I did something really stupid this week.
08-19-2008, 12:22 PM
#21
My buddy is a car broker. He just lost his shorts on a kickass '02 C5Z, silver on black, stock, $18,800. And it took him a month to get it. Car was **** and a blast to drive. So if you're looking for a Vette, take advantage of our **** economy, because they've been stepped on pretty hard.
But after I drove his car for a day, it was extremely fun but there were a few things I could not shake:
- It's huge. ******* huge. Still light as hell but way too long/wide. 2/3 scale would be nice.
- The shifter felt like absolute crap, as if I was stirring a pot of oatmeal with a wood spoon.
- Way too much attention. In a couple hours of driving, I had 3 people try to race. **** that. It's a pain.
- I can't get around the interior. It sucks. Seems like it was designed by a little kid with a set of crayons.
- I can honestly say the miata is of higher quality. Ironically, the vette just felt cheap by comparison.
But it is indeed fast. Almost too fast.
But after I drove his car for a day, it was extremely fun but there were a few things I could not shake:
- It's huge. ******* huge. Still light as hell but way too long/wide. 2/3 scale would be nice.
- The shifter felt like absolute crap, as if I was stirring a pot of oatmeal with a wood spoon.
- Way too much attention. In a couple hours of driving, I had 3 people try to race. **** that. It's a pain.
- I can't get around the interior. It sucks. Seems like it was designed by a little kid with a set of crayons.
- I can honestly say the miata is of higher quality. Ironically, the vette just felt cheap by comparison.
But it is indeed fast. Almost too fast.
The C-6 interior is far better than the C-5. People try to race me in my MSM, I ignore them for the most part. Shifter, aftermarket shifter are cheap and fixes that problem.
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08-19-2008, 12:38 PM
#22
Sav,
Tough to argue with your thinking. They are two completely different cars. One is small, light, cheap, reliable and fun. The other was built by the factory to be a track monster. You can dump a ton of money into the Miata and you might be competetive with a stock Z06.
It would be interesting to know if you had both cars for a while which one you would end up driving more. Miata's are great. Obviously they have a big following. They aren't the end all, be all of the automotive world though.
Tough to argue with your thinking. They are two completely different cars. One is small, light, cheap, reliable and fun. The other was built by the factory to be a track monster. You can dump a ton of money into the Miata and you might be competetive with a stock Z06.
It would be interesting to know if you had both cars for a while which one you would end up driving more. Miata's are great. Obviously they have a big following. They aren't the end all, be all of the automotive world though.
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08-19-2008, 04:12 PM
#25
Sav,
Tough to argue with your thinking. They are two completely different cars. One is small, light, cheap, reliable and fun. The other was built by the factory to be a track monster. You can dump a ton of money into the Miata and you might be competetive with a stock Z06.
It would be interesting to know if you had both cars for a while which one you would end up driving more. Miata's are great. Obviously they have a big following. They aren't the end all, be all of the automotive world though.
Tough to argue with your thinking. They are two completely different cars. One is small, light, cheap, reliable and fun. The other was built by the factory to be a track monster. You can dump a ton of money into the Miata and you might be competetive with a stock Z06.
It would be interesting to know if you had both cars for a while which one you would end up driving more. Miata's are great. Obviously they have a big following. They aren't the end all, be all of the automotive world though.
Last edited by msydnor; 08-19-2008 at 07:08 PM.
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08-20-2008, 01:48 PM
#33
Sav,
Driving in this morning I had a thought about this. Basically the issue is, without spending a ton on the Miata it's not going to be as fast as very high end cars can be.
OK, my Miata, which is set up a lot like yours, should be pretty competetive with an Elise. Not the 240 hp models but the base ones since my car is much much heavier (every option and no lightening). My car is likely faster than 98% of the cars driven on the road by the general public. At the track my car was maybe mid pack at my last HPDE event. That's pretty friggin good for a car that's got about 10K into it including buying the car. Can I hang with GT3's? Z06's? GTR's? etc? Hell no. Can I hang with or beat most S2000's, Bimmers, Boxsters, etc. Hell yeah.
It's all a matter of being affordable for the performance and what level of performance you are happy with. If you want a monster that'll beat up on 90% of what show's up at the track, the Zo6 is the car you'll need. Happy running mid pack? You've got the right car already. It's the difference of being pretty damn quick and being outrageous.
Driving in this morning I had a thought about this. Basically the issue is, without spending a ton on the Miata it's not going to be as fast as very high end cars can be.
