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It's not internet lore, it's me, for I have this thing and have done this thing. The rear 6-point NB2 subframe brace will not fit with the RB midpipe. The resonator, it is the too huge. None of the other braces give a damn. Last time I ran it it also wanted to shift around on track and knock against things back around the diff.
In order for the rear brace to work with the RB midpipe it will have to be clearanced, ie, a notch will have to be welded in. Fortuitously I have two NB2 rear subframe braces, so I'm free to experiment, but short on time.
At this point, I've just stopped running all the stock underchassis bracing anyway, except of course for the rear brace. Right now I've been running the Roadstersport midpipe and muffler, and I must say I like the sound lots. Now that the turbo is going on, though, I'm going to give the RB midpipe a try again, and pair it with my little pencil of an Enthuza muffler. We'll see how sound goes next week, I may have to run the Roadstersport setup for Laguna, but with the turbo on I really doubt it.
Edit: the other option is to take BFH and make the resonator fit the brace. This option has the advantage of not lowering ground clearance on an already low car. Hmm.
Okey dokey. Internet lore cleared up. Thank you.
I knew it could be made to work, but I don't have the tools to do it, and didn't want to have one more thing to deal with after all the other setbacks and expenses I ran into with this "quick and easy" little project. I was already 6 weeks into a 2 week project and needed to get the car back on the ground for a track day. And, it's not like the RS pipe sucks.
On the subject of the chassis bracing... I have been giving it the stink-eye for a while now. Those 2 butterfly braces are quite heavy, and I would love to ditch them, if they are not worth having. What has kept me from doing it is the idea that Mazda engineers would not add cost nor weight to the car, if they thought it wasn't really worthwhile. And, practically every Miata owner I interact with that doesn't have an NB, adds bracing from the aftermarket and raves about it (for what that's worth). Further, I know a guy with a 240Z track toy, who removed his, and when he went to put it back on a year later, it no longer fit, because the body had deflected by about 3/8" in its absence. (Running the straight front and rear braces on the Miata should prevent something like that from happening.) All anecdotal or circumstantial "evidence," I know, but it feeds the simplistic decision to just leave it on.
I dunno. I'll probably try it eventually to see if I notice any difference. What is your more detailed opinion, if you don't mind sharing?
I have been squirted, and now I'm all hot and wet and sticky! Or maybe it was just 96F in my garage and that caused the hotness and wetness and stickiness. Nah. Probably squirted, because I liked it.
MAF is now deleted.
ECU is loosely installed.
It works.
Wideband controller and gauge loosely installed. Reads a reasonable value at idle on what I assume to be rich base maps. This will probably live in the glove box most of the time, as I don't want it in the A pillar, and I generally hate them. Probably should have bought an LC-2 and tied it up under the dash. Oh well.
Base timing is set. Main cooling fan behavior is set. Base map is saved for future reference. Won't quite idle happily with A/C on. Much more to do before taking it to the tuner, you know, in addition to permanently installing it.
Now to dig back into the mega manual to figure a few things out...
In other news, I replaced the thermostat again to solve the over-cooling problem. I also turned the shift lever 180 degrees, which solved the shifter position problem. Apparently, shift levers are directional on NB2s. Also re-torqued all exhaust nuts and bolts and installed header blanket to keep the heat off the brake components and hopefully lower IATs a little bit.
I do not believe you will be able to pass emissions with the VICS manifold in place. But honestly... in terms of NA power, nothing will give you the HP per dollar of ditching the VTCS manifold, especially if you're doing VICS (squaretop isn't quite the screaming value the VICS mani is).
I have been doing some reading on this, and what I have read has motivated me to do something with the manifold sooner rather than later. From what I have read, the VTCS butterflies create about a 10 WHP restriction. That moves it up the priority list quite a bit for a N/A car. This is not confirmed that I can find, but I am inclined to belive that a VICS manifold or a VTCS manifold with the butterflies removed will pass emissions, as long as the solenoid is left intact. The ECU can verify the signal, but not whether it is physically opened or closed, so as long as the solenoid is in place, a code will not be thrown. Only way to find out is to try it. I'm currently looking for a VICS manifold for sale locally. Obviously, I need to make a decision and act on it before taking the car to the tuner.
I have read about the cold idle problems with the stock ECU and butterfly delete. For my purposes, the stock ECU is only going in long enough to pass emissions each September, so I think I should be OK. I can't find any evidence of a feedback loop between activating the solenoid and confirming its function beyond its electrical resistance, so as long as it is there, the ECU should be happy.
Anyway, this is a bit of a rabbit hole. I need to find the time to fully research it and make a truly informed decision. Fore example: On the one hand, I read Emilio's comments. OTOH, I find FM saying it really only makes a difference above 6500RPM, which happens to be where I usually start my shift anyway, and that low and midrange power are unaffected or better with VTCS. Of course, their testing was done on a stroker at a bazillion feet above sea level, so not necessarily applicable. Back to the woodshed...
Hahah alright. This would have actually been for the not-gross DD.
I have an AEM i got from Lars i'm going to try to figure out how to use. Realized afterwards that the AEM mounts to the power steering pump, and because i can't NOT ruin anything, the not-gross DD doesn't have power steering. Whoops.
1. Warm weather idle tuned to be stable throughout warmup stages
2. Both cooling fans now operating within my parameters, with required idle-up characteristics functioning. A/C fan determined to be controlled by Fuel Injector I output, which is incorrect in the documentation. Fans basically perform opposite functions compared to OE
3. A/C functioning with idle-up and no longer killing car at idle
4. Wideband readings confirmed to be accurate to +/- 0.05
Tasks for tonight...
1. Engine requires about 2 seconds of cranking cold and warm to start and makes a funny sound, when it does fire. With the factory ECU, it would start on the first bump. Need to tune startup parameters
2. Electrical bits I need to finish wiring up the wideband should arrive today. Permanently wire wideband and configure MS to use it
.
Last edited by Steve Dallas; 09-20-2017 at 09:37 AM.
Last night's efforts working on the TODO list can be summarized as:
1. Ha! Yeah. Right. No progress at all. Actually made it worse and rolled back
2. Mostly done. Electrical bits did arrive. Wideband wired and MS configured to use it. So far, so good
[ ^ I don't know how that picture got there, but I'm leaving it. ]
Here is how to probably not wire your AEM X-Series wideband.
After ruminating on the +12V source, I decided to see how solid an add-a-circuit thingy can be. It turns out, the one I bought is very, very tight. It came with a bullet splice connector, of which I was skeptical, but I decided to try it to see if it is solid. It is also very tight, so I used it, thinking I would like to make this entire harness easily removable and serviceable. It can always be soldered in the future if needed. I hijacked the cigarette lighter circuit and added the required 5A fuse. The lighter circuit now has a 15A fuse, because I happened to have one.
I kept reading two approaches to the controller ground: connect it to the ECU ground (MT.net), and connect it to the engine block (DIYAT). Of course, I elected to do neither of those things. I saw this helpful unused nutsert on the firewall begging to have its hole filled, so I screwed it. It was tight. I figured I would try the easy way out and see if the wideband readings are accurate and stable, and they are so far, so I'm going to try to get away with this nonsense.
The WB Analog Out (+) is soldered to the lead for the Analog In 2 on the MS's auxiliary harness. The Analog Out (-) is soldered to the Sensor Ground lead. Hey, at least I soldered something. Also used heat shrink for Aidan.
All leads were left full length to give me future mounting flexibility.
At this point, the view of my floorboard has improved to this state.
[ ^ The blue tape is to protect the MS from being scratched by the pedals. My pedals don't wear rubbers, when I push them. Hard.]
Getting the MS to recognize the WB took longer than it should have. I had 4 sets of documentation, and each one had different information. None of them had the right information, nor matched the settings available in Tuner Studio. I was about to decide the MSPNP is an unicorn and give up and vampire the narrowband's wiring, when I found an obscure setting for "OG Source" on an unrelated page, which unlocked settings to configure the UEGO to use Analog Input 2 elsewhere in the software. ( <-- That was two fantasy creatures references is one long sentence, for those keeping score.) It seems there used to be a settings page with everything needed to configure the wideband, but things are now scattered across about 4 different pages.
Once that was determined, I unplugged the narrowband and was able to watch the ECU go from open loop to closed loop at 160F (default setting) and watch the commanded AFR closely match the measured AFR. I'm calling that progress. AFR readings look stable and are the same between the AEM gauge and TS gauge. My ghetto grounding just might work.
The tasks for tonight are:
1. Same as #1 above
2. Move the MS into position and tidy up the wiring
3. Rotate the tires and put the car back on the ground for a test drive
2 and 3 will actually happen. 1 will probably go for the full Wally World rollback treatment again.
Progress?
.
Last edited by Steve Dallas; 09-22-2017 at 08:28 PM.
1. I decided it sounded like it is stumbling, as if it is nearly flooded, so I reduced the prime. That helped. Still a little bit of work to do, but it is certainly better than barely starting now.
2. This took longer than it should have, and I am very unhappy with the results. Extremely ghetto. I ended up wrapping the ECU in an old washcloth to keep it from rattling. And, my massive hands are too big to fit up in there to do much with the front side. I guess Goodwin and Singular are about to get more of my money for a bracket.
3. Hey, at least this happened normally!
I had hoped to be able to drive it some last night, and perhaps turn on VEAL to check that feature out, but I ran out of time and energy. It was over 90F here until after 9PM last night. I was pretty gross and sapped by then. But, I get off at 3PM today and have all afternoon to mess with it. Of course, we still have a high of 97F today, so...
I also have a functional reason for wanting the bracket. The wires on the auxiliary plug are exposed to the sharp edges on the OE lower bracket, and I can't find a way to zip tie the ECU to the bracket that guarantees they won't eventually be shorted. I have them wrapped and cushioned for now, but I don't really trust it.
The wideband gauge is sitting in a temporary location, until I am finished being annoyed by it. Once I am ready to move it, I'll do the bracket at the same time. That is likely to happen next week.
I have the Singular bracket to use in my 99 with my MS3X. One day I am going to get around to installing it.
It didn't work for me. The MS3X case was too big. On a thread on here, I was told that making the bracket any wider wouldn't let it fit any more. Haha, think you've been talking about installing your case since before I set up my megasquirt last year!
It didn't work for me. The MS3X case was too big. On a thread on here, I was told that making the bracket any wider wouldn't let it fit any more. Haha, think you've been talking about installing your case since before I set up my megasquirt last year!
That is probably true. I don't get much actual time to play with my cars any more. To busy building turbo setups on them to do actual productive work for my own enjoyment.
$140 plus shipping for a nice VICS manifold. How terrible is that? Optimistic MT.net posts mention $75. I'm not seeing that optimism around here. What say you?
That is probably true. I don't get much actual time to play with my cars any more. To busy building turbo setups on them to do actual productive work for my own enjoyment.
Bummer that I already ordered a new one. We could have helped each other out, if it truly doesn't fit your ECU.
$140 plus shipping for a nice VICS manifold. How terrible is that? Optimistic MT.net posts mention $75. I'm not seeing that optimism around here. What say you?
I think $75 is a bit low for a VICS manifold. They might pop up at that price occasionally, but I would say $125-$175 is probably a bit more normal.
09-13-2017, 09:11 AM
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