Critique my build thread
08-25-2008, 02:51 PM
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Critique my build thread
So I've been lurking for a long time now...I've read a lot. I've read Maximum Boost. I've read a LOT of the back posts. Not EVERYTHING, but a lot. If I've seriously overlooked something huge, by all means, flame away. Otherwise, help me out.
I've been putting together a cheap-*** turbo kit for the last couple of years, buying things when I found a good deal. I bought two other people's half-assed attempts, and other assorted little stuff when I found a good deal. I'm about ready to pull the trigger. Anyway, here's what I have. What I'm looking for feedback on is:
1)anything huge I've obviously overlooked
2)A few minor questions I have
3)help identifying a couple of “mystery parts”
4)Overall opinions on the whole shebang, and whether it'll do what I want
Anyway. My goal was to turbo the car for under $1000, keeping stock reliability, good drivability, and not having to replace ****/tinker every other week. I'm only looking for ~150whp with quick spool, which should mean around 10 PSI of boost. From what I've read, I think I'm on the right track. Give me your thoughts.
The Car:
92 w/ 1.6, mechanically stock, 63k miles, runs great. Currently VLSD, but I will be upgrading at some point to late-model ('97) rearend, with either Torsen or RX-7 Clutch LSD. Brakes and suspension are already taken care of. It sees 10000 miles of nice-weather street duty a year, and gets driven spiritedly. I might occasionally take it to the strip or autocross it. For the most part, though, it's a daily driver.
Stuff I already have: All of this was purchased used from other people, although a lot of it had never been installed on a car. So far, I have:
Turbo: Going with a used DSM 16g. It's in good shape, little end-to-end shaft play (just enough you can feel it). From what I can tell, this should work just fine, as rebuild kits are cheap, replacements are cheap and easy to find, and it's sized pretty well for a 1.6. Wastegate will be stock internal, I'll control boost with a grainger valve.
I initially had an IHI VJ14 off of a Probe/MX-6, but from what I can tell these have no aftermarket love (meaning making my own flanges) and I would be too laggy on a 1.6.
Manifold/DP: I have two options for the manifold. First is the typical Megan/OBX hunk of crap. The other is an unidentified log-type, looks a lot like a greddy but has provisions for an external WG and a T3 flange. I'm leaning towards the Megan because it already has the proper flange for the 16g. I know, it will probably crack. I'm going to brace the **** out of it and hope for the best. I'm also guessing I'll have to have the flanges machined flush?
As for downpipe, I've got a Megan/OBX piece there too. Proper flange and it looks good. I'm sure the shiny finish will bake off in a week. From what I can tell, this will probably work okay, though, right? Any horror stories I didn't find?
Intercooler: Have a “mystery” intercooler that I'm pretty sure was the OEM cooler on a DSM or maybe a Starquest. It's probably 9X9X3” and has had the tanks welded at some point, probably to reorient the outlet. Both inlet and outlet face the same way (towards the back of the car). I have plenty of used but still good silicone couplers, and a mystery crossover pipe that looks like it can be made to work just fine. I'll be using 2” mild-steel exhaust pipe for the rest of the piping.
Band-aids: Have a used Pierburg auxilliary fuel pump, a new Jackson racing (has a JR logo, anyway) AFPR, and an old Bipes (instructions are from Sebring Superchargers) that's supposedly good. Also have an RX-7 AFM that I haven't installed yet. I realize that if I wind up going the band-aid route I'll need an O2 clamp as well.
BOV: Have my choice between a blingy ebay piece and a mystery piece that's OEM from something. I'll get pictures up tonight, if any of you can ID it. I think it might be DSM. If the DSM one will work, it will be what I go with, and the eBay one will go back on eBay.
Injectors: I have two sets: one set of green top 315cc Supra Turbo injectors, and one set of 1.8 Miata injectors. I'll probably use the 1.8 injectors to start out, then go to the Supra injectors when I need to upgrade.
Clutch: I have a new six-puck “Stage 3” eBay clutch. I seriously doubt it will hold the 300 hp it's advertised to, but I would think it'll hold up alright at 150-200hp. The only thing that worries me is the potential to lose a foot if this thing grenades due to shitty quality control wherever the hell it was made. Does anyone have any seriously bad experiences with these clutches?
Still need:
Exhaust: Going to make my own. I'm going to use 3” mild steel, get the mandrel bends and straight piping from Summit, with a 3” Catco Hi-flow cat and a Magnaflow muffler. Going to use the stocker as a pattern. Pretty sure I can get something that may not be pretty, but won't leak or be restrictive.
And, if I go the Band-Aid route, an O2 Clamp.
