Joe Perez

iTrader: (8)

^ This.


I spent my whole 20s (and much of my 30s) living entirely for myself. I waited until after I'd rounded the bend towards 40 to entertain any kind of serious relationship, and when I did so, it was with a woman my own age who has also entered functional adulthood and learned how to take life seriously. Honestly, it's not hard to distinguish the women from the girls, and I'm baffled as to why so few men males appear to even try to do so. The fact that I managed to score one who is still stunningly hot after two kids is merely a bonus.


In the six months we've been together, we have yet to have a single argument.

Has everything always gone well? Nope. Heck, when we were shopping for an apartment together there was so much **** that went wrong it was like a Steve Martin comedy.

Do we always agree on everything? Of course not; she's an outer-borough Puerto Rican and I'm a Cuban in Manhattan, so we can never see eye-to-eye on whether the rice goes in before or after the black beans or whether Queens and Brooklyn technically count as part of Long Island.

Am I sometimes frustrated by how long it takes to shop for a single pair of shoes (and the fact that after visiting fifteen stores we always wind up going back to the very first one)? Of course I am.

Is she sometimes frustrated by what she perceives as a lack of social decorum on my part, such as my inability to know whether a certain shirt matches a certain pair of pants in my closet or the fact that I still maintain that it's a waste of energy to wash the bathroom towels after only two uses? Of course she is.

Have there been tears on occasion? Yes there have.


But we're both mature adults who know how to resolve our differences in a constructive manner, and realize that when one of us builds up and supports the other, we both benefit. This is a partnership, not a competition. It's that understanding, and nothing more, which I perceive to be lacking in the vast majority of failed / unhappy relationships.

fooger03

iTrader: (2)

Yes, the breakdown has a lot to do with it. Relationship skills for both boys and girls are passed down from their father. Now, in anyone's experience, if children are being raised by a single parent, is it usually the mother or the father?

Ryan_G

iTrader: (8)

Fooger, your age is incredibly surprising to me. Your post was very interesting to me as well. Mainly because I am going through a similar behavioral transformation as to what you described but my own mental analysis of it and how I view woman seems to differ quite a bit. It is intriguing that we can arrive at almost the same types of behaviors with completely different outlooks and mental paths.

My predicament went something like this: place women on pedestal --> meet awesome woman --> get engaged --> engagement fails (we defined each other, she saw it and I didn't) --> self worth crushed --> realize I am an idiot and start living for myself --> confidence explodes --> opportunities explode --> success follows --> life is good

The funny part about it is that my ex-fiance and I ended it on great terms and have recently been connecting again but this time its much different. I don't put her on a pedestal. I am her rock as you put it but I don't live for her. We do not 'date' and we are not in a relationship. Its been going pretty well so far but I have no expectations of what it should be or what it will become. I think my big difference from your view is on how you view woman. It feels very 50's to me. My change had more to do with being my own individual and getting the most out of my life. If someone else wants to come along for the ride that would be ideal but I am not going to make them the center or my being. I think I am more aligned with how Joe views it but in the end I guess the outcome is really the same via external behavior.

TalkingPie

I work a job that surrounds me with women (and gay men), and therefore see a bit of what they say behind the scenes. One thing that I keep seeing is that women will go off on all kinds of crazy **** like believing that childcare should be paid for by the government, and that single mothers should be given more pay by the company to make life easier for them. They've become entitled and believe that society owes it to them to live independently, no matter what. Often, these women are not happy.

I regularly am told that I make remarks that are misogynistic (I'm really not; I just don't buy into bullshit), overly-sarcastic, or other female-code-words for "acting like a man." But despite this, I don't experience drama from them. At the end of the day, I think women respect someone who acts like a ******* man.

Similarly, they'll whine about "just wanting to find a nice guy," and then continue dating exciting, unreliable ********, despite the proliferation of nice, boring whipped guys. You could do much worse than ignoring at least 50% of what women say they want, because most of them don't really know what it is that will make them happy. Society has taught them that what they want biologically is wrong, and I think that that conflict causes all kinds of problems.

People talk about how bad it was before the 50s and 60s, and usually it's people who weren't even alive then. They assume that what's depicted in shows like Mad Men is historical fact for the majority of marriages, and I don't think that's true. My parents and their parents (who grew up in Switzerland) report different experiences, and that despite men being the "head of the household," how things were actually run at home was very much determined by the woman. My mother even said that in the days before women had the right to vote, her father would ask his wife who he should vote for before heading to the polls. A man being in charge who has regard and respect for the happiness of his wife and children seems like a pretty good recipe for harmony to me. It works a ****-ton better than women living independently trying to make ends meet raising their kids by themselves while ex-husbands live elsewhere paying child support to families who regard them as extraneous.

fooger03

iTrader: (2)

In theory, "nice guys" are nice. In practice, "nice guys" are stalkers.