OK, my Miata, which is set up a lot like yours, should be pretty competetive with an Elise. Not the 240 hp models but the base ones since my car is much much heavier (every option and no lightening). My car is likely faster than 98% of the cars driven on the road by the general public. At the track my car was maybe mid pack at my last HPDE event. That's pretty friggin good for a car that's got about 10K into it including buying the car. Can I hang with GT3's? Z06's? GTR's? etc? Hell no. Can I hang with or beat most S2000's, Bimmers, Boxsters, etc. Hell yeah.
It's all a matter of being affordable for the performance and what level of performance you are happy with. If you want a monster that'll beat up on 90% of what show's up at the track, the Zo6 is the car you'll need. Happy running mid pack? You've got the right car already. It's the difference of being pretty damn quick and being outrageous.
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08-20-2008, 09:15 PM
#37
I semi-agree with Chuckster.
The interior and overall build quality of the C5 feels cheap. Hell, the radio is the same one used in a Pontiac Sunfire for crying out loud. I know the car is a performer, but i like to have the complete package in a car. As for people trying to race.... ****, people RARELY try to race me around the Atlanta area... i wish more people would, it would give me something to laugh at.
I did have a track day at Talladega Grand Prix a couple months ago and there was a C5 Z06 there..... and i had little problem chasing him down. It was stock, but the driver was not.
The interior and overall build quality of the C5 feels cheap. Hell, the radio is the same one used in a Pontiac Sunfire for crying out loud. I know the car is a performer, but i like to have the complete package in a car. As for people trying to race.... ****, people RARELY try to race me around the Atlanta area... i wish more people would, it would give me something to laugh at.
I did have a track day at Talladega Grand Prix a couple months ago and there was a C5 Z06 there..... and i had little problem chasing him down. It was stock, but the driver was not.
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08-21-2008, 05:41 PM
#40
Edit: That little white toyota was ALSO pulling way on the viper. Perhaps the viper was relaxing, letting the vette pass or giving the white car some lead?
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Where is the thrill in racing someone in a bone stock car and beating them, at a stoplight? Freeway pull is the same thing. Yippie, I can stand on the long skinny pedal.
There's something to be said for just having something unexpected and low-key. If you're fast in a vette, well, you haven't really shocked anyone.
Now, a modded vette, obviously, you have to start with something that makes sense. The limits of what's "reasonable" in a miata truely is a moving target, progressing all the time as people get a better handle on what you can and can't do, and what are the accepted weak links.
Certainly the motor stops making sense at a certain point.
The frame is trickier. I *like* a small car myself. A car at all feels too big. I think a vette would **** me off, really, and it's way too nice to park 'just anywhere'. Convertible? Probably not in that league, I'd want the hard top.
I had no idea they were so cheap, though - that certainly is an eye opener. Something I could really look at. My sister is trying to sell a near-mint WS6 convertible, and the blue book is dropping monthly on it! Soon it'll only be worth a couple of hundred Euros.
Anyway, can't argue the logic - though for me it makes me look at motor swap more than it makes me look at new car. If I were to go that route, it would be hard not to look a turbo'd s2000 pretty hard. You hear numbers of 400-600 hp all the time in those, realistic I don't know - and people say they are twitchy and loose. But it should be more up to speed on handling the higher power.
Or an NC if you can put a real motor in it. :-P
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Where is the thrill in racing someone in a bone stock car and beating them, at a stoplight? Freeway pull is the same thing. Yippie, I can stand on the long skinny pedal.
There's something to be said for just having something unexpected and low-key. If you're fast in a vette, well, you haven't really shocked anyone.
Now, a modded vette, obviously, you have to start with something that makes sense. The limits of what's "reasonable" in a miata truely is a moving target, progressing all the time as people get a better handle on what you can and can't do, and what are the accepted weak links.
Certainly the motor stops making sense at a certain point.
The frame is trickier. I *like* a small car myself. A car at all feels too big. I think a vette would **** me off, really, and it's way too nice to park 'just anywhere'. Convertible? Probably not in that league, I'd want the hard top.
I had no idea they were so cheap, though - that certainly is an eye opener. Something I could really look at. My sister is trying to sell a near-mint WS6 convertible, and the blue book is dropping monthly on it! Soon it'll only be worth a couple of hundred Euros.
Anyway, can't argue the logic - though for me it makes me look at motor swap more than it makes me look at new car. If I were to go that route, it would be hard not to look a turbo'd s2000 pretty hard. You hear numbers of 400-600 hp all the time in those, realistic I don't know - and people say they are twitchy and loose. But it should be more up to speed on handling the higher power.
Or an NC if you can put a real motor in it. :-P
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