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The 14 Defining Characteristics Of Fascism
http://www.rense.com/general37/fascism.htm
This is actually such an excellent article that it deserves it's own topic IMO. This is a very interesting article done by a respected academic on the topic, and it has very interesting unintended results. I would love to hear some debate on this and it's application to modern government. I especially found the point interesting in that a classical tenet of fascism throughout all of the fascist governments we've had in our history is a continually growing closer marriage of religion and state, but it also had excellent commentary on cronyism and corporatism, plus several other topics. As an example, 9. Corporate Power is Protected - The industrial and business aristocracy of a fascist nation often are the ones who put the government leaders into power, creating a mutually beneficial business/government relationship and power elite. |
9. Corporate Power is Protected - The industrial and business aristocracy of a fascist nation often are the ones who put the government leaders into power, creating a mutually beneficial business/government relationship and power elite. |
Originally Posted by Braineack
(Post 859480)
false. only republicans can be fascists; youre such a troll.
If Person B tells me I have to give up my economic rights for protection, I'd argue they are a fascist. Or have you forgotten I am about as diametrically opposed to both parties as one can be, Brainy? I've told you before - Leftiest scream I'm a Righty, Righties scream I'm a Lefty when I'm neither. This forum is just slanted so ridiculously far right that it makes anyone not extreme right appear on the left. |
Originally Posted by blaen99
(Post 859482)
Or have you forgotten I am about as diametrically opposed to both parties as one can be, Brainy?
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Originally Posted by Braineack
(Post 859483)
how could one remember?
Libertarian/Classical Liberal beliefs do not belong on the left/right scale any longer, sadly, due to how politics have evolved in this country. |
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1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism - Fascist regimes tend to make constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia. Flags are seen everywhere, as are flag symbols on clothing and in public displays. https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1333652125 https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1333652125 2. Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights - Because of fear of enemies and the need for security, the people in fascist regimes are persuaded that human rights can be ignored in certain cases because of "need." The people tend to look the other way or even approve of torture, summary executions, assassinations, long incarcerations of prisoners, etc. 3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause - The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial , ethnic or religious minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists, etc. 4. Supremacy of the Military - Even when there are widespread domestic problems, the military is given a disproportionate amount of government funding, and the domestic agenda is neglected. Soldiers and military service are glamorized. https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1333652125 6. Controlled Mass Media - Sometimes to media is directly controlled by the government, but in other cases, the media is indirectly controlled by government regulation, or sympathetic media spokespeople and executives. Censorship, especially in war time, is very common. "This bears on your reporting," President Obama said to journalists. "I think that there is oftentimes the impulse to suggest that if the two parties are disagreeing then they're equally at fault and the truth lies somewhere in the middle. And an equivalence is presented which I think reinforces peoples' cynicism about Washington in general. This is not one of those situations where there's an equivalency." "As all of you are doing your reporting, I think it's important to remember that the positions that I am taking now on the budget and a host of other issues. if we had been having this discussion 20 years ago or even 15 years ago … would've been considered squarely centrist positions," Obama said a few moments later. 7. Obsession with National Security - Fear is used as a motivational tool by the government over the masses. https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1333652125 8. Religion and Government are Intertwined - Governments in fascist nations tend to use the most common religion in the nation as a tool to manipulate public opinion. Religious rhetoric and terminology is common from government leaders, even when the major tenets of the religion are diametrically opposed to the government's policies or actions. "NASA Administrator Charles Bolden said in a recent interview that his “foremost” mission as the head of America’s space exploration agency is to improve relations with the Muslim world." 9. Corporate Power is Protected - The industrial and business aristocracy of a fascist nation often are the ones who put the government leaders into power, creating a mutually beneficial business/government relationship and power elite. Top Barack Obama donors net government jobs 13. Rampant Cronyism and Corruption - Fascist regimes almost always are governed by groups of friends and associates who appoint each other to government positions and use governmental power and authority to protect their friends from accountability. It is not uncommon in fascist regimes for national resources and even treasures to be appropriated or even outright stolen by government leaders. 14. Fraudulent Elections - Sometimes elections in fascist nations are a complete sham. Other times elections are manipulated by smear campaigns against or even assassination of opposition candidates, use of legislation to control voting numbers or political district boundaries, and manipulation of the media. Fascist nations also typically use their judiciaries to manipulate or control elections. |
And I can post an equally exhaustive list about the Bush administration, Brainy.
Both sides are guilty of this ----, and are both bringing us further and further down that rabbit hole - which was the entire reason I posted this, not to have someone troll it into a partisan debate. |
I like how fascism blurs the lines of the left and right.
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and i examined the only administration that matters at the moment.
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Originally Posted by hustler
(Post 859494)
I like how fascism blurs the lines of the left and right.
Originally Posted by Braineack
(Post 859495)
and i examined the only administration that matters at the moment.
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I bet if we took a poll of americans today, more than 80% of people would respond that being a facist means you lean right or youre a repubilcan (bbundy comes to mind, your political specturm test thread also comes to mind).
i just helped dispell the myth. now what? |
Originally Posted by Braineack
(Post 859501)
I bet if we took a poll of americans today, more than 80% of people would respond that being a facist means you lean right or youre a repubilcan (bbundy comes to mind, your political specturm test thread also comes to mind).
i just helped dispell the myth. Being a fascist has little to do with being left or right. Which is what I've been saying from the first post. |
no ----, sherlock.
let me quote myself from 3/23/2012:
Originally Posted by RattleTrap
Most Americans will fall in the left low quadrant. Euros are more right.
