Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

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Z_WAAAAAZ Jan 2, 2025 12:22 AM

I had the same experience with Skunk. What do you mean I can't order a spare one of your throttle cable brackets that literally everybody breaks?

Regarding the injectors, I wish I could tell you what AFR I was running at idle on 91 oct. I wanna say I was running 13.5 with no issues? The injectors did sit for abour 3-4 months before I shipped them and there was e85 in the tank so a cleaning might be prudent? Let me know if they give you trouble after cleaning.

Most impotantly, god I hope the garage urinal is a real thing.

SimBa Jan 2, 2025 10:43 AM

Thanks @Z_WAAAAAZ . I figured they might be a little gummed up from sitting. I've got some fuel injector cleaner to add to the next tank. They're working great outside of idle, so no worries there. I've also played with the small pulsewidth adder on the tune and am not sure if that's helping or hurting. It's also hovering between 0-10 C (30-50 F) right now, so it could be related to the cold ambient temps.

See that funnel attached to the wall in that last photo? Notice the hose going outside? Man, it's a great investment. I got pissed off when I had to break in the middle of a project to run inside to relieve myself while not getting the house covered in grubby hand marks and/or debris from the garage floor. I remember a setup like this in my dad's old shop when I was a kid (and now that I'm thinking about it they have an outdoor guest bathroom setup in one of their sheds). Works great so far :bigtu:

SimBa Jan 2, 2025 10:49 PM

Cleaned up some cuts I botched when clearancing the intercooler piping. One side was fine and one side was... less so. I eyeballed the cut lines and cleaned them up with a dremel. Good enough. Didn't get an after shot, but you'll see soon enough I'm sure.
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...7460f36430.jpg

And... ducting.
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...8f618f09c1.jpg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...764fdfb549.jpg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...0bb400f700.jpg
Note how far back the top part of the main duct extends
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...4c3e19a0eb.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...f16dc4c73b.jpg
Goes right back to the foam that fills the sides of the rad
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...bf6c1ac6e8.jpg
Added a little foam to try to seal up the bottom gap
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...c9a623b217.jpg
Not perfect, but pretty good. The tow strap didn'make things any easier.
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...c4120bd9cb.jpg
Added some coroplast "washers" to keep the board from sagging too much, although it was holding on pretty good without them.
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...a3f400e9f3.jpg


So, a couple days spent cutting, bending, wedging and trimming, but it's on there and hopefully going to be much more effective than my previous attempts. Of course it started pouring rain as I finished up today, so no testing so far. If anything this will overcool right now.


Random thing I thought I'd share. I picked this up a while back, but if you don't want to spill zip ties everywhere, you can cut a slit in the middle of the bag and they can't fall out but are still easy to access.
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...9e23b0966d.jpg

This duraflex front bumper has been the bane of my existence since I got the car. The PO used about 15 self tappers to get it secured. I wanted to avoid quick releases, but after making some slight adjustment to the fits I got some of the button style ones. I'll install those next time the bumper is off, if not before.

I added some brackets to help support the bumper, trying to close the gap with the hood. I cut up my old ECU mount and used that.

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...8ba7dfcfe1.jpg


Carnage from previous mounting. Most of these holes are from the PO's self tapper adventures.

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...87634acc38.jpg


We ended up with one side slightly higher than the hood and one side slightly lower, but the gap is the tightest its ever been. If/when I paint the car I will likely source an OEM bumper to throw on so it actually fits for once.

I'm guessing this is an NB2 bumper because the headlight's interfere with the bumper a bit, but it's good enough for now.

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...b2dd4f9d2d.jpg


I'll probably get it out tomorrow for a test drive and see how she goes, but I'd say the car is fully back together once again.

Fireindc Jan 3, 2025 04:04 PM

I dig it, I like the coroplast or whatever ducting you are using. One comment is that I've heard it's not the best to seal the intercooler to the mouth, but rather let the air over/around the intercooler through the radiator. It's how I have mine setup, at least, and it has treated me well. If you run into any cooling issues (you probably won't), this is something to keep in mind.

SimBa Jan 13, 2025 12:01 PM

Installed some dash switches for even more fake racecar goodness.

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...22cec36972.jpg


Sometimes I want to be a ricer and have some pops and bangs, more boost, etc... I wired these up to the Link and it was pretty easy to set one up to swap to a different boost map, ignition table and disable Overrun Fuel Cut. I'm not sure exactly what I'll end up using these for, but I do see a "race mode" switch being useful. I've always found the on/off throttle transition to be jerkier with Overrun enabled which isn't great for keeping the car stable in a corner. I would chalk this up to driving technique as well (IE, I'm stabbing the throttle). Link does a better job of this than the Speeduino did because the link tapers in some timing retard to the entry/exit of Overrun (which Speeduino added ~6 months ago as well) to smooth the transition. If nothing else it'll be interesting to see the differences in how the car behaves with and without it.

