Toyota Pickup Engine Swap B.S.
09-16-2015, 10:03 PM
#1
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Toyota Pickup Engine Swap B.S.
A while ago, I replaced the brakes on my miata, and then this happened:
https://www.miataturbo.net/insert-bs...r-fight-84128/
I thought about the swap for a long time, and in the end, I decided to ignore everyone and buy two of these:
I got lucky on craigslist, and scored two 7MGEs; one with an auto transmission, one with manual for 400 and 500 respectively.
Both also included the wiring harness and ECU.
This is going to take a while, as I'm currently working two jobs, but I want to get the ball rolling and solidify plans.
First, here's good old Pluto:
Pluto is my fairly clean daily. It has around 280K on the clock, but not exactly going strong.
The 3.0 V6 must go. It's slow. It's inefficient. It's unreliable in the winter.
I live in Indiana.
Pluto is getting the 7MGE with the auto trans. It is remaining an auto because it will be primarily for my wife to drive when she needs it in the winter. I'll be going through this truck pretty thoroughly and keeping it parked in the garage when it's not in use.
I have several options to make this work, and I'm not sure what route to take yet.
I will not use the A340 in the truck currently because it is just as much as a turd as the engine. This particular version has a chain driven transfer case that is integrated with the main body of the transmission.
Option one is to use the trans that came with the engine and use this adapter to attach a toyota gear driven t-case, which I have.
This is probably the best option, but it is expensive.
The second is to use a different A340 with a passenger side drop t-case, but it would be chain driven. Not really a big deal for a light duty truck.
I could also use an AW4 from a jeep and use an atlas or dana 300 T-case.
And now, I present Don Givnafox.
I traded a guy a rifle for Don.
It has a sploded 3vze with a manual trans. I needed it mostly for interior pieces and a second set of wheels.
It's rusty, but the frame is good and it rolls. Perfect for making a dumb toy.
My thoughts are to use a jeep AX15 mated to a dana 300.
I also want to try my hand at tube bending and make something like this:
Tentative plan goes like this:
1. Pull blown engine from Don, sell heads, intake, etc.
2. Obtain all the parts for Pluto and assemble.
3. Pull running engine from Pluto and drop into Don.
4. Fit 7M in pluto and wire everything up.
5. Build 7M for Don with head studs and metal head gasket.
6. Run NA for a while...
7. Body work on Pluto.
8. Dumb things on Don.
https://www.miataturbo.net/insert-bs...r-fight-84128/
I thought about the swap for a long time, and in the end, I decided to ignore everyone and buy two of these:
I got lucky on craigslist, and scored two 7MGEs; one with an auto transmission, one with manual for 400 and 500 respectively.
Both also included the wiring harness and ECU.
This is going to take a while, as I'm currently working two jobs, but I want to get the ball rolling and solidify plans.
First, here's good old Pluto:
Pluto is my fairly clean daily. It has around 280K on the clock, but not exactly going strong.
The 3.0 V6 must go. It's slow. It's inefficient. It's unreliable in the winter.
I live in Indiana.
Pluto is getting the 7MGE with the auto trans. It is remaining an auto because it will be primarily for my wife to drive when she needs it in the winter. I'll be going through this truck pretty thoroughly and keeping it parked in the garage when it's not in use.
I have several options to make this work, and I'm not sure what route to take yet.
I will not use the A340 in the truck currently because it is just as much as a turd as the engine. This particular version has a chain driven transfer case that is integrated with the main body of the transmission.
Option one is to use the trans that came with the engine and use this adapter to attach a toyota gear driven t-case, which I have.
This is probably the best option, but it is expensive.
The second is to use a different A340 with a passenger side drop t-case, but it would be chain driven. Not really a big deal for a light duty truck.
I could also use an AW4 from a jeep and use an atlas or dana 300 T-case.
And now, I present Don Givnafox.
I traded a guy a rifle for Don.
It has a sploded 3vze with a manual trans. I needed it mostly for interior pieces and a second set of wheels.
It's rusty, but the frame is good and it rolls. Perfect for making a dumb toy.
My thoughts are to use a jeep AX15 mated to a dana 300.
