Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats. (https://www.miataturbo.net/)
-   Build Threads (https://www.miataturbo.net/build-threads-57/)
-   -   Quest for a EFR powered MSM (https://www.miataturbo.net/build-threads-57/quest-efr-powered-msm-105430/)

knnstr 06-21-2021 01:49 PM

EFR MSM that goes..... _oom?
 
Hi folks,

INTRODUCTIONS
I'm just an IT guy that stepped into the world of Miatas in '19, just eager to get back into sporty cars after taking a 9 year hiatus. A nerd by trade and always in search of learning something new. Anyway, enough about me. Let's talk about the car!

THE CAR - Mazdaspeed Miata Production#2928
It's an '04 MSM in Ti with 100k on the body. Zero rust, perfect platform to build upon. Was originally a Redlands, CA car imported into Canada. Completely stock as far as I was aware when I took possession in 2019.

BASELINE
The car over the initial 2 years of ownership has gone through all the upgrades any typical thrill seeking owner would go through. It's got the whole nine yards, injectors, fuel pump, FM intake/inlets, intercooler upgrade, MS3, etc. After picking up the core concepts and fundamentals of MS3 and alongside my obsession with map tuning (I used to tune STI's), it's now at 13.5psi (14.2psi in cold temps) on the stock block + IHI using progressive PWM boost solenoid control. Pushing about 230whp+ on 94octane (no e85 here) with pretty aggressive timing for this street only build. Injector duty is at 83% at peak boost so needless to say I'm now turbo limited.

GOALS
Go fully forged block with VVT + EFR6758 and see what power levels pump gas would yield safely.

I'll be reserving some posts down below to break down the individual components and areas that I'll be building.

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...ac4dfea5c7.jpg
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...a6240c6b70.jpg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...9294c5652a.jpg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...a61c38442b.jpg

knnstr 06-21-2021 01:50 PM

THE NEW SETUP

Engine (BP6D with VVT bored to ~1.9L)

Parts - Block
  • ACL RACE Bearing Set (Installed)
  • ARP Head Stud Kit (Installed)
  • ARP Main Stud Kit (Installed)
  • ATI Harmonic Balancer + Hardware/Keyway (Installed)
  • Fab9 32-2 tooth trigger wheel (Installed)
  • Boundary Engineering Billet Oil Pump stage 2 (VVT) 2 shim (Installed)
  • GATES 3D CAST IMPELLER Waterpump (Installed)
  • New OEM Front Crank Seal (Installed)
  • New Idler and Tensioner Pulleys (Installed)
  • GATES Race Kevlar Timing Belt (Installed)
  • Manley Forged H-Beam Rods (Installed)
  • Wiseco Forged Pistons 8.5:1 83.5mm (Includes Rings) (Installed)
  • Innovative Engine Mounts (height adjustable) 60D (Installed)
  • NAV oil pan baffle (Installed)

Parts - Head
  • Intake side cleaning, Exhaust side polish
  • Supertech Double heavy valve springs with titanium retainers (Installed)
  • Rear Main Seal (Installed)
  • OEM MLS Headgasket (Installed)
  • New CAM seals (Installed)
  • New OEM Valve cover gasket (Installed)
  • New OEM Valve Stem Seals I/E (Installed)
  • New OEM Accessory and Alternator Belts (Installed)
  • New OEM Intake and Exhaust gaskets (Installed)
  • MiataRoadster exhaust fastener kit with ARP studs (Installed)

Motor ventilation
  • Moroso AOS PCV side (Installed)
  • GTX upgraded PCV valve (Installed)
  • Valve cover mods
  • Double vented to VTA catch can 10AN lines (Installed)

Sparks & Fuel
  • Injector Dynamics 1050X (Installed)
  • FlowForce R8 ignition (Installed)
​​​

knnstr 06-21-2021 01:50 PM

​​​​​​Exhaust Setup:
  • Kraken EFR Top Mount Manifold (Installed)
  • Kraken 3" DP with back-purged V-band elbow (Installed)
  • Kraken Full 3" exhaust (Installed)

Turbo:
  • EFR6758 0.64 AR B1 housing 250-500hp (Installed)
  • Kraken Water and Oil lines kit (Installed)
  • EFR B1 frame PTP lava turbo blanket (Installed)
  • Turbosmart EFR 50/50 dual port BOV (Installed)

