When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
like the updates so far. sort of reminds me of my budget NA6 turbo build I did in college 4 years ago. Ironically enough, i saw the ad and considered buying that NB1 to flip too LOL
Nice to see another WI member. I live around the south end of Milwaukee and there's a decent group of miata guys i typically go AutoX with during Miwaukee SCCA events. Feel free to drop me a line and we should meet up at an event sometime! looks like you did a Milwaukee mile event if i'm not mistaken? We also head up to shawano and RA for events on occasion.
Padlock, I saw some of your build in the past. The donor car was sitting for awhile and just tempting me.... it sucks to really sit on the car all winter but I think it should be able to sell for a nice price come spring. Don't tell any one I stole the turbo..... shhhh
I used to autoX, now I mainly focus on track time. I typically try to do all the Milwaukee Mile events, and so far have done a couple Blackhawk days as well. The NW Shelby club puts on decent weekend events down there at a solid price. I think it was something like $200 for 5 session or so? Come spring Ill try to remember to let you know when Im heading to the Mile events, its always fun to chat with other miata owners. I see you have a splitter and working on design #2, do you have a template you're using or any pointers you could share on wire mounting etc. I am referencing an old drawing I think from Braineack from years ago. I haven't started, but my plan was to go with birch for a preliminary splitter and a quick release option sounds very tempting.
I used to autoX, now I mainly focus on track time. I typically try to do all the Milwaukee Mile events, and so far have done a couple Blackhawk days as well. The NW Shelby club puts on decent weekend events down there at a solid price. I think it was something like $200 for 5 session or so? Come spring Ill try to remember to let you know when Im heading to the Mile events, its always fun to chat with other miata owners. I see you have a splitter and working on design #2, do you have a template you're using or any pointers you could share on wire mounting etc. I am referencing an old drawing I think from Braineack from years ago. I haven't started, but my plan was to go with birch for a preliminary splitter and a quick release option sounds very tempting.
I used AutoX as a cheap alternative to get my setup dialed in 2017, which worked great. Unfortunately didn't make it out to many events in 2018 due to other life obligations and poor weather. Blackhawk has definitely been on the list of places I want to get to as well as the big track at RA, but before I get to that point I need to get safety stuff (both for myself and the car) squared away which likely wont happen until middle of this year at best given where financial priorities are right now.
I definitely have some pointers I can share. On design #1 I was able to have the whole front bumper/splitter setup off with 4-10mm bolts, 2-7mm bolts, 2-quick release fork terminals, and 2-quick release Dclips. Took about 5 minutes total from start to finish to install or remove which wasn't bad at all, but I'm looking to improve that on design #2 which is still in process. Toss me a PM and we can chat on it. Might have some things you'd be interested in.
I got a few good pictures and tips from Padlock, very helpful. This weekend I got a rough splitter cut, painted, and some hardware sourced. I am going to utilize Menards Racing Center for this set up. Couple eye bolts, some high strength cable, and a few turnbuckles for adjustability and I should have a decent splitter for an ok cost. Splitter is currently being painted gloss black with Rustoleum tractor paint.
Is there an optimal splitter size I should be shooting for? Padlock mentioned a 4" splitter effectively maxed out what the BF wing could deliver on the max setting to keep the car balanced. For a low boost HPDE car, would something more like a 3" or even a 2" splitter be better suited? I will have a bit more hp this season, but I don't need Formula 1 levels of aero on this thing.
You wanna balance drag and aero, so a lot depends on your track, power level, and grip level. Like if you're at a drag strip you'd want zero splitter and just an air dam. Short tight AX course, yeah 4" splitter and zero ride height. Splitter height? Whatever. Most likely you're somewhere inbetween. I'd start at 3" with 3" splitter height and see how balanced it feels with your setup. In my limited experience that's a decent middle ground.
Our race car was 4" but also stupid high, and felt great. We're now trying less splitter but lower, hoping to keep the downforce but decrease drag. The taller air dam section between the splitter and the ducting opening helps with that too.
Here's the old, lots of overhang, lots of height, and a piece of plastic to try and keep some heat in the car.
New, less overhang, lower height, trying to optimize downforce by increasing the airdam area between splitter/ducting. Also ditched cannards in favor of just using the air dam to cover the wheels.
I only have experiences with my 4" setup using front spats and a GV rep lip like I mentioned, but trying out a 4" setup and having the ability to trim it down to a 3" or 2" is probably your best bet. I'm guessing you'll fall in the 2-3" zone like curly has shown (albeit without the air dam). FWIW, I ran my splitter 1.5" off the ground at the center of the car and it did have a slight rake which theoretically should increase the down force acting on it. I have no personal data points showing the rake adversely impacts the balance of the car, but now I'm moving to a completely new aero setup so i'll have to start over again with aero balance.
