Interesting Intake Manifold Design
11-23-2009, 05:46 PM
#202
Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 89
Total Cats: 0
It will be something we have already fixtured up and to buy, however it is possible it will be a proprietary item for some other company to sell (it will still have my name on it though).
I can't lie, actual intake manifolds are still many moons away however ITB setups are much closer to reality at the moment
-James
I can't lie, actual intake manifolds are still many moons away however ITB setups are much closer to reality at the moment
-James
Reply
0
0
11-23-2009, 06:17 PM
#203
Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 89
Total Cats: 0
What slows us down the most is, depart from how much we would like to be, we are not a automotive ONLY shop. Right now nearly 75% of our income is coming from the oil industry due to sales being so low on our own product line (automotive parts). This ends up eating up obviously 75% of our time leaving us with very little time to actually develop new parts, instead what time we have left over is primarily spent on producing our already existing product line.
So short summary:
We are to busy working on other things that aren't even car related to get to anything soon at all at the moment.
So short summary:
We are to busy working on other things that aren't even car related to get to anything soon at all at the moment.
Reply
0
0
11-23-2009, 09:02 PM
#205
Reply
0
0
11-23-2009, 11:00 PM
#207
Elite Member
iTrader: (2)
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 8,682
Total Cats: 130
What slows us down the most is, depart from how much we would like to be, we are not a automotive ONLY shop. Right now nearly 75% of our income is coming from the oil industry due to sales being so low on our own product line (automotive parts). This ends up eating up obviously 75% of our time leaving us with very little time to actually develop new parts, instead what time we have left over is primarily spent on producing our already existing product line.
So short summary:
We are to busy working on other things that aren't even car related to get to anything soon at all at the moment.
So short summary:
We are to busy working on other things that aren't even car related to get to anything soon at all at the moment.
Reply
0
0
11-23-2009, 11:12 PM
#208
Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 89
Total Cats: 0
This includes even the Honda Intake manifolds.
The intake manifolds are a very new endeavor for us and thats why it is taking so much time to work out good designs, while being cost effective to reproduce. This is not just limited to our work on the Miata's, we have been working at this B Series Intake for close to 6 months now and it is just finally nearing its completion.
The intake manifolds are a very new endeavor for us and thats why it is taking so much time to work out good designs, while being cost effective to reproduce. This is not just limited to our work on the Miata's, we have been working at this B Series Intake for close to 6 months now and it is just finally nearing its completion.
Reply
0
0
11-23-2009, 11:34 PM
#214
Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 89
Total Cats: 0
This is an endurance race for us, not a sprint. We have to take everything in time. I wish that I was the owner of BMCRace and could make the things that I want to happen as fast as I wanted however I can't and all I can do is make suggestions to those who can.
BMC is owned by my father, whom is 50years old now. I just work here and help with design and do all the fabrication, however he is the machinist and without him to produce the parts I need it would take much longer.
If yall want a quick fix, I can order spun velocity stacks from velocity-of-sound, I can chop your head flanges off, sand blast them and regrind them. I can use my plasma cutter and cut out the plenum pieces and patch everything together, it will be no different than the manifold yall posted above. However if you want something more it will take time for Sam to produce the necessary parts for me to fabricate it.
For reference time, if I was to chop the head flange, and hand build everything it would take about 3 days per manifold. There would be zero waiting on the machinist....
If it would be better for me to provide this as a service rather than develop a new part for your community let me know, as obviously it would be a quicker route for yall...
-James
BMC is owned by my father, whom is 50years old now. I just work here and help with design and do all the fabrication, however he is the machinist and without him to produce the parts I need it would take much longer.
If yall want a quick fix, I can order spun velocity stacks from velocity-of-sound, I can chop your head flanges off, sand blast them and regrind them. I can use my plasma cutter and cut out the plenum pieces and patch everything together, it will be no different than the manifold yall posted above. However if you want something more it will take time for Sam to produce the necessary parts for me to fabricate it.
For reference time, if I was to chop the head flange, and hand build everything it would take about 3 days per manifold. There would be zero waiting on the machinist....
If it would be better for me to provide this as a service rather than develop a new part for your community let me know, as obviously it would be a quicker route for yall...