I also want to try my hand at tube bending and make something like this:
Tentative plan goes like this:
1. Pull blown engine from Don, sell heads, intake, etc.
2. Obtain all the parts for Pluto and assemble.
3. Pull running engine from Pluto and drop into Don.
4. Fit 7M in pluto and wire everything up.
5. Build 7M for Don with head studs and metal head gasket.
6. Run NA for a while...
7. Body work on Pluto.
8. Dumb things on Don.
Last edited by Monk; 09-17-2015 at 08:03 AM.
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09-18-2015, 09:27 PM
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Opinion time.
As I said, I have several options to run the auto tranny.
For simplicity's sake, using the adapter linked above should be fairly easy. I can use the stock cressida engine and transmission computers to simplify wiring and get a gear driven transfer case to boot. $700 though... That's the price of several available AW4s or A340s that Icould adapt to work fairly easily.
The drawback to adapting something else is figuring out how to control it correctly.
Standalone controllers do exist, but that would leave me with "full manual control" rather than actual automatic shifting.
An AW4 with Dana 300 would be ideal, but I'm unsure about what inputs the jeep trans computer needs to operate correctly.
I'm at the firehouse tomorrow, so I should have plenty of time to find out.
As I said, I have several options to run the auto tranny.
For simplicity's sake, using the adapter linked above should be fairly easy. I can use the stock cressida engine and transmission computers to simplify wiring and get a gear driven transfer case to boot. $700 though... That's the price of several available AW4s or A340s that Icould adapt to work fairly easily.
The drawback to adapting something else is figuring out how to control it correctly.
Standalone controllers do exist, but that would leave me with "full manual control" rather than actual automatic shifting.
An AW4 with Dana 300 would be ideal, but I'm unsure about what inputs the jeep trans computer needs to operate correctly.
I'm at the firehouse tomorrow, so I should have plenty of time to find out.
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09-19-2015, 04:02 PM
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Thanks to this thread, it appears that I can swap the output shaft and tail housing from an AW4 into the A340E out of the cressida and run it off the car's transmission controller.
Then I can use this adapter to bolt on a Dana 19, 20, or 300. This also allows me to clock the t-case wherever I need it.
Then I can use this adapter to bolt on a Dana 19, 20, or 300. This also allows me to clock the t-case wherever I need it.
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09-22-2015, 12:15 AM
#10
I used to have a Cressida with a 7M that I built up. I can tell you rebuilding them is pretty easy. If you plan to ever make any power with the 7M, I have pretty much 3 suggestions:
1. Do the supra oil pump setup. You can buy the pump new, and then there's a company that sells the pickup tube and hose needed to do the conversion with your oil pan.
2. MLS head gasket, I see you already know.
3. Port the cylinder head. The difference in power between the 7M and 2JZ is all in the cylinder head. The ports and combustion chambers are laughably bad stock. I spent maybe 20 hrs total just making the 7M head not suck so bad, and I swear the car gained 30whp easy. There were small gains down low, wasn't that noticeable maybe 5-10%, just enough to notice. Up top it was a different engine, it just kept making torque....
Stock. Look how shrouded the intake valves are! Just a big wall blocking them.
Unshrouded. I didn't touch the exhaust, just went for easy power on intake side.
1. Do the supra oil pump setup. You can buy the pump new, and then there's a company that sells the pickup tube and hose needed to do the conversion with your oil pan.
2. MLS head gasket, I see you already know.
3. Port the cylinder head. The difference in power between the 7M and 2JZ is all in the cylinder head. The ports and combustion chambers are laughably bad stock. I spent maybe 20 hrs total just making the 7M head not suck so bad, and I swear the car gained 30whp easy. There were small gains down low, wasn't that noticeable maybe 5-10%, just enough to notice. Up top it was a different engine, it just kept making torque....
Stock. Look how shrouded the intake valves are! Just a big wall blocking them.
Unshrouded. I didn't touch the exhaust, just went for easy power on intake side.
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09-22-2015, 06:18 AM
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Right now, I'm planning on using an 80s yota axle, but if a wild D60 appeared, I would jump on it.
There is a very good D60 writeup here.
Pluto will be left mostly stock, so ~200HP/190 lb/ft.
