Benchracing (turbo build ponderings)
11-02-2006, 12:40 PM
#21
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I like this guy
I'm at about 1400 in parts, but 1700 counting everything. And it's still on the stands.
Like you said, if efficiency is out the window that's good you can take your time and source the best deals. As far as boosting with lower octane plus water injection, my (wild) guess is that it'll work well. I don't see any problem in trying as long as you can monitor the situation. At least a couple of our members have quite a bit of knowledge when it comes to WI.
Getting this thing kicking *** for 2000 (or less?) = Fuggin sweet
I'm at about 1400 in parts, but 1700 counting everything. And it's still on the stands.
Like you said, if efficiency is out the window that's good you can take your time and source the best deals. As far as boosting with lower octane plus water injection, my (wild) guess is that it'll work well. I don't see any problem in trying as long as you can monitor the situation. At least a couple of our members have quite a bit of knowledge when it comes to WI.
Getting this thing kicking *** for 2000 (or less?) = Fuggin sweet
Last edited by UofACATS; 11-02-2006 at 01:00 PM.
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11-02-2006, 12:42 PM
#22
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If you know have experience welding you could buy all the components for a steel manifold and cut/weld them together. If you dont have any experience you can buy one that have been assembled. If you are interested in having one made let me know.
-Michael-
-Michael-
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11-02-2006, 02:23 PM
#23
I totally dig it too... but you'll have to up the budget. $2000 is what you should budget for here.
You simply can't imagine all the little $10 and $20 things that pop up that you'll need to buy. Just for example... what about an air filter. A K&N universal cone that will do justice to 250hp will run you $40... and the coupler to attach it to the intake... $10... and the clamp to hold it on... $5. it's little stuff like that which will chip away at your $$$.
Also, a clutch that will hold 250rwhp will run you $300-$400.
Put 87octane out of your mind. FORGET ABOUT IT! It's not worth the extra $1 per tankful to even consider it...
A good mechanical boost gauge is $50.
You simply can't imagine all the little $10 and $20 things that pop up that you'll need to buy. Just for example... what about an air filter. A K&N universal cone that will do justice to 250hp will run you $40... and the coupler to attach it to the intake... $10... and the clamp to hold it on... $5. it's little stuff like that which will chip away at your $$$.
Also, a clutch that will hold 250rwhp will run you $300-$400.
Put 87octane out of your mind. FORGET ABOUT IT! It's not worth the extra $1 per tankful to even consider it...
A good mechanical boost gauge is $50.
Last edited by samnavy; 11-02-2006 at 07:07 PM.
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11-02-2006, 05:03 PM
#24
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Talkin bout the 855? Nope, not a thing. I don't do front wheel drive 
Basic ricer upgrades can get you 300WHP, from what I understand, and that's pretty much the breaking point of the automatic. Check out www.volvospeed.com
Appreciate the comments re octane, gents. My BMW states 89 min, and with the chip it's supposed to be 91 min. Pah! I ran a tank of 91, compared that to a tank of 87, butt dyno showed no difference, got worse mileage per the OBC. No knocks or pings except on tip in at 500RPM. I ran my Volvo 242 at 15psi without WI on 87, never had a ping, and actually ran pretty decent timing. Raised a lot of eyebrows. That was 8.7:1, and 9.0:1 is pretty close in my book. In fact, when I saw that in the owner's manual, I chuckled just a little bit. Almost like they made this thing for boost.
And actually, isn't the BP originally a turbo motor, with squirters, etc, or is that just the B6?
Quite honestly, though, I'd be happy with even 7 or 10 PSI. 15 is a nice round number, after all, life begins at one bar (And continues at the next, har har har).
With 77K and crappy records, I'm assuming it's still got the OEM clutch. How much HP/TQ are they good for, and many miles do they usually last? Car spent some time in San Francisco, which probably didn't do the clutch any favors.
Interesting to get the pros and cons of the cast mani. I googled the HKS and found this. Not too bad. What do two weldels, two weldtees(?), a T25 or T3 flange, and the mani flange cost? Is there a place you can order the flanges, or would I just get that fabbed locally?
As far as the budget goes, I was talking to my bride and codriver, and she thought $2000. I said, well, I got about $1400. She said, "Yep, definitely $2000." But didn't bat an eyebrow, so I guess that means I've got carte blanche. (sp??) Money's not a real big issue, but I like to do things as inexpensively as possible (while still doing it right).
Totally off topic, but I figure I can threadjack my own post.... Just took my first drive in the rain. I'm still trippin on how much damned fun this car is. Why would a gutless car have a torsen except to get loose in the rain? 
