miataturbo.net-like debauchery thread (about the ND or something) - Page 147 - Miata Turbo Forum -Boost cars, acquire cats.

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Old 10-07-2016, 02:04 AM   #2921
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And at 60-90 psi, how would an air bubble survive and resist being blown through into the crankcase?
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Old 10-07-2016, 12:43 PM   #2922
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Quote:
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And at 60-90 psi, how would an air bubble survive and resist being blown through into the crankcase?
Divers have air bubbles on their backs at over 3000 psi and it doesn't blow out...
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Old 10-07-2016, 01:03 PM   #2923
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Now, come on, that's not a valid analogy. I expect better from you. We're talking about a bubble in a free-flowing system where the fluid is coming in at 90psi. There's an in, and an out. Under those conditions I don't see how the upper rows of the radiator stay free of oil unless there's some sort of blockage. If there's no obstruction to flow, I don't see how the pocket of air survives instead of getting dragged out by the high pressure oil.

Unlike a statically pressurized tank of gas, which is experiencing no through flow, only release through a regulator.
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Old 10-07-2016, 02:22 PM   #2924
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Aside from the fact that he's referring to pressure rather than the velocity (flowrate) of oil, Mobuis' underlying argument is essentially valid. A large volume of oil passing through the system at a reasonably high velocity will tend to force air to flow in ways that it would not normally do in a static system under the force of gravity alone.

Consider the following thought-experiment: I have a large container of water, such as the Gulf of Mexico. I then blow a strong and uneven air current across the top of it, such as a hurricane. Do we expect the water to remain stationary? No, it will interact with the air, and some of it will be displaced into areas it would not normally go under the force of gravity alone, such as Tampa.

The same basic dynamic principles are at work inside an inverted oil cooler.
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Old 10-07-2016, 02:31 PM   #2925
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My point was that pressure isn't relevant. It only changes the size of the bubble.

But if we are talking flow, bubbles can absolutely cause blockages and obstructions. They cause problems all the time in cooling systems and fuel lines.

But let's idealize the situation. Imagine a sealed column of water with a bubble at the top. Then add an inlet and outlet to the bottom somewhere. The flow may disturb the bubble, but there's no guarantee it will flush it completely out. You'd have to have perfect flow distribution through your cooler to get that bubble out.

But of course it should be obvious that this is the case for the same reason ThePass can't get the oil out when it's fittings-up no matter how much air he blows into it.
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Old 10-07-2016, 03:34 PM   #2926
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If you want it to be able to drain and never have a problem holding air, mount it standing on end with the inlet at the bottom and the outlet at the top. Just thinking out loud.
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Old 10-07-2016, 03:40 PM   #2927
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BTW, for anyone that was wondering, the Beryllium finish on the 6ULs is pretty much a dead match to our Pearl Gunmetal Gray finish without being the same actual color code.
We use the PGG finish on all our brackets for various products (motor mounts, fire extinguishers kits etc..) and have done it on many roll bars as well, so if anyone looking for a match, that's a good one.

ND RZ finished in Pearl Gunmetal Gray

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Old 10-07-2016, 04:50 PM   #2928
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Joe Perez for the win
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Old 10-08-2016, 08:36 PM   #2929
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No, no, no ,no and no. Stop thinking so hard about it. I instantly regret ever mentioning it in reference to the S2000 rear toe steer in the other thread. can o worms and I deserve the wrath. My apologies.
Seriously, forget I said it.

Just buy an ND, throw whatever lowering stuff you like on there, add some toe in on the rear and go have fun.

Edit: If you put 15's on an ND I'll neg prop you every time you post from now on I swear.
Sorry to bring it back up, but I just found out a JDM company called Odula has toe control cancellation bushings already available. I have no idea how bushings would stop the toe from changing, but would they solve the issues you have seen and allow the better ride on the ND you have been looking for?
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Old 10-08-2016, 09:32 PM   #2930
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Isn't the issue due to the kinematics of the suspension, and not bushing softness?

Maybe the bushing has an offset or maybe off-axis thru-hole to correct the issue? I dont think anyone has mentioned the root cause or fix, but if the issue needs just a small correction to the kinematics, a bushing could work. I doubt it's a legit solution though
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Old 10-08-2016, 09:43 PM   #2931
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Your guess is as good as mine. I don't know anything about suspension design or how to cancel toe gain. Emilio does mention that the needed change is a small amount, so perhaps the bushings could be the small change needed.
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Old 10-08-2016, 10:24 PM   #2932
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dustin1824 View Post
Isn't the issue due to the kinematics of the suspension, and not bushing softness?

Maybe the bushing has an offset or maybe off-axis thru-hole to correct the issue? I don't think anyone has mentioned the root cause or fix, but if the issue needs just a small correction to the kinematics, a bushing could work. I doubt it's a legit solution though
This

The Odula bush just replaces a compliance bushing. We looked at it for quite a while. My original post explained that multiple links share the complex kinematic. Meaning you would have to either relocate multiple pick up points or replace the entire hub. It is not a traditional double wishbone that can have one pick up point relocated or on link adjusted in length. Doing so on the rear of the ND would bind it up. Even stock, it's binds a bit and distorts two of the bushings. I'm not even sure you could put bearings in with leaving one or two as compliance bushings to allow it to move.