Other than that I've mostly been tinkering around with tuning and cleaning up a few small things here and there. I swapped out the vacuum T that I was using for the ECU reference line with a straight splice connector, added a reducer connector to the lines for evap, etc...

I'm still really impressed with the Link. Every time I go to enable a new feature/setting it seems to work really well right out of the box. For example, yesterday I was fiddling with idle settings and swapped from open loop to closed loop. I always ran open loop with ignition correction on the SpeedyEFI board, which worked fine, but when I had tried to dial in closed loop I could never get it to idle happily. That's probably an issue with my tuning ability more than the ECU, but I spent a good amount of time trying to get it working and it never did. On the Link I just enabled closed loop and it worked fine with the default settings. No noticeable oscillations so far. The RPMs have started to droop a bit when returning to idle now, but I assume that can be remedied pretty easily with some dashpot settings or changing the initial duty cycle on the IACV a bit.

Z_WAAAAAZ Jan 13, 2025 01:04 PM

Love it. The more switches and gauges in the racecar, the better. Makes onlookers think your car is probably fast (and honestly, what else is really important?).

Ducting looks like it's shaping up well too. Those holes in the bumper are probably just the PO trying to save some weight in non-critical areas.

SimBa Jan 13, 2025 01:37 PM

I don't think I have any photos of it, but when I first got the car there was a self tapper in every one of those holes. Must've been 5 or 6 holding the passenger side together. We can call it weight savings though :bigtu:

Fireindc Jan 13, 2025 03:15 PM

My 10ae nb1 which has never been in a front end collision has pretty bad bumper > hood gap. Worse than the 1990 car, that's for sure. Considered adjusting the hood to try and address, but it came from the factory like that and it' good enough for me. Nice work as usual.

SimBa Jan 21, 2025 12:42 AM

I haven't done much mechanically lately, but I've been doing a bunch of tuning. We're getting highs of about 0-2 C (32-37 F) right now and, as a "tuner", I'm not loving it. I've gotten the cold starts dialed in pretty well. The car will start within a few cranks under most conditions and idles pretty well, but I'm struggling to get the fuel corrections dialed in. I've changed a lot lately which probably didn't help, namely the ECU, Injectors and IAT sensor. Long story short I think I'm chasing my tail a bit. While it feels a little lazy, I'm leaning on closed loop a good bit to hit my lambda targets. I think I'll retune my fuel table when temps warm up a bit. For now things are working well enough, but not quite as well as I'd like. I'm also thinking about adding a flex fuel sensor. We only have a couple E85 pumps in our area, but until recently I didn't realize there was one pretty close to my house. I also learned that flex fuel can also measure fuel temp, which I think would be massive for adjusting fuel for cold and heat soaked injectors.

I swapped back to the IAT sensor that I ran on my old setup to see if that works better than the one provided with the Kraken kit. We'll see if that does anything. The bung in the Kraken kit isn't tapped too deep, so the sensor seems to stick out a good deal. Not sure how that would play into heat soaking, but it seems like the sensor should thread in deeper.
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...70b948eb51.jpg
Way more exposed threads than my old setup.



I figure I could get my tap out and get the sensor to thread in deeper, but if I'm going to do that I think I'd just pull the whole intercooler and tap the end tank. Hindsight is 20-20. My old setup didn't seem too sensitive to this issue, so I'm wondering if it's just a winter thing (I didn't run my old setup last winter since I was building the engine).

Rev 3 of the R8 COP seals came back from the library last week. I had an issue with one of the seals lifting out of the valve cover. I assume this was just due to heat cycling of the filament and a fairly air tight seal. The new ones shouldn't have that issue as they butt up against the coil pack which grips the spark plug very tightly. I'm still super stoked on this project. For one of the first parts I've drafted I'm super happy with how well it's turned out, especially since a set of these costs about $1 to print and I assume something aftermarket would be exponentially more expensive.



https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...a00445f68b.jpg
This is how the old seals would lift out of the valve cover. Not catastrophic, but not ideal.
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...932d350ffc.jpg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...2498fed2e0.jpg



Final, and exciting update. In the words of Troy Barnes, "Good news guys, I spent all my money!"
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...72e7ea4f9b.gif


https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...3a6f8d19c6.jpg


The classic 6 speed + 3.6. It'll be a little bit of work before they go in the car. I picked up the MR shifter from somebody on here but didn't realize that it was missing a couple bits, so I'm working with Bill over at MiataRoadster to source those. I leveraged that to get a better deal on the 6 speed since it didn't come with a shifter. I figure I'll get a buddy to weld a reinforcement plate to the diff, but will need to clean off the POR15 (?) coating from the PO, who is also a forum member.