Basic ricer upgrades can get you 300WHP, from what I understand, and that's pretty much the breaking point of the automatic. Check out www.volvospeed.comAppreciate the comments re octane, gents. My BMW states 89 min, and with the chip it's supposed to be 91 min. Pah! I ran a tank of 91, compared that to a tank of 87, butt dyno showed no difference, got worse mileage per the OBC. No knocks or pings except on tip in at 500RPM. I ran my Volvo 242 at 15psi without WI on 87, never had a ping, and actually ran pretty decent timing. Raised a lot of eyebrows. That was 8.7:1, and 9.0:1 is pretty close in my book. In fact, when I saw that in the owner's manual, I chuckled just a little bit. Almost like they made this thing for boost.
And actually, isn't the BP originally a turbo motor, with squirters, etc, or is that just the B6?
Quite honestly, though, I'd be happy with even 7 or 10 PSI. 15 is a nice round number, after all, life begins at one bar (And continues at the next, har har har).
With 77K and crappy records, I'm assuming it's still got the OEM clutch. How much HP/TQ are they good for, and many miles do they usually last? Car spent some time in San Francisco, which probably didn't do the clutch any favors.
Interesting to get the pros and cons of the cast mani. I googled the HKS and found this. Not too bad. What do two weldels, two weldtees(?), a T25 or T3 flange, and the mani flange cost? Is there a place you can order the flanges, or would I just get that fabbed locally?
As far as the budget goes, I was talking to my bride and codriver, and she thought $2000. I said, well, I got about $1400. She said, "Yep, definitely $2000." But didn't bat an eyebrow, so I guess that means I've got carte blanche. (sp??) Money's not a real big issue, but I like to do things as inexpensively as possible (while still doing it right).
Totally off topic, but I figure I can threadjack my own post.... Just took my first drive in the rain.
I'm still trippin on how much damned fun this car is. Why would a gutless car have a torsen except to get loose in the rain? The 1.8 motor was in fact a factory turbo motor.
As for the flanges, just grab the steel and cut them yourself... roughly $2 dollars is what I paid for my flanges from the steel yard.
Mark
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11-02-2006, 07:07 PM
#25
It might be totally possible with WI but i still dont like it. and i love WI! but you seem to know what your doing and its not like 5-6 minutes of detonation is gonna hole your motor if it works great if not i gues its time to refill with high test and add some octane booster and run out the 87. it's all good including the clutch and exhaust i had 2300 in mine, including the clutch, high flow cat, and exhaust. at 200dynojet whp and 8-9 psi previusly and now 12 13-15 soon hopefully. good luck
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11-02-2006, 07:14 PM
#26
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Don't let my use of big words (and too many of them at that) make you think I know what I'm doing.
I just have this fishy feeling that with another 100-150WHP that this could be the Best Car Ever.
If all it takes is $2000 and some wrench time, I'd be a fool not to do it.
I just have this fishy feeling that with another 100-150WHP that this could be the Best Car Ever.
If all it takes is $2000 and some wrench time, I'd be a fool not to do it.
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11-02-2006, 07:33 PM
#27
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If you call Rob at www.Flipsidecustoms.com we can set you up with the 1.8l flange that is already machined for the Schedual 40 weld els to built a manifold with. He should have a few on the shelf for both the 1.6 and the 1.8.
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11-02-2006, 09:36 PM
#30
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You recall well 
and score points for obscure knowledge. However, I started with a B21F (9.5:1) and turboed it (12 psi 42/48 t3) until low oil pressure killed the turbo and bottom end... replacement was a B230FT, 8.7:1, running 15psi on a 15G. Both, bwauahahah, ran 87 octane at all times.:gay:
What that taught me would take more space than I care to take, but the most important are:
1) research
2) do it right the first time with EMS and WB
3) don't assume your oil pressure is good just because the idiot light isn't on
and score points for obscure knowledge. However, I started with a B21F (9.5:1) and turboed it (12 psi 42/48 t3) until low oil pressure killed the turbo and bottom end... replacement was a B230FT, 8.7:1, running 15psi on a 15G. Both, bwauahahah, ran 87 octane at all times.:gay: What that taught me would take more space than I care to take, but the most important are:
1) research
2) do it right the first time with EMS and WB
3) don't assume your oil pressure is good just because the idiot light isn't on
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11-02-2006, 09:46 PM
#31
You recall well and score points for obscure knowledge. However, I started with a B21F (9.5:1) and turboed it (12 psi 42/48 t3) until low oil pressure killed the turbo and bottom end... replacement was a B230FT, 8.7:1, running 15psi on a 15G. Both, bwauahahah, ran 87 octane at all times.:gay:
What that taught me would take more space than I care to take, but the most important are:
1) research
2) do it right the first time with EMS and WB
3) don't assume your oil pressure is good just because the idiot light isn't on
and score points for obscure knowledge. However, I started with a B21F (9.5:1) and turboed it (12 psi 42/48 t3) until low oil pressure killed the turbo and bottom end... replacement was a B230FT, 8.7:1, running 15psi on a 15G. Both, bwauahahah, ran 87 octane at all times.:gay: What that taught me would take more space than I care to take, but the most important are:
1) research
2) do it right the first time with EMS and WB
3) don't assume your oil pressure is good just because the idiot light isn't on
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