Sensitive throttle pedal in non sporty cars? Blame the average driver
07-26-2013, 01:04 PM
#102
Go drive a 2.5L with avcs (anything after 05) and you'll have a completely different view.
And your mini is probably fun, and I'ma let you finish, but after that split second where you step on it, make 17psi lurch forward (probably just spin the tires and actually not even lurch forward) the subaru will blow its doors off.
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07-26-2013, 07:20 PM
#104
Boost Czar
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Pedal felt SO much better.
In stop and go there was no more hesitation on/off throttle and I swear I just picked up at least 50tq below 2.5K...
but beyond that, the power comes on in a more predictable manner in relation to the throttle position.
I gotta go back out and log a pull and see if there really is a difference in tq output.
I do find it funny that I added a **** ton a sensitivity to the throttle and it makes me happy.
In stop and go there was no more hesitation on/off throttle and I swear I just picked up at least 50tq below 2.5K...
but beyond that, the power comes on in a more predictable manner in relation to the throttle position.
I gotta go back out and log a pull and see if there really is a difference in tq output.
I do find it funny that I added a **** ton a sensitivity to the throttle and it makes me happy.
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07-29-2013, 12:09 AM
#105
Replace "subaru world" with just about anything and I agree with you 100%. Every time I buy a new vehicle, I search for owner's forums and I am utterly, utterly disappointed. Buy an Acura Integra and try to find a forum that isn't an absolute, absolute waste of the internetz.
mt.net is truly a gem in my experience.
I've been thinking about selling all of my stupid ch*t cars and buy a 2007+ BMW 335i but checking out the BMW forums is an exercise in serious self loathing...
mt.net is truly a gem in my experience.
I've been thinking about selling all of my stupid ch*t cars and buy a 2007+ BMW 335i but checking out the BMW forums is an exercise in serious self loathing...
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07-29-2013, 09:16 AM
#106
Comparing mt.net to nearly any other car forum is like comparing an NHRA sanctioned drag strip to downtown NYC at rush hour.
One gets pretty much to the point instantly, and doesn't put up with BS. The other is full of dead-ends that get you nowhere, beggars that want "fiddy cent" for "food", and hippies who HONESTLY THINK that "the man" is trying to keep them down, all while being gridlocked with such an overabundance of useless **** to wade through as to be a net waste of your life in the end.
Thank you MT, for never hesitating to take the garbage to the curb.
One gets pretty much to the point instantly, and doesn't put up with BS. The other is full of dead-ends that get you nowhere, beggars that want "fiddy cent" for "food", and hippies who HONESTLY THINK that "the man" is trying to keep them down, all while being gridlocked with such an overabundance of useless **** to wade through as to be a net waste of your life in the end.
Thank you MT, for never hesitating to take the garbage to the curb.
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07-29-2013, 09:38 AM
#107
Boost Czar
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I lowered my CL/OL delay too much if anyone cares. I had it at 100 (factory was 300 IIRC) and dropped it to 20; it KILLED my MPG. On a sustained 70mph for nearly 4 hours, the best I was getting was 23.4mpg, I should have been over 30mpg had I not changed it. I could feel the car going in and out of CL and dumping in fuel even when I was trying my damndest to keep the throttle as light and constant as possible.
I brought it back up to 75, tweaked the DBW map a little, then I go to work today in traffic and it instantly shoot my MPGs up by the time I get to work. Sad. But right now it still feels really good.
I brought it back up to 75, tweaked the DBW map a little, then I go to work today in traffic and it instantly shoot my MPGs up by the time I get to work. Sad. But right now it still feels really good.
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07-29-2013, 09:50 AM
#109
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I know you said that, but I figured it had more to do with accelerating, not cruising.
I drive like a grandma, especially when the wife is in the car.
Like I said, I could feel the car constantly going stoich and the then rich; bumping the delay back up seemed to help but its hard to sustain any speed in traffic, but the mear fact that the MPGs bumped up already tells me it helped a lot.
Makes me want to review my cruise fuel and AVCS maps. can of worms opened.
I drive like a grandma, especially when the wife is in the car.
Like I said, I could feel the car constantly going stoich and the then rich; bumping the delay back up seemed to help but its hard to sustain any speed in traffic, but the mear fact that the MPGs bumped up already tells me it helped a lot.
Makes me want to review my cruise fuel and AVCS maps. can of worms opened.
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07-29-2013, 10:01 AM
#111
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yeah, I figured I'd be okay in cruise areas. I need to read more theory on the intake cam position and cruise. Im sure there's zero information online about it because most people dont care about that **** like little douchey brain.
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07-29-2013, 10:06 AM
#112
If your goal is power, torque, or response you'll need teh dynoz.
If your goal is fuel economy I suppose you could probably improve it a bit. (wasting gallons upon gallons of fuel in the process I should add
)
My personal testing and experimentation with avcs on a few 06-07 STi's was very mixed and not very conclusive. On one (06) I was able to achieve insta-spool with some fairly aggressive cam advance down low. On the other (07) trying something similar the car flipped out and ran like crap, and even small increments of a few degrees at a time or moving the max or top of curve lower in the rev range made the car misfire and studder like crazy to the point I thought I borked something. Going back to the commonly used values in stg2 maps made all well again.