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...a1a79d4754.gif

I put the FM Stage 1 clutch in a couple years back in anticipation of turboing the car. My goals now are ~350 WHP, but there's still a good amount to do before I get there. That'll be a fuel pump + wiring and new turbo at least. I've thrown a lot of money at the car lately and don't really want to throw more at it right now. My internal debate is if I'm swapping the trans, do I upgrade the clutch now and spend the money and possibly some drivability, or stick with the current clutch and spend some time with the current turbo/setup and know that when I want to move to a bigger turbo (maybe next year?) I'll probably need to do a clutch at the same time or shortly after.

There are other parts of the car I'd like to address (throttle body, flex fuel, additional sensors), and I'm also interested in seeing some more data on newer turbo's like the 22-350. I don't think I really need the upgraded clutch for the 2560, and it's still relatively new so pulling it seems like a bit of a waste IMO. Maybe I'll get the 5 speed out and remember how much of a pain pulling the trans is and change my mind, one of my autocross buddies has a SM 4 puck that he pulled because he didn't like the drivability, so I could always pick that up pretty easily/quickly.

Lots to think about. At the end of the day though the car is still a blast to drive. I took it through some snow up at my parents place this weekend and have been running around town in it most days of the week.

One last thing is that I've picked up a vibration in the front of the car on right hand turns when the suspension is a bit compressed. I did a quick look around today with the car on the ground and didn't see anything obvious, but I'll need to investigate further soon.

Ironhydroxide Jan 21, 2025 09:25 AM

Damn dude,
you're gonna make me work for that Winnemucca event aren't you?

nice progress I'm looking forwards to see how we line up.

Fireindc Jan 21, 2025 02:11 PM

That IAT sensor will definitely heatsoak. Not a deal breaker, but I tuned a friends car with IAT in that same location and couldn't believe how hot it would get. 140+* on a 80* day which made tuning hot restarts on his MS2.. futile.

I think you'll be fine with it there, but like you said the endtank mounting will be the fix for this if you have the same issue.

And I'd personally say 100% do the clutch now when you put the 6 speed in. As "easy" as a trans R & R is on these cars, once you have a dialed running car again you won't wanna tear it apart. Ask me how I know.

Z_WAAAAAZ Jan 21, 2025 04:41 PM

Damn dude. I know you said you haven't done much to the car mechanically recently, but from an outsider's POV, you are charging! Good sh*t haha. Love the R8 COP seal project. That's something currently outside of my wheelhouse but I'd like to learn eventually. Making specialty bits for pennies on the dollar is so sick.

As for the clutch conundrum, I'll echo Nate and say do it while the trans is out. I did the same thing with my NA: threw in an OEM clutch and lightweight flywheel before the car was turbo'd, then did the whole job again sans-flywheel four months later and mildly regretted not throwing an upgraded clutch the first time around.


Originally Posted by SimBa (Post 1660641)
one of my autocross buddies has a SM 4 puck that he pulled because he didn't like the drivability

As someone who doesn't usually mind or take drivability into account... the SM 4 puck drivability is a little gnarly. Very finite bite point to get the car moving without stalling and more than a little noise and jutter. I'm not saying don't do it, but a warning is at least in order haha. And no shade thrown to SM, I get that it's characteristic of the design. I bought another SM clutch for my NC once I decide to throw the 6 speed in but went with the organic full face disc this time around.

SimBa Jan 21, 2025 06:00 PM

Well I was just talking with that friend and he said I could have the clutch for "a favor down the road". He was just going to toss it, so that takes care of the not wanting to spend money side of things. Z, I read your post on the clutch and it worried me a bit. I drove that friends car with the FM stage 2 clutch and don't remember thinking much about it (IE it was pretty easy to get the hang of).

I currently have the FM stage 1 clutch. I'm not sure it would hold the power of the 2560 turned all the way up, especially if/when I get E85 figured out. I like this clutch and have found it really easy to drive.

I guess at this point, since that clutch fell into my lap, I'll run it and see what I think. If I don't like I'll end up doing a clutch job either way, so I guess it'll give me first hand experience if nothing else.

SlowTeg Jan 24, 2025 09:34 AM


Originally Posted by Fireindc (Post 1660665)
That IAT sensor will definitely heatsoak. Not a deal breaker, but I tuned a friends car with IAT in that same location and couldn't believe how hot it would get. 140+* on a 80* day which made tuning hot restarts on his MS2.. futile.

I think you'll be fine with it there, but like you said the endtank mounting will be the fix for this if you have the same issue.

