Flyin Miata Spark and Fuel Tables
07-04-2011, 08:29 PM
#1
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Flyin Miata Spark and Fuel Tables
I wanted to make sure that everyone knows that the Flyin Miata spark and fuel tables are for sale by Flyin Miata for $65. Talk to Jeremy. You will need to download the Hydra Nemesis software - for free - to view the maps and transfer the settings to your MS. For $65, it's worth it. Please see my story below:
Like many others before me, I thought $2k for the FMII injectors and Hydra Nemesis was a bit much so I bought the FMII hardware and decided to setup a DIYPNP for about $1k in savings. I got some great advice and the whole build went fairly well, but took about 4 months total. I bought a knocksense unit and lazily never configured it. I also never had the car tuned by a professional. Dumbly, I used the spark map that "everybody" was using and swears by on this forum. I tuned my AFRs to what I still believe to be very good values, but spark was not set to match. I got comfortable with my tune and turned the boost up from 7psi to 12psi and 100mi later - boom. Well, not quite. I saw black smoke pouring out of the exhaust at idle. The piston in cylinder number four was cracked so badly, it actually had 0psi of compression when I tested it! There was so much blowby, I had as much oil in my IC pipes as in the pan. The piston was almost cracked through on the outer wall, which would have spelled total failure in a few more miles. So, the point I want to make is this. Yes I saved a thousand dollars by going MS over Hydra, but I wouldn't do it again. Yes, it was nice to say I'd tuned the whole damn thing myself, but I wouldn't do it again. Yes, it was easy to think I didn't have any detonation issues with a "proven" spark map and a well-tuned fuel map, but I won't think that again. My recommendation - spend the extra $1k if you've got it for the Nemesis, even if you're a smart guy and really want to prove it. If you don't have the extra $$, take your car to a professional especially for spark tuning and run basic spark until you get there. It's worth the money. Use your knock sensor if you've got one - don't be lazy. Last, at least spend the $65 to check your spark (possibly fuel, depending on fuel equation) against the professional tune of Flyin Miata - especially if you've bought the FMII hardware or similar hardware. I'm spending the $1k I saved to rebuild my bottom end now and it's such a pain in the ***. While MS can be neat, and make you feel really smart, F it - I'll buy the whole damn setup next time. Don't be stupid like me the first time around.
Like many others before me, I thought $2k for the FMII injectors and Hydra Nemesis was a bit much so I bought the FMII hardware and decided to setup a DIYPNP for about $1k in savings. I got some great advice and the whole build went fairly well, but took about 4 months total. I bought a knocksense unit and lazily never configured it. I also never had the car tuned by a professional. Dumbly, I used the spark map that "everybody" was using and swears by on this forum. I tuned my AFRs to what I still believe to be very good values, but spark was not set to match. I got comfortable with my tune and turned the boost up from 7psi to 12psi and 100mi later - boom. Well, not quite. I saw black smoke pouring out of the exhaust at idle. The piston in cylinder number four was cracked so badly, it actually had 0psi of compression when I tested it! There was so much blowby, I had as much oil in my IC pipes as in the pan. The piston was almost cracked through on the outer wall, which would have spelled total failure in a few more miles. So, the point I want to make is this. Yes I saved a thousand dollars by going MS over Hydra, but I wouldn't do it again. Yes, it was nice to say I'd tuned the whole damn thing myself, but I wouldn't do it again. Yes, it was easy to think I didn't have any detonation issues with a "proven" spark map and a well-tuned fuel map, but I won't think that again. My recommendation - spend the extra $1k if you've got it for the Nemesis, even if you're a smart guy and really want to prove it. If you don't have the extra $$, take your car to a professional especially for spark tuning and run basic spark until you get there. It's worth the money. Use your knock sensor if you've got one - don't be lazy. Last, at least spend the $65 to check your spark (possibly fuel, depending on fuel equation) against the professional tune of Flyin Miata - especially if you've bought the FMII hardware or similar hardware. I'm spending the $1k I saved to rebuild my bottom end now and it's such a pain in the ***. While MS can be neat, and make you feel really smart, F it - I'll buy the whole damn setup next time. Don't be stupid like me the first time around.
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07-04-2011, 10:53 PM
#5
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......so, because you couldn't get a reliable tune for your MS, we should all suck it up and buy a $2k Hydra.
Right. Bullshit.
