The Stewart Development Paradox - Where the heck are my shocks?
09-15-2011, 02:16 PM
#89
Been emailing with Bernie this morning. He says the shocks are shipping tomorrow.
FWIW Bernie has been a great communicator the whole time i've dealt with him. The only problem I have is that he over promises and under-delivers. I'm sure the shocks will be worth it when they get here, though. I just wish he would be honest about the time frame in the beginning.
FWIW Bernie has been a great communicator the whole time i've dealt with him. The only problem I have is that he over promises and under-delivers. I'm sure the shocks will be worth it when they get here, though. I just wish he would be honest about the time frame in the beginning.
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09-15-2011, 02:35 PM
#91
Honestly, I feel for the guy. He's going through a lot and has probably more business than he can handle with the turn-around times people demand. I just wish he would say "ok, if you are sending me shocks expect 90 days before you get them". That way if he finishes early, super happy customer.
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09-15-2011, 02:40 PM
#93
What a dickbag businessman. I mean what the ****. This thread has done nothing but get worse every time its revived. Bernie had plenty of chances to step up and fix his ****. Instead he brings in illness. That's like when people use religion to get out of a fight. Man the **** up and finish what you started or have someone competent take over for you.
And a big lol to the other dickwad from wr that came in here trying to be cute. You never should have taken Bernie on as a "whatever the **** you call him" and definitely shouldn't have come in here trying to defend either one of yourselves. Anyone here with a brain knows who to not do business with. Go back to m.net and push your magic shocks to people that give a ****.
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09-17-2011, 12:02 AM
#96
Must Read SD Re-Valved Shocks Review
Please read this before considering Steward Development purchase, I know it is a long one.
So here is another Steward Development Shock review.
I ordered my shocks on Feb 23rd after having a few emails back and forth with Bernie, great communication to get my order understood, which was summed up by my request for the "Ideal set-up would be for Deals Gap. Handles rough pavement well, but still has feedback when pushed to limits" . My decision to go with Bernie was based on his superior experience and the fact that he would be able to get me a performance oriented ride that would still be daily drivable, without adjusting the whole time. I was also promised a before and after plot to indicate what was done to alter the tune from a factory HD schock.
Got the shocks May 04th, 10 weeks later (only with a "after" plot, nothing to compare the "before" to). 3 weeks before I had a track day. I was told at the time of order that it would be 4-6 weeks, thats why I ordered them so early before the track day. After I paid, communication slowed down and stopped about 4 weeks after payment with "I have them on the table apart. I may have time in the next day, or this weekend." They did not ship for another 6 weeks. Finally got a hold of Weekend-Racer.com, who picked up the phone and within 2 weeks I had my shocks. This seemed to be the same challenge several others had at the time.
Got them on the car and was amazed by the rediculous handling and confidence inspiring ride. For the first week I had the car lowered too far and had the ebay spring sleeves extending beyond the top of the shock body (see attached pic) which must have maded the shocks bottom out, I took the shocks back off, trimmed the ebay sleeves and added FCM tophats. This made a big difference overall. Had the track day and had a blast, the car handled so crisp and predicatable it just kept asking for more. I drive track days for my own enjoyment and not to be competitive. That is why I did not ask for a full out agressive tune.
After a few weeks driving the car to work on my 70 mile round trip out on country roads that are less than perfect it became apparent that the ride quality was pretty rough and not as good as what I had hoped for. I sent an email to weekend-racer.com on May 15th and got a reply "Weekend-Racer.com is no longer providing Steward Development services..." 4 days later. After a few more days, all of a sudden things are good to go and weekend-racer.com had Steward Development back on their website. Another few weeks later I finally get a call from Bernie (first phone call after I made payment). Sounds like really nice guy. He took the time to listen to what I was describing as my problem with the ride quality and stated that he valved the shock a little more agressive than what I need for my requested "Ideal set-up would be for Deals Gap. ". He offered to re-valve them for free if I sent them back in and assured me he would make them a priority and get them back to me in a week. He also offered to sell me a set of re-valved used shocks for $450 (about the same time he had them on the forums)so that I did not have to worry about havving the car up on jackstands for a long time. He also asked that I give him good reviews due to the additional heat he was getting at the time. Unfortunitely I had not seen all the latest threads at the time, and I was under the impression that people were getting their orders filled and taken care of with the help of John. I thought I would give him a second chance, hell it would be free, so as long as the car wouldn't be on jackstands for months it would be worth the risk.