Hmm interesting and good to note. I'm assuming this is only at low air speeds right? Once air gets moving faster through the system the IATs return to normal and the sensor isn't heatsoaked?

SlowTeg Jan 24, 2025 09:39 AM


Originally Posted by Z_WAAAAAZ (Post 1660671)
As someone who doesn't usually mind or take drivability into account... the SM 4 puck drivability is a little gnarly. Very finite bite point to get the car moving without stalling and more than a little noise and jutter. I'm not saying don't do it, but a warning is at least in order haha. And no shade thrown to SM, I get that it's characteristic of the design. I bought another SM clutch for my NC once I decide to throw the 6 speed in but went with the organic full face disc this time around.

Regarding the chatter of the clutch.. I have to wonder to what degree the lack of transmission mounts in this car, and the ability for the engine/tranny to rock back and forth a bit, contributes to the chatter/judder (as in makes it even worse). I've noticed my NB had this chatter/judder sort of feel even when it was bone stock which I find annoying. Especially in reverse. If you google miata clutch chatter it seems to be a common issue that is maybe exacerbated by the design of the drivetrain and the fact that it can move more w/o a mounted tranny..? Everyone tells me it's "normal" but maybe it's just a miata thing..

SimBa Jan 24, 2025 12:11 PM

Regarding the clutch, I've heard chatter mentioned by a few people specifically talking about the SM 4 Puck. Seems like that's going to be my path forward for now, so I'll do a review when it's in the car.

Correct on the topic of heat soak. Usually at low speeds, such as idling at a stop light. I have a few theories about what's going on and how to combat it.
  • First off, I don't have any heat shielding for the intake or turbo right now, so with the intake being on the same side as the manifold and turbo, it could just be the turbo sucking in hot air. With the vents directly above and ambient temps near freezing I don't think it should be as bad as I'm seeing.
  • The IAT sensor is behind the radiator/AC Fan. I don't think the AC fan should be kicking on, but I haven't changed the ECU settings around that, so it's possible the AC fan is blowing hot air right onto the IAT sensor. Not sure how big of an effect that would have, but since the sensor doesn't thread in very far there's a good amount of exposed brass which would be getting hit. I've thought about trying to wrap the sensor in some reflective tape to see if that had any effect. That would be more for science than to fix the issue.
  • I got a new sensor with the Kraken kit. I thought it might be a cheaper sensor that was more susceptible to heat soaking. I swapped back to the old sensor but I haven't checked the data enough to see if it made a difference.
Isolating the IAT sensor in the datalogs makes it look more extreme, but also highlights the issue pretty well. Look at how that IAT rises when the car was idling. Again, it could be the intake sucking in hot turbo air as well, I just need to do more research/testing.
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...f50dd917c3.png

Fireindc Jan 24, 2025 12:26 PM


Originally Posted by SlowTeg (Post 1660769)
Hmm interesting and good to note. I'm assuming this is only at low air speeds right? Once air gets moving faster through the system the IATs return to normal and the sensor isn't heatsoaked?

Yes, basically only at idle or after a drive letting it sit (hot restart), makes fueling whacky since the air is nowhere near as hot as the sensor thinks.

SimBa Jan 24, 2025 12:32 PM

Here's another log I had. You can see the IAT got to 28 C (82 F) after it sat for a bit. Lowest it got to was 9 C (~50 F) but I would assume ambient on that day was at highest about 5 C (~40 F). You can see how it correlates with how quick the car is moving.

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...937457561d.png

SimBa Jan 24, 2025 12:44 PM

Also, thoughts on reinforcing the diff housing? I had planned on doing it since I just got it and I figure I'm not going to want to pull it back out.

I'm hesitating now. Reading into it more makes me feel like I'm going to destroy something more expensive if I get rear ended. I suppose in a collision that bad the car will be inoperable either way, either with a broken diff housing or a destroyed ppf, trans, engine, etc...
I also don't want to get out to one of our further events, break the housing on a launch and not be able to source a new one or repair the old one.

Just curious if other people have thought through this and their conclusions. I'll probably end up reinforcing it and hoping for the best.

Ironhydroxide Jan 24, 2025 12:52 PM

My opinion is just do the reinforcement.

Sure if you get rearended, or hit something hard enough in front, the diff will either not break, or break at a higher force. likely causing the PPF to bend instead, and the engine/trans not to drop at the back and may move upwards instead.
But, in reality, at that point you're likely buying a new chassis anyways. and personally I don't feel it's all that dangerous that the engine/trans isn't dropping the couple degrees in such a situation.

also, I have drawings of weld in plates, if you're wanting to farm it out to one of the waterjet places instead of buying from someone who does exactly that and upcharges.


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