We're going to shoot for 240/240 with Don.
For reference, the 3VZE made about 145/180 stock, and is an all around turd of an engine.
Mine is down even further than that. I'll post a video of a 0-60 pull later.
It's embarrassingly slow.
That's some good info, thanks. The engine with the manual tranny came from a Supra. Still necessary to modify the oil pump?
I need to retain the cressida oil pan for Pluto (mid-sump), but the rear sump should be fine if I do the solid axle swap on Don.
There is a very good D60 writeup here.
Pluto will be left mostly stock, so ~200HP/190 lb/ft.
We're going to shoot for 240/240 with Don.
For reference, the 3VZE made about 145/180 stock, and is an all around turd of an engine.
Mine is down even further than that. I'll post a video of a 0-60 pull later.
It's embarrassingly slow.
I used to have a Cressida with a 7M that I built up. I can tell you rebuilding them is pretty easy. If you plan to ever make any power with the 7M, I have pretty much 3 suggestions:
1. Do the supra oil pump setup. You can buy the pump new, and then there's a company that sells the pickup tube and hose needed to do the conversion with your oil pan.
2. MLS head gasket, I see you already know.
3. Port the cylinder head. The difference in power between the 7M and 2JZ is all in the cylinder head. The ports and combustion chambers are laughably bad stock. I spent maybe 20 hrs total just making the 7M head not suck so bad, and I swear the car gained 30whp easy. There were small gains down low, wasn't that noticeable maybe 5-10%, just enough to notice. Up top it was a different engine, it just kept making torque....
Stock. Look how shrouded the intake valves are! Just a big wall blocking them.
Unshrouded. I didn't touch the exhaust, just went for easy power on intake side.
1. Do the supra oil pump setup. You can buy the pump new, and then there's a company that sells the pickup tube and hose needed to do the conversion with your oil pan.
2. MLS head gasket, I see you already know.
3. Port the cylinder head. The difference in power between the 7M and 2JZ is all in the cylinder head. The ports and combustion chambers are laughably bad stock. I spent maybe 20 hrs total just making the 7M head not suck so bad, and I swear the car gained 30whp easy. There were small gains down low, wasn't that noticeable maybe 5-10%, just enough to notice. Up top it was a different engine, it just kept making torque....
Stock. Look how shrouded the intake valves are! Just a big wall blocking them.
Unshrouded. I didn't touch the exhaust, just went for easy power on intake side.
I need to retain the cressida oil pan for Pluto (mid-sump), but the rear sump should be fine if I do the solid axle swap on Don.
Last edited by Monk; 10-01-2015 at 08:46 AM.
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10-15-2015, 09:46 PM
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A set of Dana 44s also appeared.
I think I'm going to scoop up the 44s even though they are only marginally stronger than toy axles (depending on who you ask), because the gear ratios are matched, I won't have to shorten them, and I can get them for $200 total.
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10-15-2015, 10:31 PM
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This is my truck. I got it because of my (at the time not yet turbo'd) miata.
I was running JRSC with a 9psi pulley with water injection on my 96. I blew up that motor when the water ran dry. Then I hastily put my 94 in service with a quick timing belt change. I fucked up the crank seal, and started slinging oil everywhere. I knew I was on borrowed time, but my other daily (90 Taurus SHO) was in the middle of an engine swap - so I ran with it. Five weeks later, I downshifted coming off the interstate and stripped the teeth off the timing belt. Towed into work, bitching up a storm. Coworker offered me his truck that had sat for a couple of years, and I expected a complete beater. 22re, 5spd, 4x4 - I did have to tow it home, squirrel had eaten the wiring harness, gas tank had some rust, and clutch needed replacing.
It's currently my daily and just crossed 200k miles. It's got a little bit of knock on a cold start, so I've been thinking about doing the 7MG(T?) swap as well.. but on the other hand, the 22RE is damn near unkillable.
I'll be watching this with interest - but I'll need to clear out some projects before I take on another engine swap.