I thought about it for a few days to make sure it was what I wanted to do, called him up to make sure I could still get them back in a week or two, he confirmed it would still be possible. I took them off the car and noticed a damaged snapring on the right rear shock, which I attributed to the ebay sleeves that were slightly larger than the shock body and could have moved aournd a little. I mailed them out Friday afternoon on Aug 19th. I got an email the following Wednesday that he got them, already had them revalved and would have them shipped the next day. On Thursday the 25th I get an email from Bernie where he notified me that he noticed damaged lower bushings as he was packaging the shocks up (he sent me the picture attached). After pressing the bushings out to show me the damage I gave him a call to discuss what happened. It appeared that the car was lowered too far and overstressed the lower bushings. I knew I had ran it low for the first few days and had the full length coilover sleeves which would have contacted the top hats before the bumpstops were fully compressed. I also figuired out that I had torqued the lower shock bolts before I had the car at ride height which apparently causes enough preload to damage a lower bushing. I called Bernie to get a better understanding of how the bushings could have been that bad, but the handling was still so crisp and precise. He mentioned how all the symptoms I was describing that were causing my ride discomfort were all caused by the worn bushings (less than 2000miles) and that we needed to discuss the valving on the shock, he would call me the next day after re-evaluating the tune.
About that time I get a email from Weekend Racer that I need to pay for the revalve. At this point I had no problem with paying for the new bushings and getting them installed due to my own dumb ***. There was no way that I could pay for another revalve. The only reason I sent them in was because they would be free. By the way I paid $400 ($100 per shock) for the original revalve, apparently now they are $169 per shock for a revalve. I could not afford the $676, after a weekend of emailing Bernie and John they cut me a deal and only charged me $400 for the revalve and bushings ($60). So Bernie bugged me 3 times on Sunday to see if I was sending payment yet. Apparently the shocks were ready to ship and they just needed payment. I kept asking for him to help me understand why the bushings would cause the larger chassis movements that were causing me discomfort, I also wanted to know if he returned the tune to the original state since the change he made was not nessasary. He refused to provide any other information on the current tune or anything till I sent payment. It sucked becuase I truely felt like they were holding my shocks hostage. I already had $880 invested in the shocks that I was not 100% happy with, but now I couldn't even get them back and had nothing to use on my car unless I paid the $400. I would have been fine if his expert opinion would have identified the fact that my bushings were shot and must ve been the cause of all my symptoms before I sent them in, or even identified the bad bushings before he spent 6-8 hours revalveing my shocks. I understood that he already had spent the time even though that re-valve apparently was not needed. I even agreed to write an honest review listing my own misteaks that caused me to think that something was wrong with the shocks.
Well even after making the payment I did not get anything back from Bernie for a week, not even on his personal cell phone. At this point I am concerned that he might have de-tuned a perfectly good shock that would be useless now since all my issues were caused by the bushings that I damaged. I also kept asking for a base, off the shelf shock plot to compare the final plots to. This would be an indication of what is changed with each revalve. A week later I finally get an email that he will be shipping them out and he did mention that he had some health issues. At this point I am cutting my losses and just glad that I can get my car on the road and hoping it will ride as good as the $1280 price tag. Oh by the way FCM can get you the complete shock, spring, hat and sleeve for that kind of money. Hell with what I paid for everything I could have gotten the XIDA's!!!!