-James
Reply
0
0
11-24-2009, 03:24 AM
#216
Former Vendor
iTrader: (31)
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Sunnyvale, CA
Posts: 15,442
Total Cats: 2,099
Can Flipside show me a CAD drawing with CFD data that guarantees I'm not melting another $2500 shortblock due to starving number 1 or number 4? Nobody with an IM on the market today seems to be able to give me this guarantee. There is a whole lot more to making these things than sticking a set of stacks inside a plenum, slapping a throttle body on it, and calling it a day. You can very, very easily design a manifold that will create scrap metal of every motor you attach it to.
That's not to say Flipside's pieces are bad - they are well-made and I've never heard of anyone having a problem with one. My point is that if you haven't done the modeling and analysis, you have no idea what you're bolting to your motor. There was a thread about this a while ago, and it was clear that it's really, really easy to **** this up.
That's not to say Flipside's pieces are bad - they are well-made and I've never heard of anyone having a problem with one. My point is that if you haven't done the modeling and analysis, you have no idea what you're bolting to your motor. There was a thread about this a while ago, and it was clear that it's really, really easy to **** this up.
Reply
0
0
11-24-2009, 03:53 AM
#218
Elite Member
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 5,155
Total Cats: 406
Can Flipside show me a CAD drawing with CFD data that guarantees I'm not melting another $2500 shortblock due to starving number 1 or number 4? Nobody with an IM on the market today seems to be able to give me this guarantee. There is a whole lot more to making these things than sticking a set of stacks inside a plenum, slapping a throttle body on it, and calling it a day. You can very, very easily design a manifold that will create scrap metal of every motor you attach it to.
That's not to say Flipside's pieces are bad - they are well-made and I've never heard of anyone having a problem with one. My point is that if you haven't done the modeling and analysis, you have no idea what you're bolting to your motor. There was a thread about this a while ago, and it was clear that it's really, really easy to **** this up.
That's not to say Flipside's pieces are bad - they are well-made and I've never heard of anyone having a problem with one. My point is that if you haven't done the modeling and analysis, you have no idea what you're bolting to your motor. There was a thread about this a while ago, and it was clear that it's really, really easy to **** this up.
Thats why you just take an aftermarket Edelbrock or Skunk2 Honda B-series manifold (which has very similar port spacing to the BP), and put a BP flange on it.
Reply
0
0
11-24-2009, 11:50 AM
#219
Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 89
Total Cats: 0
For me to build an intake manifold from your original factory manifolds, I would have to charge $550 shipped back to you.
All the things I would do would be:
Cut off your factory head flange from the manifold, plane flat on our belt sander the weld surface, then sandblast to clean up and prep for weld.
150mmx45mm spun velocity stack Velocity Stacks
Had fabricated sheet plenum constructed from 1/8" wall 6061
New CNC Machined throttlebody flange (to recycle the original off the factory manifold would take as long as to machine a new one)
All items TIG welded, then flange surfaces planed flat a final time to insure proper sealing
Final Debur and Port Matching the velocity stacks to the head flange to massage out any minor imperfections
To keep the longest straight runner possible while not taking up to much room in the engine bay I will utilize a raised runner design (where the velocity stack is higher than the floor/base of the plenum)
All work should net 3-7 days eta from when I receive your manifold to when it ships back to you.
I would construct stencils and templates on my end to keep these easily repeatable...
As you may notice this is $150 less than my projected price for the manifolds we are already intending on bringing to the Miata scene, however this option is available as an immediate remedy for whomever might not want to wait for our developed product.
I could even offer polishing services for both the intake manifold and your fuel rails.
All the things I would do would be:
Cut off your factory head flange from the manifold, plane flat on our belt sander the weld surface, then sandblast to clean up and prep for weld.
150mmx45mm spun velocity stack Velocity Stacks
Had fabricated sheet plenum constructed from 1/8" wall 6061
New CNC Machined throttlebody flange (to recycle the original off the factory manifold would take as long as to machine a new one)
All items TIG welded, then flange surfaces planed flat a final time to insure proper sealing
Final Debur and Port Matching the velocity stacks to the head flange to massage out any minor imperfections
To keep the longest straight runner possible while not taking up to much room in the engine bay I will utilize a raised runner design (where the velocity stack is higher than the floor/base of the plenum)
All work should net 3-7 days eta from when I receive your manifold to when it ships back to you.
I would construct stencils and templates on my end to keep these easily repeatable...
As you may notice this is $150 less than my projected price for the manifolds we are already intending on bringing to the Miata scene, however this option is available as an immediate remedy for whomever might not want to wait for our developed product.
I could even offer polishing services for both the intake manifold and your fuel rails.
Reply
0
0