Intercooler/cooling:
  • Fab9 Stage 1 Intercooler 520 CFM (Installed)
  • Supermiata QMAX coolant reroute (Installed)
  • Supermiata Crossflow Radiator (Installed)
  • FM cold side pipe from intercooler to throttle inlet (Installed)
  • Kraken Hot side behind headlight piping (Installed)
Clutch:
  • FM Stage 2 Happy Meal Clutch (Installed)
  • FM Lightened flywheel (Installed)

knnstr 06-21-2021 01:51 PM

*Reserved* misc
[20JUN2021] Disassembly
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...b3385d58da.jpg



[13JUL2021] Parts Day
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...ddafe68c0c.jpg

Dr.Sep 06-21-2021 02:20 PM

FYI - I run a 6758 on pump 93 (best we have here) with colder plugs and am detonation limited to 18psi, I do not think you will see 20-22psi safely on pump gas -- Though Andy Floyd here runs a similar garrett turbo around 20-22psi with 93 pump gas WITH octane booster. You will likely need bigger injectors, the PSI is not as important as how much air is flowing and an efr flows a lottttt more than the IHI, but again from my experience at 18psi I see around 60%duty on 1000cc injectors and a dw300 pump @60psi fuel pressure

knnstr 06-21-2021 02:33 PM


Originally Posted by Dr.Sep (Post 1602841)
FYI - I run a 6758 on pump 93 (best we have here) with colder plugs and am detonation limited to 18psi, I do not think you will see 20-22psi safely on pump gas -- Though Andy Floyd here runs a similar garrett turbo around 20-22psi with 93 pump gas WITH octane booster. You will likely need bigger injectors, the PSI is not as important as how much air is flowing and an efr flows a lottttt more than the IHI, but again from my experience at 18psi I see around 60%duty on 1000cc injectors and a dw300 pump @60psi fuel pressure

Interesting, thanks for chiming in. What compression did you go with for the pistons?

I deliberately went with the 8.5:1 Wiseco's so I will have some timing wiggle room with our fuel. But of course, the turbo psi is something I've just pulled out of the air. I won't know till I get everything in and start tuning to be sure!

Dr.Sep 06-21-2021 02:34 PM

Mine are 9.0:1 so not too far off, you might be able to get away with a little more (would be great if you were!) I will be following :)

Gee Emm 06-21-2021 07:31 PM

I will be following closely. My engine is stock on the IHI, I have been eying off a new turbo and some rods, but still to pull the trigger.

knnstr 06-25-2021 12:19 AM

Ordered the top mount Kraken EFR manifold and 3" DP.

The race is on to see whether Bulgaria will be faster than US to Canada. :giggle:

Dr.Sep 06-25-2021 10:36 AM


Originally Posted by knnstr (Post 1603128)
Ordered the top mount Kraken EFR manifold and 3" DP.

The race is on to see whether Bulgaria will be faster than US to Canada. :giggle:

DHL is amazing, my kraken order made it from Bulgaria to Rochester NY faster than a moss miata part from California that shipped a whole day before the kraken parts... took something ridiculous like 3 days total from when I received the shipping notification to wiping the drool off my freshly opened parts. Enjoy

knnstr 06-25-2021 10:50 AM


Originally Posted by Dr.Sep (Post 1603164)
DHL is amazing, my kraken order made it from Bulgaria to Rochester NY faster than a moss miata part from California that shipped a whole day before the kraken parts... took something ridiculous like 3 days total from when I received the shipping notification to wiping the drool off my freshly opened parts. Enjoy

That's great to hear.. too bad I actually need the off the shelf parts (pistons) from Fab9 first for the machine shop.

Good info, thanks Dr.Sep

knnstr 07-02-2021 11:06 PM

EDIT: VS855's are out of stock and went with ST dual heavy springs

Ordered a set of VS855 valve springs for the head and as well as OEM valve stem seals. Will start on the mild port and Polish as I'm waiting for parts to arrive in the coming weeks. Unfortunately no ETA or communications yet, but I'm hoping the head will be done by the time my Fab9 order comes in to get my block work started.

The reason I ended up deciding on heavier springs is because I will probably want a slightly higher redline to stay in boost longer from the lower compression (8.5:1). I do also like the idea of extra security with the stronger springs.

Plenty of threads I've read on here and miata.net on this subject. But I'll open up the question here for if anyone feels like sharing.