I finally get the shocks 9 days later. I did get the 2nd "after" plot, but still no initial off the shelf plot to see what the original re-valve did. I will attach these later. I had also requested the bad bushings to be included, but they weren't. He did include 2 new snap rings which I had damaged during the bottoming out. At this point he becomes more defensive as I am asking simple questions to understand and requesting a digital copy of the off the shelf shock plot. All I get is "What is a stock graph going to tell you? ", I wonder why I was told I would get one initially. What good is the after plot if I cannot compare it to a before. You can send me anything and tell me that you did all this according to your infinite wisdom and simply expect me to believe and understand it all. I am not a suspension tuner, but I am a mechanical engineer and can compare trends to get an idea of what was done.
I installed the shocks over the following weekend. I have to say the ride height is more civil. What is interesting is that the same larger amplitude motions that were there before and made the ride uncomfortable are still present, the accelerations are just smaller and do not cause the same discomfort. I could not notice any significant change in responsiveness or anything else I would concider to be caused by a worn/damaged bushing. I emailed to mention this to him and asked for clarification to help me understand. At this point he begins to make me out to be an idiot that did not know what I wanted to begin with and didnt know what I was doing. When I begin to challenge why the valving all of a sudden became unessasary when the bad bushings were discovered and why he re-nigged and made me pay to get my shocks back (I didn't even ask, why his expertise did not identify the bad bushings before doing an unessassary re-valve), the conversation degraded.
So it all ended with:
Bernie:
"Thanks for being the same retarded customer that doesn't have a clue. Glad I could really dial it in for your seasoned feel of the car."
I have to admit, my last response was:
"Thanks for the great legendary customer service. I am glad I gave you a second chance."
I promised to deliver a true and honest review of my experience. I have defended Bernie on serveral occassions after I got my shocks when a lot of people seemed to bash the snot out of him, some without reason. I am a very nice guy that knows I was at fault for improperly installing the shocks and bottoming them out, but I have never had customer service like this. I don't care if his shocks magically make my car **** golden eggs, I would never want anyone else to experience this. Now that FCM lowered their prices I cannot see why anyone would want to talk to Steward Development.
If anyone is considering getting SD shocks, PM me and I will forward every single email thread I have from them. I gave them two chances and was very patient to the end. I know I lost it at the end, but this is rediculous. I have spent $1280 for F!#$ng shocks that I am not happy with!!! And guess what, I aint sending the **** back to them to improve the ride.
If I am being an idiot, please fee free to correct me.
So here is another Steward Development Shock review.
I ordered my shocks on Feb 23rd after having a few emails back and forth with Bernie, great communication to get my order understood, which was summed up by my request for the "Ideal set-up would be for Deals Gap. Handles rough pavement well, but still has feedback when pushed to limits" . My decision to go with Bernie was based on his superior experience and the fact that he would be able to get me a performance oriented ride that would still be daily drivable, without adjusting the whole time. I was also promised a before and after plot to indicate what was done to alter the tune from a factory HD schock.
Got the shocks May 04th, 10 weeks later (only with a "after" plot, nothing to compare the "before" to). 3 weeks before I had a track day. I was told at the time of order that it would be 4-6 weeks, thats why I ordered them so early before the track day. After I paid, communication slowed down and stopped about 4 weeks after payment with "I have them on the table apart. I may have time in the next day, or this weekend." They did not ship for another 6 weeks. Finally got a hold of Weekend-Racer.com, who picked up the phone and within 2 weeks I had my shocks. This seemed to be the same challenge several others had at the time.
Got them on the car and was amazed by the rediculous handling and confidence inspiring ride. For the first week I had the car lowered too far and had the ebay spring sleeves extending beyond the top of the shock body (see attached pic) which must have maded the shocks bottom out, I took the shocks back off, trimmed the ebay sleeves and added FCM tophats. This made a big difference overall. Had the track day and had a blast, the car handled so crisp and predicatable it just kept asking for more. I drive track days for my own enjoyment and not to be competitive. That is why I did not ask for a full out agressive tune.
After a few weeks driving the car to work on my 70 mile round trip out on country roads that are less than perfect it became apparent that the ride quality was pretty rough and not as good as what I had hoped for. I sent an email to weekend-racer.com on May 15th and got a reply "Weekend-Racer.com is no longer providing Steward Development services..." 4 days later. After a few more days, all of a sudden things are good to go and weekend-racer.com had Steward Development back on their website. Another few weeks later I finally get a call from Bernie (first phone call after I made payment). Sounds like really nice guy. He took the time to listen to what I was describing as my problem with the ride quality and stated that he valved the shock a little more agressive than what I need for my requested "Ideal set-up would be for Deals Gap. ". He offered to re-valve them for free if I sent them back in and assured me he would make them a priority and get them back to me in a week. He also offered to sell me a set of re-valved used shocks for $450 (about the same time he had them on the forums)so that I did not have to worry about havving the car up on jackstands for a long time. He also asked that I give him good reviews due to the additional heat he was getting at the time. Unfortunitely I had not seen all the latest threads at the time, and I was under the impression that people were getting their orders filled and taken care of with the help of John. I thought I would give him a second chance, hell it would be free, so as long as the car wouldn't be on jackstands for months it would be worth the risk.
I thought about it for a few days to make sure it was what I wanted to do, called him up to make sure I could still get them back in a week or two, he confirmed it would still be possible. I took them off the car and noticed a damaged snapring on the right rear shock, which I attributed to the ebay sleeves that were slightly larger than the shock body and could have moved aournd a little. I mailed them out Friday afternoon on Aug 19th. I got an email the following Wednesday that he got them, already had them revalved and would have them shipped the next day. On Thursday the 25th I get an email from Bernie where he notified me that he noticed damaged lower bushings as he was packaging the shocks up (he sent me the picture attached). After pressing the bushings out to show me the damage I gave him a call to discuss what happened. It appeared that the car was lowered too far and overstressed the lower bushings. I knew I had ran it low for the first few days and had the full length coilover sleeves which would have contacted the top hats before the bumpstops were fully compressed. I also figuired out that I had torqued the lower shock bolts before I had the car at ride height which apparently causes enough preload to damage a lower bushing. I called Bernie to get a better understanding of how the bushings could have been that bad, but the handling was still so crisp and precise. He mentioned how all the symptoms I was describing that were causing my ride discomfort were all caused by the worn bushings (less than 2000miles) and that we needed to discuss the valving on the shock, he would call me the next day after re-evaluating the tune.
About that time I get a email from Weekend Racer that I need to pay for the revalve. At this point I had no problem with paying for the new bushings and getting them installed due to my own dumb ***. There was no way that I could pay for another revalve. The only reason I sent them in was because they would be free. By the way I paid $400 ($100 per shock) for the original revalve, apparently now they are $169 per shock for a revalve. I could not afford the $676, after a weekend of emailing Bernie and John they cut me a deal and only charged me $400 for the revalve and bushings ($60). So Bernie bugged me 3 times on Sunday to see if I was sending payment yet. Apparently the shocks were ready to ship and they just needed payment. I kept asking for him to help me understand why the bushings would cause the larger chassis movements that were causing me discomfort, I also wanted to know if he returned the tune to the original state since the change he made was not nessasary. He refused to provide any other information on the current tune or anything till I sent payment. It sucked becuase I truely felt like they were holding my shocks hostage. I already had $880 invested in the shocks that I was not 100% happy with, but now I couldn't even get them back and had nothing to use on my car unless I paid the $400. I would have been fine if his expert opinion would have identified the fact that my bushings were shot and must ve been the cause of all my symptoms before I sent them in, or even identified the bad bushings before he spent 6-8 hours revalveing my shocks. I understood that he already had spent the time even though that re-valve apparently was not needed. I even agreed to write an honest review listing my own misteaks that caused me to think that something was wrong with the shocks.
Well even after making the payment I did not get anything back from Bernie for a week, not even on his personal cell phone. At this point I am concerned that he might have de-tuned a perfectly good shock that would be useless now since all my issues were caused by the bushings that I damaged. I also kept asking for a base, off the shelf shock plot to compare the final plots to. This would be an indication of what is changed with each revalve. A week later I finally get an email that he will be shipping them out and he did mention that he had some health issues. At this point I am cutting my losses and just glad that I can get my car on the road and hoping it will ride as good as the $1280 price tag. Oh by the way FCM can get you the complete shock, spring, hat and sleeve for that kind of money. Hell with what I paid for everything I could have gotten the XIDA's!!!!
I finally get the shocks 9 days later. I did get the 2nd "after" plot, but still no initial off the shelf plot to see what the original re-valve did. I will attach these later. I had also requested the bad bushings to be included, but they weren't. He did include 2 new snap rings which I had damaged during the bottoming out. At this point he becomes more defensive as I am asking simple questions to understand and requesting a digital copy of the off the shelf shock plot. All I get is "What is a stock graph going to tell you? ", I wonder why I was told I would get one initially. What good is the after plot if I cannot compare it to a before. You can send me anything and tell me that you did all this according to your infinite wisdom and simply expect me to believe and understand it all. I am not a suspension tuner, but I am a mechanical engineer and can compare trends to get an idea of what was done.
I installed the shocks over the following weekend. I have to say the ride height is more civil. What is interesting is that the same larger amplitude motions that were there before and made the ride uncomfortable are still present, the accelerations are just smaller and do not cause the same discomfort. I could not notice any significant change in responsiveness or anything else I would concider to be caused by a worn/damaged bushing. I emailed to mention this to him and asked for clarification to help me understand. At this point he begins to make me out to be an idiot that did not know what I wanted to begin with and didnt know what I was doing. When I begin to challenge why the valving all of a sudden became unessasary when the bad bushings were discovered and why he re-nigged and made me pay to get my shocks back (I didn't even ask, why his expertise did not identify the bad bushings before doing an unessassary re-valve), the conversation degraded.
So it all ended with:
Bernie:
"Thanks for being the same retarded customer that doesn't have a clue. Glad I could really dial it in for your seasoned feel of the car."
I have to admit, my last response was:
"Thanks for the great legendary customer service. I am glad I gave you a second chance."
I promised to deliver a true and honest review of my experience. I have defended Bernie on serveral occassions after I got my shocks when a lot of people seemed to bash the snot out of him, some without reason. I am a very nice guy that knows I was at fault for improperly installing the shocks and bottoming them out, but I have never had customer service like this. I don't care if his shocks magically make my car **** golden eggs, I would never want anyone else to experience this. Now that FCM lowered their prices I cannot see why anyone would want to talk to Steward Development.
If anyone is considering getting SD shocks, PM me and I will forward every single email thread I have from them. I gave them two chances and was very patient to the end. I know I lost it at the end, but this is rediculous. I have spent $1280 for F!#$ng shocks that I am not happy with!!! And guess what, I aint sending the **** back to them to improve the ride.
If I am being an idiot, please fee free to correct me.
Last edited by Rallas; 09-17-2011 at 12:23 AM.
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09-17-2011, 09:54 AM
#99
Boost Czar
iTrader: (62)
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chantilly, VA
Posts: 79,493
Total Cats: 4,080
were those sleeves cut down so they didnt extend past the shody body? okay i can see you eventually did this. yeah that would ride like dick.
Bernie can't ride the "greatness" train forever. He's banned from miataturbo.net and is labeled as a scammer as far as we are concerned.
Bernie can't ride the "greatness" train forever. He's banned from miataturbo.net and is labeled as a scammer as far as we are concerned.
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