Thanks for the input. So over the weekend I made a few tweaks. The splitter was not even around the front lip so I ended up trimming it for a smoother shape, then installed my hardware for loose mounting. I don't have it 100% installed yet due to still needing to find my oil leak. I think im going to start at about a 3" splitter, then add aluminum spats on the sides to cover the wheels. Ill get pictures once I get them finalized.
Oil leak, I suspected the oil return line is the culprit, so I cleaned everything up and let the car idle for a few minutes, I noticed oil in two spots. One seems to be up the line, near the turbo itself. I couldn't see it, so Im going to completely remove the line, clean it all up, and try to seal it with permatex. The second is in the picture below. It appears to be leaking out the rear of the large nut onto the smaller pipe (not sure the right terminology for these parts). This should be a pressure fitting, so im not sure how it can leak out the rear of this besides simply not being tight enough? Is this a part that typically leaks? I don't see how adding a thread sealant here will do anything since it leaks around the back. But I am open to suggestions or thoughts.
The seal of that relies on two 37* surfaces to seal. You can try snugging it more, roughly a 1/4 turn past finger tight is a really rough guideline. But that fitting looks pretty beat up, it may need to be replaced.
Another question for smart people: Brakes. I ran O'reillys ceramic budget pads, fresh fluid, stainless lines, and stock sport brakes for 2 years on the track with 205 Federal 595RS-RR tires, this was my learning set up and I felt like I beat the snot out of it. Last fall I put 4 new reman calipers on, fresh fluid, and the StopTech Sport pads which are advertised as a light duty track pad. I did one HPDE with these and had no issues. My question is, how much brakes do I need for a light turbo setup pushing 150-175hp? I also will have a splitter, and 225 Federal tires this year. I am not even on pure track pads, yet, but I worry more hp and more grip is going to possibly overshoot my existing braking system. I see a few options:
1. do nothing, hope the brakes hold up as its all brand new
2. swap dedicated track pads into the car
3. I can steal the Flyin Miata LBBK from my donor car, however it appears to be mainly for autocross, not track work, so I don't know if its that much of an upgrade over my current set up
4. Go full BBK - however I can't do this as its out of the budget.
Last edited by Swanpuppy; 01-14-2019 at 12:12 PM.
Reason: more info
If it's leaking from both ends, I would replace both fittings and the line. I know it seems expensive at $10-15 per fitting and a couple feet of SS line, but it's worth it to not have a nasty leak. With the heat those lines see, they should be replaced every couple years anyways. Do NOT buy ebay fittings, get name brand fittings like aeroquip or Earls.
If you put reman'd calipers on, you're already on borrowed time. The ST sports will be ok for half a fast session, maybe a full session if you baby them or aren't very fast. Sport brakes are fine, once you're tired of the pad taper, rotor cost, crappy pad selection, and fried calipers, move on to a decent BBK like StopTech's 11" kit.
Curly, do you think the FM LBBK is a worthwhile upgrade over my sport brakes? It has the stock BP-20 and BP10 pads in it now, but I could get this kit for effectively free off my donor car. I don't gain rotor size over sport brakes, but the caliper should have better heat shedding abilities.
I was under the impression a large majority of turbo miata track drivers use stock 1.8 brakes with G loc or equivalent track only style pads? I am just trying to figure out if it I can use track pads, or if some sort of a BBK is a MUST have to be safe.
The stock 1.8 brakes I like a lot, as long as you get decent calipers. About 50% of reman'd units are bad out of the box in one way or another, the other 50% last maybe a quarter as long as your original ones did.
Pros of 1.8 brakes: great pad selection, CHEAP rotors, just fine for HPDE's with a track pad
Cons of 1.8 brakes: pad taper, will over heat with longer sessions/more power, smallish size
Pros of sport brakes: larger rotor
Cons of sport brakes: pad taper, not much more thermal protection, expensive compared to regular 1.8 rotors, less pad selection
Pros of LBBK: cheap caliper replacements, slightly less pad taper
cons of lbbk: uses expensive sport rotors, shitty wilwood calipers*, again not much more thermal protection over a 1.8 rotor
My suggestion would be to run the LBBK cause you have it, but once you're not happy with it, don't waste money on anything else, just get some stoptech calipers on there. Throw the stock pads away, get some honest track pads, my personal suggestion is Cobalt xr3 fronts, xr5 rears.
*I work on a lot of track cars, and the wilwoods just don't seem to last. Pistons don't retract without cracking the bleeder valve open, or at all, they always come in squeaking, and you can see them flex when someone presses on the brake pedal. I much prefer StopTech, Alcon, or AP Racing.
The stock 1.8 brakes I like a lot, as long as you get decent calipers. About 50% of reman'd units are bad out of the box in one way or another, the other 50% last maybe a quarter as long as your original ones did.