"What are your experiences with low compression, VVT + higher boost application?"

ridethecliche 07-08-2021 07:52 AM

My car with the same compression pistons and a tiny overbore hit 25psi on a 2871 by ~3800rpm.

The springs are pretty mild in terms of what's out there which is why I did them. I wouldn't worry about it easier affecting much negatively.

knnstr 07-12-2021 11:52 AM

Kudos to FAB9 (thanks Bryan) - got my shipment out with an ETA in my hands sometime tomorrow. ARP main and head stud stock is no where to be seen, there looks to be a global shortage.

I will finally have my rods and pistons to get the bore, hone and decking onto my machinist's docket.

Exciting times!

knnstr 07-15-2021 09:55 AM

Such a shame these will be hidden in the motor.

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...b58b726356.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...3c573b6e0f.jpg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...45b0da8050.jpg


knnstr 07-17-2021 10:49 PM

Massive update with the parts ordered and received.

ARP Main studs should arrive this coming week, then off to the machine shop.

I decided on, and ordered a set of Supertech double coil heavy valve springs (74lbs) in place of the out of stock VS855 Volvo springs. I figured I'd want that extra security from valve float as I'll be doing a lot of RPM to boost trim tuning with this setup. Last thing I want is to be close to my power goals and the stock RPM limit becomes the limiting factor.

ARP Head Stud Kit (218-4701) is still elusive and out of stock everywhere from reputable sources. I'll keep checking from time to time. Fingers crossed!

knnstr 07-21-2021 10:30 AM

Just a quick update:
  • Kraken Mani + DP is enroute expected end of week
  • Block has been dropped off to the machinist
  • FM VVT assembly tools are on backorder until next week
  • ST Dual Heavy Valve Springs are awaiting fulfillment
  • ​​​​​​On the look out for deals for the EFR6758 and ARP Head Studs

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...b9c4fc30c1.jpg

knnstr 07-21-2021 12:32 PM

Just for kicks I've done some virtual dyno comparisons between different psi's on the stock MSM IHI turbo. I'd say it validates what I've been reading that around 240whp and at 5k RPM is right where the IHI falls short.

The plot below is with 94 octane gas running 17.8 timing in the higher RPM ranges without knock. I've had to really put in some aggressive wastegate duty to keep that little turbo hold consistent PSI in the higher ranges.

Can't wait to have a new turbo to tinker and play with!

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...a22d346a7f.jpg

knnstr 07-22-2021 08:49 PM


Originally Posted by Dr.Sep (Post 1603164)
DHL is amazing, my kraken order made it from Bulgaria to Rochester NY faster than a moss miata part from California that shipped a whole day before the kraken parts... took something ridiculous like 3 days total from when I received the shipping notification to wiping the drool off my freshly opened parts. Enjoy

Absolutely right Dr.Sep. Kraken shipped out my DP and Manifold on Tuesday and I got it today. My mind is still blown it got here in 2 days!

I'm in love with the Turbo to DP turn down welds (back purged). Absolutely beautiful.
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...68fba91e25.jpg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...866f82d204.jpg


FAB9 has been great as well.. ST valve springs arrived :)

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...7375522933.jpg

knnstr 08-02-2021 12:44 AM

First off I'd like to thank Kraken for dealing with me. Crazy honest guys over there and I must admit, they handled my neediness like a champ.

Quick update:

Ordered my Kraken 3" exhaust with the Simons muffler, looks like a great quality piece. Simons aren't common this side of the pond but from info I did find they fit the bill for what I'm looking for sound wise. I'll definitely add in some sound clips once my build is up and running.

I have been researching more on spark and fueling, and ended up ordering a new set of ID1050X injectors. The 255lph deatschwerks I have should provide what I need for my goals anyway. Worse case get an upgraded unit and regulator if there are any problems. I'm still not convinced that I need dual feed but if any of you out there have anecdotal experiences saying otherwise I'm all ears!


​​​​​​Build is coming together, the EFR6758 coming in the next week or so along with the turbo blanket. ARP Head studs are being "fulfilled" but I'm still hopeful.

At least the the FM spring compressor is coming in this week so I can at least finish the head work as I'm waiting for more parts to arrive. I'll post some update pics as I make some sort of material and tangible progress and not just a lighter wallet. Lol


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:28 PM.


© 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands