gen 2s are that much better.
this was more political if anything...
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Old 09-28-2016, 01:30 PM   #2886
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dunning Kruger Affect View Post
Just to add gas to the fire, the NC had toe out under droop IIRC which made it incredibly sketchy drive in high speed corners where the car gets unloaded. The ND's geometry change made this significantly more compliant.

Not doubting Emilio's ability, but the turnaround for the ND Xidas was extremely quick. I'm sure that given some time, we'll see a similar type of development (in terms of change, not the actual technology/engineering) that we saw between the first and second generations of the NA/NB Xidas. No one will argue that the Gen 1 is an inherently bad setup; it's just that the Gen 2s are that much better. The ND is a good car and the pointy-end race technology will only make it better over time.
We switched suppliers between G1 and G2 Xidas for the NA/NB. The ND's rear toe steer is only an issue when you have a lot of rear wheel travel mid corner, as you would with stock suspension. So static ride height is not an issue. The idea is to simply limit how much the ND can pitch during a turn to limit toe change. No amount of shock tuning will change toe steer. So all the supposition here that the current ND Xida is "not finished" is incorrect. They do no need additional development time. Recall, we had a car to begin work Q1/15 and didn't release the kit until Q1/16.

The car works as is, it just gives up a bit more ride quality than the NA/NB does with a Sport or Race setup. Don't overthink it.

Mazda may choose to tone down the rear steer over the next few years. That would require a new rear aluminum upright casting. If they do that, you can run your current ND Xidas a few clicks softer and run less toe in to take advantage. Simple.
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Old 09-28-2016, 01:35 PM   #2887
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The title of this thread briefly reverted to "miata.net-like discussion thread" due to a cache leak, or perhaps Russian spies. The bug appears to have been fixed.

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Old 09-28-2016, 03:01 PM   #2888
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emilio700 View Post
We switched suppliers between G1 and G2 Xidas for the NA/NB. The ND's rear toe steer is only an issue when you have a lot of rear wheel travel mid corner, as you would with stock suspension. So static ride height is not an issue. The idea is to simply limit how much the ND can pitch during a turn to limit toe change. No amount of shock tuning will change toe steer. So all the supposition here that the current ND Xida is "not finished" is incorrect. They do no need additional development time. Recall, we had a car to begin work Q1/15 and didn't release the kit until Q1/16.

The car works as is, it just gives up a bit more ride quality than the NA/NB does with a Sport or Race setup. Don't overthink it.

Mazda may choose to tone down the rear steer over the next few years. That would require a new rear aluminum upright casting. If they do that, you can run your current ND Xidas a few clicks softer and run less toe in to take advantage. Simple.
Good stuff. Didn't mean to cast some sort of doubt of THERE'S GONNA BE SOMETHING AROUND THE CORNER, but I was just recalling that the double digressive piston in a ~$2000 coilover was a bit of a game changer.

So when Mazda releases the new softer ND, do I get to brag like the SW20, AP1, and NSX guys about how hardcore I am?

e: real question, what FSB are you running? I'm thinking about picking up the Karcepts bar (lmao $575 for a sway bar) so I can continue my CS dominance locally.
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Old 09-28-2016, 03:24 PM   #2889
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Corksport 1.125 hollow front, 14mm autoexe rear.
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Old 09-29-2016, 12:23 AM   #2890
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Old 09-29-2016, 10:34 AM   #2891
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^^

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Old 09-29-2016, 11:54 AM   #2892
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Needs a NSFW tag.
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Old 10-03-2016, 10:51 AM   #2893
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Emilio,
Would love to know how much of a difference the rear diffuser makes. Data would be a plus but your opinion is appreciated
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Old 10-03-2016, 10:39 PM   #2894
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Goodwin and Emilio were both running the diffuser, from what I have seen. Hopefully it makes a noticeable difference! I so want to run a center exhaust with that thing, though.

I also just saw picture on FB of Jackson Racing's car. They have what appears to be an APR rear wing on it and a fairly large chin spoiler. I sure hope they are developing a Rotrex kit!!
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Old 10-03-2016, 10:49 PM   #2895
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Emilio,
Would love to know how much of a difference the rear diffuser makes. Data would be a plus but your opinion is appreciated
Tech data on Velox ND rear diffuser
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Old 10-04-2016, 10:40 AM   #2896
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Hopefully the guys will start developing more aero parts for the ND like they have with the Frisbee twins.
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Old 10-04-2016, 04:35 PM   #2897
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From the weekend. Will post more pics as we get them collected.





Picked up the first production sample of the DG hardtop on the way to Laguna Seca. In carbon fiber of course. New hotness molded and sealed rear window is a great touch.



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Old 10-04-2016, 04:46 PM   #2898
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That hardtop looks great! I know what the next purchase for my ND will be.....
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Old 10-04-2016, 04:57 PM   #2899
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Oh yeah, the ND thread. That's where I should have posted this...



I must say, I am smitten.
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Old 10-04-2016, 05:22 PM   #2900
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Beryllium 6ULs in the 17x9 variety.

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