But now that I have mentioned it, Chilicharger665 won't get any sleep until the icky toe steer is fixed once and forever
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Old 10-08-2016, 10:34 PM   #2933
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I get plenty of sleep. Excuse me for mentioning ND parts and possible solutions in the ND discussion thread.
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Old 10-09-2016, 12:00 AM   #2934
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I get plenty of sleep. Excuse me for mentioning ND parts and possible solutions in the ND discussion thread.
Just ribbing you. Having a little fun because you won't let go of it. We do that here.

Seriously though, I'm not sure any vendor is actually aware or will become aware of the toe steer curve nor recognize it as a problem nor understand how to fix it. IOW, If Supermiata doesn't do a billet rear upright, the ND rear toe steer will not likely ever be addressed. That is unless Mazda changes it the way Honda did with the S2K. We don't currently have plans for billet rear uprights BTW. Hopefully I'm wrong though, and some enterprising little group comes up with something.
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Old 10-09-2016, 12:20 AM   #2935
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I get the ribbing. I have already demonstrated I don't even know how radius and diameter work, so consider me hopeless when it comes to suspension issues.

I won't let it go, because I don't understand it and I wish I did.

Anyways, switching to the front, there seems to be a lack of front camber until you start lowering it quite a bit. Karcepts already has offset front bushings, but your very own Doward posted a topic yesterday about how great the ELBJ's work on the NA/NB chassis to get enough camber and allow a higher ride height. Can the ND benefit from the same concept? Those Karcept bushings looks like a PITA to install...
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Old 10-09-2016, 01:58 AM   #2936
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They are PITA, and crucial to getting the front end to work. We have two other ideas for camber adjustment up front but we needed something quick for MRLS.
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Old 10-09-2016, 11:36 AM   #2937
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Joe Perez for the win
I am the greatest thing which can possibly happen to any web forum. The loyalty of those who willingly supplicate to my majestic awesomeness is noted, and will in due course be rewarded.
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Old 10-10-2016, 10:48 AM   #2938
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Chili: What are you plans for the car? I'm just curious because there are only a handful of ND owners here that aren't involved in a shop of some sort.

I'm firmly in the camp of "I already made one Miata an undriveable mess on the street" and I don't even really like driving the ND on the 225 RE-71Rs on the street. I legitimately think that the car is more fun to drive on lower grip tires day to day just for the kinesthetic feel.
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Old 10-10-2016, 02:49 PM   #2939
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Originally Posted by Dunning Kruger Affect View Post
. I legitimately think that the car is more fun to drive on lower grip tires day to day just for the kinesthetic feel.
100% this.

It's just really hard to justify a second limited-use, 2 seat, convertible. :(
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Old 10-10-2016, 08:04 PM   #2940
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dunning Kruger Affect View Post
Chili: What are you plans for the car? I'm just curious because there are only a handful of ND owners here that aren't involved in a shop of some sort.

I'm firmly in the camp of "I already made one Miata an undriveable mess on the street" and I don't even really like driving the ND on the 225 RE-71Rs on the street. I legitimately think that the car is more fun to drive on lower grip tires day to day just for the kinesthetic feel.
Do you still have the other miata that is undriveable on the street? I have an 01 that the paint is complete **** on and would be perfect to make into a track car, but I will have to sell all my other cars and parts to afford a 2017 Club, so I will see if I end up doing that. My birthday is next February and that is when I would do it.

My plans were to make a do-it-all car, but now Emilio has me doubting that. I currently have a Sport, which would be perfect to put Moti's GT3 roll bar in, get Goodwins hardtop, and make it a great dual-duty car. However, I really, really miss not having XM radio, because I do TONS of traveling in the car. Which in NM means you are out in the middle of nowhere, with no cell or even FM signal. Plus, the stock Sport speakers are complete garbage. So I want to get a 2017 Club, basically just for the stereo, XM, and the LSD.

With all the suspension funkiness and Emilios attitude of just ignoring it and putting whatever lowering stuff I want on it, now I just want to put some FM springs on the Club's Bilsteins, get some 17x8 6UL's and run some 215/45/17's. Probably an RS3 or something that is sticky, but not cheater level sticky. That will give me slightly more width and slightly more sidewall, for better ride.

Then I will probably do a full exhaust, a rollbar, and some exterior things, like an Integral Kobe rear spoiler and the new Velox rear diffuser. I wanted to run the Openflash center exhaust, but Velox doesn't seem to want to make a version like that. Plus that muffler is going to just as heavy as the stock one and the rear bumper trim will add even more weight. I could run a Goodwin race muffler and the Velox rear diffuser and still lose weight. Plus, I miss the angry bees sound of my last NC. It had a loud Mazdaspeed muffler on it.

I wish I lived near a track, but I have to drive 5 hours to get to the nearest one, so it hasn't happened in nearly 3 years now, so all this track stuff is just in my head and theoretical.
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