Plus all the assorted water/oil lines, miscellaneous nuts, bolts, clamps and hardware, and heat shielding.
Questions:
1)How will the idle/driveability/fuel economy be with the band-aid setup? I really want to keep this thing pretty driveable, and I don't want to take more of a hit than I have to in fuel economy. I understand it probably won't be as smooth as stock, but how bad will it be? I'm thinking very hard about Megasquirt, either building my own or ordering one from Braineack. The benefits now outweight the costs later (although buying one and a wideband will definitely push me over the $1000 mark).
That's all I have for now. More to come later.
I've been putting together a cheap-*** turbo kit for the last couple of years, buying things when I found a good deal. I bought two other people's half-assed attempts, and other assorted little stuff when I found a good deal. I'm about ready to pull the trigger. Anyway, here's what I have. What I'm looking for feedback on is:
1)anything huge I've obviously overlooked
2)A few minor questions I have
3)help identifying a couple of “mystery parts”
4)Overall opinions on the whole shebang, and whether it'll do what I want
Anyway. My goal was to turbo the car for under $1000, keeping stock reliability, good drivability, and not having to replace ****/tinker every other week. I'm only looking for ~150whp with quick spool, which should mean around 10 PSI of boost. From what I've read, I think I'm on the right track. Give me your thoughts.
The Car:
92 w/ 1.6, mechanically stock, 63k miles, runs great. Currently VLSD, but I will be upgrading at some point to late-model ('97) rearend, with either Torsen or RX-7 Clutch LSD. Brakes and suspension are already taken care of. It sees 10000 miles of nice-weather street duty a year, and gets driven spiritedly. I might occasionally take it to the strip or autocross it. For the most part, though, it's a daily driver.
Stuff I already have: All of this was purchased used from other people, although a lot of it had never been installed on a car. So far, I have:
Turbo: Going with a used DSM 16g. It's in good shape, little end-to-end shaft play (just enough you can feel it). From what I can tell, this should work just fine, as rebuild kits are cheap, replacements are cheap and easy to find, and it's sized pretty well for a 1.6. Wastegate will be stock internal, I'll control boost with a grainger valve.
I initially had an IHI VJ14 off of a Probe/MX-6, but from what I can tell these have no aftermarket love (meaning making my own flanges) and I would be too laggy on a 1.6.
Manifold/DP: I have two options for the manifold. First is the typical Megan/OBX hunk of crap. The other is an unidentified log-type, looks a lot like a greddy but has provisions for an external WG and a T3 flange. I'm leaning towards the Megan because it already has the proper flange for the 16g. I know, it will probably crack. I'm going to brace the **** out of it and hope for the best. I'm also guessing I'll have to have the flanges machined flush?
As for downpipe, I've got a Megan/OBX piece there too. Proper flange and it looks good. I'm sure the shiny finish will bake off in a week. From what I can tell, this will probably work okay, though, right? Any horror stories I didn't find?
Intercooler: Have a “mystery” intercooler that I'm pretty sure was the OEM cooler on a DSM or maybe a Starquest. It's probably 9X9X3” and has had the tanks welded at some point, probably to reorient the outlet. Both inlet and outlet face the same way (towards the back of the car). I have plenty of used but still good silicone couplers, and a mystery crossover pipe that looks like it can be made to work just fine. I'll be using 2” mild-steel exhaust pipe for the rest of the piping.
Band-aids: Have a used Pierburg auxilliary fuel pump, a new Jackson racing (has a JR logo, anyway) AFPR, and an old Bipes (instructions are from Sebring Superchargers) that's supposedly good. Also have an RX-7 AFM that I haven't installed yet. I realize that if I wind up going the band-aid route I'll need an O2 clamp as well.
BOV: Have my choice between a blingy ebay piece and a mystery piece that's OEM from something. I'll get pictures up tonight, if any of you can ID it. I think it might be DSM. If the DSM one will work, it will be what I go with, and the eBay one will go back on eBay.
Injectors: I have two sets: one set of green top 315cc Supra Turbo injectors, and one set of 1.8 Miata injectors. I'll probably use the 1.8 injectors to start out, then go to the Supra injectors when I need to upgrade.
Clutch: I have a new six-puck “Stage 3” eBay clutch. I seriously doubt it will hold the 300 hp it's advertised to, but I would think it'll hold up alright at 150-200hp. The only thing that worries me is the potential to lose a foot if this thing grenades due to shitty quality control wherever the hell it was made. Does anyone have any seriously bad experiences with these clutches?