Tons of people here successfully run MS. It is a well known fact on this forum that you can't just throw a random spark map on your car and turn up the boost and expect good results.
I feel like I'm being trolled.
Lrn2tuning
Right. Bullshit.
Tons of people here successfully run MS. It is a well known fact on this forum that you can't just throw a random spark map on your car and turn up the boost and expect good results.
I feel like I'm being trolled.
Lrn2tuning
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07-04-2011, 11:08 PM
#9
I trust no one but me at this point with my tuning. MS/VEanalyze with my electronic detcans = win.
Why not post up this magic table??? Change a couple cells and it is no longer an FM map.
Why didn't you just run the free diyautotune base map?
Also, the magic map that "everyone" runs is typically used as a starting point for tuning.
Inexperience killed the motor.
If you don't know how to tune, you can still save 1k by running the above mentioned base map until you trust and understand what you or someone else is doing to your car.
Why not post up this magic table??? Change a couple cells and it is no longer an FM map.
Why didn't you just run the free diyautotune base map?
Also, the magic map that "everyone" runs is typically used as a starting point for tuning.
Inexperience killed the motor.
If you don't know how to tune, you can still save 1k by running the above mentioned base map until you trust and understand what you or someone else is doing to your car.
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07-05-2011, 01:24 AM
#11
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And the second time around too? Your failure was not that you bought a sub par ecu... it's that you loaded some random tune on it. And it sounds like you're doing *again*. You need to take it to a dyno and have it professionally tuned.
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07-05-2011, 09:52 AM
#15
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I don't blame them for selling the spark and fuel tables, making a really good table can take a little time. There are varying degrees of quality from "professional tuners". My first two tunes were done by professionals and the car bucked, shot fire, and ran so rich the WB rad full lean because it was sooooo rich. I balked at $1000 for a tune a few years ago, but I'm starting to realize that if the tuner is going to take the car for a few days, put it on the dyno for an hour, then road tune for a couple days, then it's probably worth the $1000. It takes a lot of time to make a car drive as well as mine and it's not something that can be done in 1-hour or even 4-hours on a dyno.
I've recently decided that I'm not going to tune for free anymore, if you need a tune and want me to do it, bring over a couple NT-01's in 225/45/15.
Your inability to follow simple instructions and tune the car doesn't make MS any less viable, it means you can't follow directions or didn't want to. You're still the guy who imported a spark table and didn't feel it out and save yourself a lot of money.
When I bought my MSpnp, I knew absolutely nothing, I'd never tried this kind of thing before. Sure, it took a few months, but I got it right, I've raced the car for years now and never had a problem. When it comes down to it you still have an email tune and don't know what you're missing.
I've recently decided that I'm not going to tune for free anymore, if you need a tune and want me to do it, bring over a couple NT-01's in 225/45/15.
Your inability to follow simple instructions and tune the car doesn't make MS any less viable, it means you can't follow directions or didn't want to. You're still the guy who imported a spark table and didn't feel it out and save yourself a lot of money.
When I bought my MSpnp, I knew absolutely nothing, I'd never tried this kind of thing before. Sure, it took a few months, but I got it right, I've raced the car for years now and never had a problem. When it comes down to it you still have an email tune and don't know what you're missing.
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07-05-2011, 10:13 AM
#19
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It reminds me of the guys I try to help out who can't follow the directions on grounding the LC-1.
"How is the LC-1 grounded?"
"The sensor ground is on the sheet metal, heater is on the block" or "both are tied together at the sensor, then one fat wire to the block, why does it matter?"
"Because it's not a light bulb, it's a precision instrument and Innovate made the wires long and wrote specific directions telling you to not do what you did".
"But it's all wires and it works just fine on my boost gauge!!!11oneone"
"How is the LC-1 grounded?"
"The sensor ground is on the sheet metal, heater is on the block" or "both are tied together at the sensor, then one fat wire to the block, why does it matter?"
"Because it's not a light bulb, it's a precision instrument and Innovate made the wires long and wrote specific directions telling you to not do what you did".
"But it's all wires and it works just fine on my boost gauge!!!11oneone"
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07-05-2011, 10:15 AM
#20
I'll take rear facing video so people can watch the engine parts and oil I leave on the road.
OP's post should have read:
"Don't be stupid like me. You read time and time again on mt.net to not run random spark tables without knowing what you are doing, and the setup of the car it cam from. I didn't listen, and this is what happened
........"
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