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Race Prep Miata race-only chat. 949 Racing - Rim & tires

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Old 03-12-2013, 02:23 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by b3d3g1 View Post
why not the 1.8 brakes? 1.6 calipers with 1.8 brackets and rotors.
Same +2pts as going all the way to the Trackspeed kit. If you change the bracket or rotor diameter, you take the points. My car is classed as a '90, so I have to go all the way back to stock calipers and stock rotor diameter to get the points back.
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Old 03-12-2013, 02:28 PM   #42
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Greenbaum allows you to class as a different model of the same platform as long as all the components that make it the other model will bolt to your tub and vice versa. Precedent was an FC RX7 turbo at nationals that was the n/a model with the turbo brakes and LSD, classed as the turbo. I did that at nationals with the MSM and promptly got 100lbs added to any MSM dyno class. (sorry!)

So any NB year can run Sport Brakes front and/or rear. Thus, classing and NA6 as an NA8 is OK. Someone could argue that a few of the studs welded to the bare tub are different but it's in the spirit of the rules so even at nationals no one will give you grief if your VIN doesn't match your PT form, provided it's on the same line or cross compatible as described above.
There seem to be some differences in opinion on this.
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Old 03-12-2013, 02:35 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by b3d3g1 View Post
There seem to be some differences in opinion on this.
I would certainly send an email to Greg explaining the situation. It's a waste of points classing a 1.6 PTF**. Tire size alone makes up the difference of going to PTE base class.

Of course with Andrew being on NASA's radar after pissing off the SoCal PTE RX-7 drivers, he might not want to re-class his car.
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Old 03-12-2013, 02:43 PM   #44
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There seem to be some differences in opinion on this.
If you're looking for reason in the NASA classification system, you won't find it. It's a secret formula that cannot be discussed but is totally equitable...just like the BCS.
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Old 03-12-2013, 02:43 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by Red_5 View Post
I would certainly send an email to Greg explaining the situation. It's a waste of points classing a 1.6 PTF**. Tire size alone makes up the difference of going to PTE base class.

Of course with Andrew being on NASA's radar after pissing off the SoCal PTE RX-7 drivers, he might not want to re-class his car.
I wouldn't waste the keystrokes.
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Old 03-12-2013, 03:00 PM   #46
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I would certainly send an email to Greg explaining the situation. It's a waste of points classing a 1.6 PTF**. Tire size alone makes up the difference of going to PTE base class.
+1. Classing PTF is a huge mistake, since the base tire for F is 215mm. You just end up with less power.

PTF** on 205s: 19 + 6 (F**) + 1 (215-205) = 26pts to spend
PTE on 205s = 19 + 7 (235-205) = 26pts to spend
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Old 03-12-2013, 03:03 PM   #47
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Of course with Andrew being on NASA's radar after pissing off the SoCal PTE RX-7 drivers, he might not want to re-class his car.
NA8s aren't given as favorable a power to weight ratio as NA6s. I could reclass as an NA8 and get the 1.8 brakes, but I have to take a weight penalty for the privilege.
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Old 03-12-2013, 03:08 PM   #48
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NA8s aren't given as favorable a power to weight ratio as NA6s. I could reclass as an NA8 and get the 1.8 brakes, but I have to take a weight penalty for the privilege.
ahhh, that's the part of the equation I didn't see. I think I'll still email Greg about reclassing as a NA8 so I have the option and to see what the weight penalty is.
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Old 03-12-2013, 03:32 PM   #49
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If you go that route, don't waste it on 1.8 brakes - switch to something lighter so you actually get some performance benefit out of it.
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Old 03-12-2013, 04:29 PM   #50
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edit: bad math..

Last edited by bellwilliam; 03-12-2013 at 04:42 PM.
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Old 03-12-2013, 04:38 PM   #51
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I wish we could grow a decent TTE class here in Texas, I'd sure as hell rather do that than SM.
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Old 03-12-2013, 04:41 PM   #52
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My **** on a TTE* base at 2490/145whp

Tire
+6 = 225 NT-01
Drive-train
+3 six speed
+3 LSD
Suspension
+3 Dampers
+2 Springs
+2 Sway bar
Brakes
+2 BBC
Aero
+3 bumper/air dam
Subtotal
=24 points
+7 for the *
Grant Total:
+39 points putting me in TTD.

Last edited by hustler; 03-12-2013 at 05:57 PM.
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Old 03-12-2013, 04:48 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by Efini~FC3S View Post
And then cheat like a mf'er because NASA will never tech you past dyno'ing you and weighing you after you come off the track.

Even at Nationals the PT tech is laughable.

I finished on the podium in PTB a few years ago, I was blown away by how little they checked. I was disappointed because my car was completely legal, I should have been cheated up...
I wouldn't exactly say that. example was Crusher.
just few weeks prior to National, Crusher was thoroughly combed over by Socal tech, sent to dyno, then have Traqmate installed in it for the later race (which it went faster).

of course it is possible to cheat after this regional race just prior to the runoff. but Greg already had an idea how fast Crusher is compared to others (some other socal that also won and podium the national). As long as Crusher did not suddenly go another couple of seconds faster, there is no need to go over it with find tooth comb....

Last edited by bellwilliam; 03-12-2013 at 05:06 PM.
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Old 03-12-2013, 04:50 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by hustler View Post
brakes
+2 bbc
?
Bbk?
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Old 03-12-2013, 04:52 PM   #55
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My **** on a TTE* base at 2490/145whp

Tire
+6 = 225 NT-01
Drive-train
+3 six speed
+3 LSD
Suspension
+3 Dampers
+2 Springs
+2 Sway bar
Brakes
+2 BBC
Aero
+3 bumper/air dam
Subtotal
=24 points
+7 for the *
Grant Total:
+31 points putting me in TTD.

if I were you, I would run 205 RR or Hoosier. NASA points system really penalize wider (as what's said on the side wall, not the actual width). or if you have enough hp, go to 225 Hoosier.

Last edited by hustler; 03-12-2013 at 05:57 PM. Reason: Math fail
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Old 03-12-2013, 04:58 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by Efini~FC3S View Post
And then cheat like a mf'er because NASA will never tech you past dyno'ing you and weighing you after you come off the track.
Go fast enough and they will spend plenty of time teching. I spent ~4hrs in tech at a regional race last year after outqualifying P2 by ~2sec. Weight, ~60 minutes on the dyno, and full engine bay and chassis inspection.
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Old 03-12-2013, 04:59 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bellwilliam View Post
if I were you, I would run 205 RR or Hoosier. NASA points system really penalize wider (as what's said on the side wall, not the actual width). or if you have enough hp, go to 225 Hoosier.
+1

NASA PT rules favor the R6 and the smallest size than you can get to work on any given car. Crusher on 205's with 170whp as an example.
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Old 03-12-2013, 05:00 PM   #58
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if I were you, I would run ??????????????. NASA points system really penalize wider (as what's said on the side wall, not the actual width). or if you have enough hp, go to 225 Hoosier.
I don't have money for 8" wheels and I can't afford $800-1000 in tires every other weekend.
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Old 03-12-2013, 05:01 PM   #59
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zOMG, SHUT UP ABOUT THE TIRE WIDTH!!!! I want to win.
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Old 03-12-2013, 05:10 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by hustler View Post
I don't have money for 8" wheels and I can't afford $800-1000 in tires every other weekend.
?? you run 205 and 225 Hoosier on your 9"
true that Hoosier heat cycles out too fast. that's why I will only use Hoosier selectively....
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