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Old 04-01-2014, 04:15 PM   #261
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NiklasFalk View Post
Wonder if the neutral switch alone would be suitable to do the same, making the stab at the clutch (switch) I do now unnecessary (MS flatshift).
That would have the opposite effect. Revs would rise instead of fall slightly.
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Old 04-01-2014, 04:17 PM   #262
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Originally Posted by emilio700 View Post
That would have the opposite effect. Revs would rise instead of fall slightly.
But for clutchless shifting on a dog box you dont care about the revs change all you need to do is relieve the loading of the dogs. Thats why if you pull on the stick while full throttle it really doesnt move but as soon as you lift it comes right out of one gear and into the next.
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Old 04-01-2014, 04:36 PM   #263
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Originally Posted by emilio700 View Post
That would have the opposite effect. Revs would rise instead of fall slightly.
using the switch(s) to cut spark of course.
My synchro box got a little upset when I one did a flatshift without the function turned on, the gear went in with a crunch (3-4 in a 5sp, full throttle and close to no clutch).

But if you cannot bang it out of gear without unloading, the neutral switch is useless, but the clutch switch can still be used.
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Old 04-01-2014, 04:40 PM   #264
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Originally Posted by TurboTim View Post
A while back I was talking to a dog box manufacturer. It was said for no-lift racing the simplest and quickest shift was a simple button to cut ignition. You preload slightly the shift ****, push the button and it'd slide into the gear. Quicker than wiggling the gas pedal to take the load off the dogs.

Along the same lines, when I went to the AEM's tuner school the instructor showed how he set up a load cell/strain gauge on the shift handle to trigger the Gen1 AEM EMS cut the ignition, for super fast dogbox shifts. That as trick.
Don't know how much faster you need to shift, up shifts with my current dog box are lightning fast and you don't have to worry about a switch failing. Not to mention all the new timing I have to learn pushing a button and then pulling the shift lever as I am drifting out of a corner and making that next up shift. Not to mention I am not running a car that took hundreds on thousands of dollars to make, for road racing, I will stay with lift and shift, however, for drag racing the nanoseconds saved could make an ignition cut for flat shifting worthwhile. Of course it's JMO.

Last edited by hingstonwm; 04-01-2014 at 08:17 PM.
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Old 04-01-2014, 04:40 PM   #265
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The right way to do it is super-gluing a 40 cent strain gauge to the shifter and setting it up properly with a voltage divider (made from 3 other 40 cent strain gauges glued to a flat plate) and connected to the ecu.
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Old 04-01-2014, 05:13 PM   #266
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The right way to do it is super-gluing a 40 cent strain gauge to the shifter and setting it up properly with a voltage divider (made from 3 other 40 cent strain gauges glued to a flat plate) and connected to the ecu.
This sounds genious. No idea how exactly this workd in practice but I am understanding the overall idea.
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Old 04-01-2014, 05:33 PM   #267
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Originally Posted by Ryan_G View Post
This sounds genious. No idea how exactly this workd in practice but I am understanding the overall idea.

It would work like this I assume

MTI Racing Six Shooter Sequential Transmission:




And I would buy at least 1, if not two if it were like this
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Old 04-01-2014, 05:43 PM   #268
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Originally Posted by Ryan_G View Post
This sounds genious. No idea how exactly this workd in practice but I am understanding the overall idea.
Basically the strain gauge changes resistance with tiny deflections in parts, even the tiny ones you get from pulling on the gear lever while its in gear. The voltage divider converts that resistance into a voltage that varies from 0-5v typically. When the ecu detects the voltage gets to a certain range it activate the NLS. AEM has this function built in, so does haltech, and I'm sure most others. There's a lot of really cool **** you can do with strain gauges.
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Old 04-01-2014, 06:33 PM   #269
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glade View Post
It would work like this I assume

MTI Racing Six Shooter Sequential Transmission:

And I would buy at least 1, if not two if it were like this
That is a PPG sequential. Shifter moves fore-aft only, no side to side H pattern. Our concept is an H pattern dog box.
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Old 04-01-2014, 06:48 PM   #270
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Originally Posted by emilio700 View Post
That is a PPG sequential. Shifter moves fore-aft only, no side to side H pattern. Our concept is an H pattern dog box.
My apologies, I was thinking that the rod attached to the shifter (to cut revs, or blip the throttle) would be better visualized with the video.
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Old 04-01-2014, 06:53 PM   #271
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Originally Posted by glade View Post
My apologies, I was thinking that the rod attached to the shifter (to cut revs, or blip the throttle) would be better visualized with the video.
ah. I like the idea of a strain gauge on the shifter that others posted. The lever won't move until the load on the gears is reduced sharply, but it will deflect by a few .000. The few times I drove a car with a dog box, it took a while to get accustomed to left foot braking. Once you get that down though, everything is faster and smoother.
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Old 04-01-2014, 07:53 PM   #272
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Here is a short video with shift from 2nd-4th
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Old 04-01-2014, 07:57 PM   #273
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Vid is private.
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Old 04-01-2014, 08:31 PM   #274
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sorry, fixed
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Old 04-02-2014, 10:20 AM   #275
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In.
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Old 04-03-2014, 03:22 PM   #276
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Im in too. so when can i have it? lol
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Old 04-04-2014, 04:59 AM   #277
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Old 04-04-2014, 10:38 AM   #278
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Sounds really interesting. Gotta say though that the noise of straight cut would be pretty awesome.
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Old 04-04-2014, 10:51 PM   #279
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Originally Posted by schmoo View Post
Sounds really interesting. Gotta say though that the noise of straight cut would be pretty awesome.
For a daily driver, not so much. My Quaife gearset (which is only semi-straight-cut) sounds like a supercharger in lower gears (cool!) but is downright annoying at highway speeds in top gear.
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Old 04-05-2014, 02:53 AM   #280
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My brain hurts!
In for results and people's thoughts though we seemed to have given up on throwing ideas around and instead of pulling the unicorn from our collective asses, we are looking to Emilio to pull one from his?
I have a semi truck and can drive it without a clutch so I feel the dog box would not be a problem to daily, but maybe I don't want to be the only one to drive my car on a long trip? At least for me, street manners matter.
I remember reading the Corky was working on a T5 conversion that wasn't suppose to weigh a ton more. Does anybody know what came of that? Even if he is slow to get it to market if that is a good option for the street car who is not looking to get every last bit out of it on the track like Sav, I will do the fab myself. Thoughts?
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