Then I messed with an 08 with the davcs and that thing was baller. Spooled a big ol journal bearing 20g like it was a vf series and made torqz for dayz
Good luck.
(this thread is so on topic its staggering
)
If your goal is fuel economy I suppose you could probably improve it a bit. (wasting gallons upon gallons of fuel in the process I should add
)My personal testing and experimentation with avcs on a few 06-07 STi's was very mixed and not very conclusive. On one (06) I was able to achieve insta-spool with some fairly aggressive cam advance down low. On the other (07) trying something similar the car flipped out and ran like crap, and even small increments of a few degrees at a time or moving the max or top of curve lower in the rev range made the car misfire and studder like crazy to the point I thought I borked something. Going back to the commonly used values in stg2 maps made all well again.
Then I messed with an 08 with the davcs and that thing was baller. Spooled a big ol journal bearing 20g like it was a vf series and made torqz for dayz
Good luck.
(this thread is so on topic its staggering
)
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07-29-2013, 10:21 AM
#113
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Considering there's cruise and non-cruise maps, I should be able to get a compromise between the both worlds. Like I shouldn't need all the cam advance in the 1.5-3K area on cruise maps, because I don't really need to spool the turbo up while driving a constant speed.
Before I made the last change to the maps, I've been able to hit 32mpg on the highway (it's possible I could have acheived more but the drive wasnt very long)...so I should be able to still do that while keeping all the low-end improvements.
but honestly, right now I feel like I picked up GOBs of torque below 2.5K which is awesome. I'm hitting the traction control on corners I would never before just due to all the extra low-end. It really transformed the car.
One of these days I might even datalog and actually figure things out... lol
We are still talking about DBW, so whatever.
Before I made the last change to the maps, I've been able to hit 32mpg on the highway (it's possible I could have acheived more but the drive wasnt very long)...so I should be able to still do that while keeping all the low-end improvements.
but honestly, right now I feel like I picked up GOBs of torque below 2.5K which is awesome. I'm hitting the traction control on corners I would never before just due to all the extra low-end. It really transformed the car.
One of these days I might even datalog and actually figure things out... lol
We are still talking about DBW, so whatever.
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07-29-2013, 12:04 PM
#115
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I changed like three different things 
I added tip-in enrichments, I shortened a closed loop to open loop decay timer, and I changed my DBW maps.
honestly, the biggest gripe I had was probably solved completely from the tip-in. But going back in and redoing the DBW maps to make the pedal more linear has been great. It feels much more like I'd expect from a throttle pedal. The car goes faster the more I press down in a linear fashion; before it was like nothing, nothing, nothing, LOAD!
Plus the DBW maps affect the timing and all sorts of different things so just reshaping the DBW mappings can result in a extra torque. I have gone back in and smoothed out the initial requested torque curve below 2K, it's still just a little twitchy, but at speed it feels much improved over the map I've been driving on the last 8 months or so now.
I added tip-in enrichments, I shortened a closed loop to open loop decay timer, and I changed my DBW maps.
honestly, the biggest gripe I had was probably solved completely from the tip-in. But going back in and redoing the DBW maps to make the pedal more linear has been great. It feels much more like I'd expect from a throttle pedal. The car goes faster the more I press down in a linear fashion; before it was like nothing, nothing, nothing, LOAD!
Plus the DBW maps affect the timing and all sorts of different things so just reshaping the DBW mappings can result in a extra torque. I have gone back in and smoothed out the initial requested torque curve below 2K, it's still just a little twitchy, but at speed it feels much improved over the map I've been driving on the last 8 months or so now.
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07-29-2013, 12:50 PM
#117
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look at the screenshots i posted of the three tunes.
the one OEM one, look at the spikes and valleys in the pedal position map.
the entire tune is like that: spark timing, intake cam position, fuel map, boost targets, etc.
here:
here's the factory timing map and AVCS (intake cam position):
the one OEM one, look at the spikes and valleys in the pedal position map.
the entire tune is like that: spark timing, intake cam position, fuel map, boost targets, etc.
here:
here's the factory timing map and AVCS (intake cam position):
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07-29-2013, 02:02 PM
#119
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nope, that's oem; i verified it against others.
the only difference between my map, when i purchased the car, and factory was the boost duty cycles table, since I have a different solenoid installed. But it was still targeting the factory boost levels.
the only difference between my map, when i purchased the car, and factory was the boost duty cycles table, since I have a different solenoid installed. But it was still targeting the factory boost levels.
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07-29-2013, 02:04 PM
#120
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That's an interesting question.
Apart from manually comparing every single table in ones' tune again a known-OEM set (presupposing that one even has access to a known-OEM set), is there some flag somewhere in the system, a sort of digital hymen if you will, that indicates whether or not some previous owner has already stuck their dick in the mashed potatoes?
Apart from manually comparing every single table in ones' tune again a known-OEM set (presupposing that one even has access to a known-OEM set), is there some flag somewhere in the system, a sort of digital hymen if you will, that indicates whether or not some previous owner has already stuck their dick in the mashed potatoes?
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