I was running JRSC with a 9psi pulley with water injection on my 96. I blew up that motor when the water ran dry. Then I hastily put my 94 in service with a quick timing belt change. I fucked up the crank seal, and started slinging oil everywhere. I knew I was on borrowed time, but my other daily (90 Taurus SHO) was in the middle of an engine swap - so I ran with it. Five weeks later, I downshifted coming off the interstate and stripped the teeth off the timing belt. Towed into work, bitching up a storm. Coworker offered me his truck that had sat for a couple of years, and I expected a complete beater. 22re, 5spd, 4x4 - I did have to tow it home, squirrel had eaten the wiring harness, gas tank had some rust, and clutch needed replacing.
It's currently my daily and just crossed 200k miles. It's got a little bit of knock on a cold start, so I've been thinking about doing the 7MG(T?) swap as well.. but on the other hand, the 22RE is damn near unkillable.
I'll be watching this with interest - but I'll need to clear out some projects before I take on another engine swap.
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10-15-2015, 10:56 PM
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The 7mge is damn near bolt in for your truck with 5m motor mounts.
4banger trucks are actually a better starting point for this particular swap if you want to keep it simple, but I'm going a little off the deep end with mine.
I'll do some measuring of the input from the supra W58 compared to the W56 for you to verify the information I've read other forums is correct.
Nice looking truck by the way.
4banger trucks are actually a better starting point for this particular swap if you want to keep it simple, but I'm going a little off the deep end with mine.
I'll do some measuring of the input from the supra W58 compared to the W56 for you to verify the information I've read other forums is correct.
Nice looking truck by the way.
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10-15-2015, 11:24 PM
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What are ya, chicken?
Just last week I decided to organize my massive backup keyring (OEM Keys on the backup, copies on my person). To do this, I bought the matchbox/hotwheels version of each of my vehicles and putting a keyring on each. For my truck?
And while I am tempted to start hunting down a block now.. I'm in the middle of an LFX and LS3 swap. The Yota is 100% stock with a new stereo, CB, line-x'd bed, tool box, and LED strip lighting for the bed (probably my favorite mod of all, makes late night loading so much easier).
Just last week I decided to organize my massive backup keyring (OEM Keys on the backup, copies on my person). To do this, I bought the matchbox/hotwheels version of each of my vehicles and putting a keyring on each. For my truck?
And while I am tempted to start hunting down a block now.. I'm in the middle of an LFX and LS3 swap. The Yota is 100% stock with a new stereo, CB, line-x'd bed, tool box, and LED strip lighting for the bed (probably my favorite mod of all, makes late night loading so much easier).
Last edited by gooflophaze; 10-15-2015 at 11:59 PM.
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10-19-2015, 07:13 PM
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I measured the input shaft in both the W56 and W58 for you.
No surprises there, they are identical. It's not worth posting my potato pics, so just take my word for it. Both are 5 1/4" as measured by my harbor freight tape measure.
I'm likely going to use an R series trans, so I may be willing to give you a deal on the Bell housing, flywheel and clutch if you're interested.
No surprises there, they are identical. It's not worth posting my potato pics, so just take my word for it. Both are 5 1/4" as measured by my harbor freight tape measure.
I'm likely going to use an R series trans, so I may be willing to give you a deal on the Bell housing, flywheel and clutch if you're interested.
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10-21-2015, 09:50 AM
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The Dana 44s turned out to not be Dana 44s.
Luckily, I caught it before either myself or Concealer404 made a trip.
I did find a legitimate set, but they are out of a dodge pickup, and spring perch spacing and vaccum disconnect make them less desirable.
Fortunately, I found a Toyota axle for a good price.
Ben is picking it up for me on Monday.
I'm pretty set on this kit for the swap.
I'm just going to do high steering and a u bolt flip all in one shot.
I'll beef up the birfs, and it should be plenty strong. The extra width would have been nice, but its not a huge deal.
Luckily, I caught it before either myself or Concealer404 made a trip.
I did find a legitimate set, but they are out of a dodge pickup, and spring perch spacing and vaccum disconnect make them less desirable.
Fortunately, I found a Toyota axle for a good price.
Ben is picking it up for me on Monday.
I'm pretty set on this kit for the swap.
I'm just going to do high steering and a u bolt flip all in one shot.
I'll beef up the birfs, and it should be plenty strong. The extra width would have been nice, but its not a huge deal.
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