To all the single men reading this post: If you think you're a "nice guy", there's probably a woman out there who thinks you're a "stalker". Think about it. Time for an attitude adjustment? The secret recipe is to attracting women is to do what Ryan does: ignore Women and win at your own life - once you've accomplished that, you'll need to barricade the door to keep the bitches out.

TalkingPie

My point is that women say they want a "nice guy" but then gravitate to someone who's an ******* because he's interesting. What I find pertinent is that women say they want the guy to be "enlightened"/emasculated because that's what society brings them up to believe (and what society teaches men they should be), but then they're actually attracted to something else.

The trick to succeeding at having a ***** is to be interesting and challenging like the stereotypical "*******," but actually be a decent human being at your core. So, yeah, like Ryan: win at life, keep your **** handled, and make them feel like they'd be lucky if you decided to make them a part of your life.

sixshooter

iTrader: (12)

That's a big part of the problem. And there is a two prong cause. The baby boomer generation was taught to be the most selfish generation in modern history. They don't need partnerships because that means they must share and do for others. It means they must give up some of what they want for the sake of others. They are the "me" generation.

Feminism tells women that caring for and nurturing the needs of others is subservient and old fashioned. Women are instead taught to compete for resources with men to be able to pursue their own wants and no one else's. Selfishness is idealized. Children are a burden to be avoided. But if you end up with them then dump them off quickly at daycare with a subservient minimum wage person and get back to your own life. Let minimum wage workers with no education and no love for your children teach them life values and morals. Let them teach your children security and love.

Now that everyone is a competitor for resources and you are both self absorbed you can have a wonderful life being married to someone who you cannot trust and have children who do not truly love you. George Orwell anyone?

nitrodann

I agree with most of what has been said, for me, the key was just going "you know what, **** it, Im going to focus on success in my life and work hard and respect myself.". And as others have said the rest seems to just come along with that.

Dann

2ndGearRubber

**** Bitches, Get Money. (This is the motto at our shop anytime we work late or build something that blows up).



I'm 24 now, seriously thinking about making 30 my "minimum". I would also like a woman.

Monk

iTrader: (3)

Relevant:

Davezorz

iTrader: (2)

I never knew what happiness was until I got married


now it is too late

Sparetire

If I live long enough, I will be greatly amused by the inevitable swinging of the pendulum away from our current ideals and back over to something similar to what would be considered 'backward' at the moment and more in keeping with what is being discussed here.

Of course, it wont be recognized as such, and there will be lots of clever little labels for everything to make it all seem new and different. And then it will go way too far.

One thing I have not seen mentioned so much in this thread is fatherhood. Without a drive for it, there's a lot less reason for marriage.

How the hell does one raise a child to be ethical, self-reliant, and happy? Once they start going to school you are there for a few hours a day with them max. They are influenced and saturated and molded by the world. I have no desire for fighting to avoid my boy becoming a whiny entitled comfort seeker with the functional intelligence of a cinderblock. I can handle my ****, handling others' is a whole different thing.

JasonC SBB

Ryan_G

iTrader: (8)

Fathers are role models by default for children, especially boys. They have a massive influence on their children's behavior, morals, and values for no other reason than the fact that children naturally look up to their parents. It doesn't take all the time in the world or constant supervision to raise a kid right. You just have to be sincere, consistent, and have open dialogue and communication. Parents are there to offer guidance and direction, not to handhold their child through life. Hell, you can be a great "father" to the kid down the street of you just show them that you care and offer them help when they need it.

Sparetire

Seen/Done that myself. Good point.

rwyatt365

^^^ This...

JasonC SBB

Why cats don't like feminism:
confused cats against feminism

y8s

iTrader: (8)

Sounds ilke everyone has their own experience and opinion. Who knew. Guess what, my experience doesn't fit in with any above explanation either.

Ryan_G

iTrader: (8)

Want to join the conversation with a different perspective?

z31maniac

We don't have kids and don't want them, happily married for 4 years and been together for approaching 8.

We continue to be more successful in our careers and grow as people.

Life just keeps getting better.

If you (general you) don't like being married, then get a divorce. But I suspect most are just talking **** while the SO isn't around.