Still need:
Exhaust: Going to make my own. I'm going to use 3” mild steel, get the mandrel bends and straight piping from Summit, with a 3” Catco Hi-flow cat and a Magnaflow muffler. Going to use the stocker as a pattern. Pretty sure I can get something that may not be pretty, but won't leak or be restrictive.
And, if I go the Band-Aid route, an O2 Clamp.
Plus all the assorted water/oil lines, miscellaneous nuts, bolts, clamps and hardware, and heat shielding.
Questions:
1)How will the idle/driveability/fuel economy be with the band-aid setup? I really want to keep this thing pretty driveable, and I don't want to take more of a hit than I have to in fuel economy. I understand it probably won't be as smooth as stock, but how bad will it be? I'm thinking very hard about Megasquirt, either building my own or ordering one from Braineack. The benefits now outweight the costs later (although buying one and a wideband will definitely push me over the $1000 mark).
That's all I have for now. More to come later.
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08-25-2008, 03:04 PM
#3
You are where I was, performance and $ goals. Your last comment will probably come true and you will be where I am, which is WB and MS or other and moving the $ up from $1000 to $2000. Not a big deal, but once you convice yourself that you want good engine management, you will be relieved that you decided to spend the money and do it right the first time.
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08-31-2008, 07:08 PM
#8
If you have the money to do ms now. And if you are planning to go out the roof. I would do it.
But if your budget is running low and you only want 150 hp. Go ahead and get the thing together. You don't need anywhere near 10psi for 150 hp. Some people here have 200hp on 10 psi.
I have 2 miata's one with bandaids, and my toy with MS. Both are 1.6L's.
The bandaid miata gets 34mpg when I'm nice. And 28 mpg when I'm playing.
I'm running a FMU, old MSD boost retard, 1.6L injectors, and 6psi. And it is probably pushing 140 -150 hp. It is unbelivable how much more fun the Miata is. I love driving it and messing with other cars.
Since you already have the clutch and IC, I would throw in the 1.8l injectors and run 8psi. With your 3in exaust you should run well over 150 hp. And when you drive right, you will get good mpg.
I spent a long time waiting to turbo while saving for MS pnp, and I could of been having fun while saving.
My brother just wanted a fun car with no problems. He isn't planning on 200hp. He just wanted low boost with fun and reliability. He loves his with bandaids. BUT he ISN'T going to push the envelope with boost either.
But for my second car, I wanted 230 -250 hp and gas mileage. I knew I wanted management for it.
DON'T PUSH THE ENVELOPE with bandaids. I drove my car from Florida to Texas with no problems. If you use them correctly they are fine. It is when people try to push to much boost with them, that is when they lean out and blow.
If your ar going to want 200hp and gas mileage go ms.
I guess my point is to set the car up properly to the boost range and it's purpose.
"Bandaids work well and can get good power" " But if you want to Go Fast........ And get the Best HorsePower! Go management." Quote from Corkey Bell
That phrase caused me to buy the Ms for my going to be 12-14psi play car.
But if your budget is running low and you only want 150 hp. Go ahead and get the thing together. You don't need anywhere near 10psi for 150 hp. Some people here have 200hp on 10 psi.
I have 2 miata's one with bandaids, and my toy with MS. Both are 1.6L's.
The bandaid miata gets 34mpg when I'm nice. And 28 mpg when I'm playing.
I'm running a FMU, old MSD boost retard, 1.6L injectors, and 6psi. And it is probably pushing 140 -150 hp. It is unbelivable how much more fun the Miata is. I love driving it and messing with other cars.
Since you already have the clutch and IC, I would throw in the 1.8l injectors and run 8psi. With your 3in exaust you should run well over 150 hp. And when you drive right, you will get good mpg.
I spent a long time waiting to turbo while saving for MS pnp, and I could of been having fun while saving.
My brother just wanted a fun car with no problems. He isn't planning on 200hp. He just wanted low boost with fun and reliability. He loves his with bandaids. BUT he ISN'T going to push the envelope with boost either.
But for my second car, I wanted 230 -250 hp and gas mileage. I knew I wanted management for it.
DON'T PUSH THE ENVELOPE with bandaids. I drove my car from Florida to Texas with no problems. If you use them correctly they are fine. It is when people try to push to much boost with them, that is when they lean out and blow.
If your ar going to want 200hp and gas mileage go ms.
I guess my point is to set the car up properly to the boost range and it's purpose.
"Bandaids work well and can get good power" " But if you want to Go Fast........ And get the Best HorsePower! Go management." Quote from Corkey Bell
That phrase caused me to buy the Ms for my going to be 12-14psi play car.
Last edited by Toddcod; 08-31-2008 at 07:23 PM.
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