Pros of 1.8 brakes: great pad selection, CHEAP rotors, just fine for HPDE's with a track pad
Cons of 1.8 brakes: pad taper, will over heat with longer sessions/more power, smallish size
Pros of sport brakes: larger rotor
Cons of sport brakes: pad taper, not much more thermal protection, expensive compared to regular 1.8 rotors, less pad selection
Pros of LBBK: cheap caliper replacements, slightly less pad taper
cons of lbbk: uses expensive sport rotors, shitty wilwood calipers*, again not much more thermal protection over a 1.8 rotor
My suggestion would be to run the LBBK cause you have it, but once you're not happy with it, don't waste money on anything else, just get some stoptech calipers on there. Throw the stock pads away, get some honest track pads, my personal suggestion is Cobalt xr3 fronts, xr5 rears.
*I work on a lot of track cars, and the wilwoods just don't seem to last. Pistons don't retract without cracking the bleeder valve open, or at all, they always come in squeaking, and you can see them flex when someone presses on the brake pedal. I much prefer StopTech, Alcon, or AP Racing.
I shouldn't say the LBBK uses sport rotors, I just meant that im not going to an 11.75" rotor with the LBBK from my understanding of the FM website, it is simply shedding some weight and a hopefully heat a little faster.
So really, a mild turbo build like mine should be ok with 1.8 or 1.8 sport brakes and a proper track pad. You almost make it sound like swapping the LBBK is in no way worth it since the caliper itself sucks, and can fail quickly, etc. If I have the choice of a crappy reman caliper thats brand new, or a LBBK that has unknown history and life expectancy and minimal improvements over sport brakes, I don't see an upside to swapping the LBBK over except for some bling. Both set ups will require new track pads.
I'd swap the LBBK over onto your car solely from a resale standpoint. Whenever you upgrade to a proper BBK, sell of the LBBK for more than you'd get for your OEM parts. Just my .02
Resale is a good point. Im on the fence about this.... Ill do a bit more reading and see what options exist for sport brake track pads. I have been reading that some people can burn out a set of pads in a weekend, others it takes a season or two. I want to balance long term consumable costs, but going to a 'proper BBK' at $1300 plus is just way outside whats possible for me at this point.
That looks correct. I'm having issues telling if that's -8 or -10, but other than that, make one end, cut it ~6" long, then mark and cut the other end. Looks like it'll be a little longer because the 45* fitting you listed looks a little more compact.
Small update: Oil line parts should arrive today, so hopefully I can get that made and the turbo re installed this weekend.
I decided to swap the FM LBBK onto my car, after looking and ordering a new lug key 3 times online trying to find the right size, I got the donor car's wheels off. The brake lines looked a little discolored, but the rotor, calipers, everything looked dang near brand new. I think these are the fancy expensive FM rotors. Plus I have a full spare set of pads for all 4 corners. I currently have the fronts swapped over and will hopefully get the rears swapped this weekend as well. It went fairly easily, the brake dust shield needed to be trimmed slightly. After that, I will need the proportioning valve and a good brake flush. The plan is to get a set of BP-40 pads for the front and run the BP-20s on the rear and use the valve to dial in the pressure. I am open to suggestions on brake pads for these. It looks like a pad swap will be very easy, so I can swap pads at the track, but I really do not want to deal with corrosive dust.
Wow. So I have never had to remove the parking brake cables before, what a PITA. It didn't help the donor car parking brakes was all fubared and had to be completely removed from the car. Anyways.
I have all 4 corners done, however I need to fish the parking brake lines back through the body of the car to be reattached. Does anyone have suggestions? I was thinking of using fish tape for electrical wires to try and pull them back up. It seems like a tough job considering youre blindly fishing the lines up to a dime sized hole.
My main questions is the proportioning valve. Here is a picture of the valve on the donor car:
However this is what my car looks like:
It seems to me I can still install the valve, just the adjustment **** will face straight down. Is there any issue with reinstalling my stock valve into the 99' donor? Was the location simply moved as years went one or are they actually different parts?
Update. Parking brakes are complete, all 4 corners done. I swapped the prop valve over. Just had to bend the lines slightly to make it fit and get the adjustment **** in a usable position. It didn't look like it would work, but once you start taking it apart it becomes obvious.
I fired the car up yesterday with my new oil line, so far it appears there are no fluid leaks. I do have to tighten the downpipe a bit more, and my exhaust has a leak midway down, I tried to re use the gasket and that didn't seem to work. At this point I will get the exhaust finished up, then I need new tires installed, alignment, and check my tune come spring time. My splitter is complete and fits great, but I will wait to fully install it until after my alignment.
I am trying to do some research on brake pad options for these calipers. I have 2 sets of BP-20s and 2 of BP-10s. I know there are a ton of pad options for these 7012 Wilwoods, but no one seems to have any experience with the BP-40 track pads. My thought was to toss BP-20s in the rear and a set of the 40's up front, simply because I have pads already available. If there are other front suggestions for a 160-170hp HPDE miata I would like to hear it. $130 for BP-40s seemed like a good price.
01-03-2019, 07:36 AM
0
f:1