Frikkin' fascists.
Originally Posted by braineack
then according to this chart, they'd plot more north & left, not nessecarily right. I plotted more right then anyone else here and I'm far from a facist.
...I'd argue that the concept of it being "right" is somewhat off-base I have stated repeatedly that the trend in this country is toward a fascist system with communist slogans. But what all of today’s pressure groups are busy evading is the fact that neither business nor labor nor anyone else, except the ruling clique, gains anything under fascism or communism or any form of statism—that all become victims of an impartial, egalitarian destruction. |
Originally Posted by Braineack
(Post 859504)
no ----, sherlock.
let me quote myself from 3/23/2012: This is one of the most spectacular partisan-based derailings I've ever seen by you. (Serious face.jpg) Seriously, fascism doesn't really belong on the left/right scale, except for possibly the religious right, which isn't particularly applicable to this forum - or are you a born again fanatical Christian that feels the need to convert the entire forum to your beliefs, Brainy?!? (Sarcastic humor smiley.jpg) |
true colors shown. good job. i acutally used this same 14-point defintion to argue aginst bbundy that fasicm is an inherent "right" thing a few months back.
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Point 8, broski, point 8. You'll note I specified religious and made a point to make it very clear and certain which segment of which party I was referring to, rather than trying to brand the entire party of the actions of a particular segment.
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cool story?
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Originally Posted by Braineack
(Post 859513)
cool story?
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do you think im religous or something?
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Originally Posted by Braineack
(Post 859519)
do you think im religous or something?
No, bro. I make a comment about the religious right fulfilling point 8 in the linked article, and you get all butthurt about "OMG true colors!". I'm not claiming the religious right is the right. I'm just claiming that a specific segment of the right, the religious right, fulfills point 8. But I'm just going by their words and what they claim (I.e., freedom of religion is not freedom from religion, first amendment only says the government can't get involved in religion and not vice versa, etc.), so YMMV. |
and i didn't argue that it doesn't.
but at that same point, I make a comment about the current administartion fulfilling points 1-2-3-4-6-7-8-9-13-14 in the linked article, and you get all butthurt about "OMG partisan BS!". |
Originally Posted by Braineack
(Post 859527)
and i didn't argue that it doesn't.
but at that same point, I make a comment about the current administartion fulfilling points 1-2-3-4-6-7-8-9-13-14 in the linked article, and you get all butthurt about "OMG partisan BS!". What they do matters, and unfortunately, neither party can claim moral or ethical superiority on this subject. |
I never brushed off that point, its a given.
but i see no fault in going through a list point-by-point and finding relevent links to the current adminstration. |
Originally Posted by Braineack
(Post 859535)
I never brushed off that point, its a given.
but i see no fault in going through a list point-by-point and finding relevent links to the current adminstration. So, logically, the current administration must be better than the previous on the patriot act, right Brainy? I'd call bullshit on that. Not a single thing you posted could be remotely construed as from the actions of a single party, and yet you plastered one party all over your points. Why do I say that? Look at the budget arguments. The Republicans have proven a minority can stop legislation from passing beyond a doubt. A minority party that cooperates with a majority party to pass fascist legislation and who coordinates with them for fascist actions is as guilty as the majority party if the minority party is capable of stopping it. Where was the minority party on the PATRIOT Act renewal? Where were they for the defense reauthorization act? Let me remind you about the votes on that one - http://www.dailypaul.com/191603/only...horization-act (Handpicked Ron Paul source for you, boo) You cannot tell me the Republicans can completely ---- up all budgeting, and yet are unable to stop seriously bad and liberty-corroding legislation at the same time. If you disagree with me, by god, let's hear your logic beyond "But they aren't in the white house!" Republicans hold a majority in the House for that matter - they can dictate what does and does not pass. Plastering Obama and by extension Democrat all over your post? That's fine, but intellectually dishonest if you agree with this post. |
Facism isn't left or right.
Facism isn't libertarian or authoritarian. Facism is nothing more than the act of attacking one system of beliefs in favor of another, regardless of the method of attack. Nationalism is a form of facism, because we're telling the rest of the world that we're better than they are. Government control / influence over just about anything is a form of facism. I would also argue that, on the political compass test, facism is not left/right/up/down, but rather it is radial - the farther you are away from the center, the more facist you likely are, with maybe 3 exceptions: I would suspect that as you approach either of the two top corners, or the bottom center, individual facism probably peaks. |
When are you two going to give up and finally space-dock?
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im just being objective.
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This is why no one discusses politics or religion when they're stuck in a Hummvee for days together. Everyone in the thing has guns in a enclosed space.
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To this thread, from the home of fascism, I bring this:
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A bit of history,
Liberalism came about during the “Age of Enlightenment” There are many Ideas that it embraces, Individual liberty, limited government, free markets, etc. It opposed abuses by both the church and the state. Constitutionalism, rule of law, as well as freedom of religion, speech, press and all that sort of stuff is what defines liberalism. Conservatism was an Ideology that arose to combat the sweeping changes that were occurring with the rise of liberalism. Basically it was an Ideology pushed by aristocracy who wanted to preserve social order. Things like Monarchy, aristocracy, and religious authority were to be conserved and they opposed the new liberal principles of equality, citizenship and inalienable rights. The rich felt they deserved to stay rich and since they always made the rules in the past they felt they should continue to make the rules. Liberalism is pretty far from fascism. Conservatism can be darn close to fascism. Where Obama may seem fascist it is because he is on the right side of the political spectrum leaning conservative. No way in hell do I think electing even more conservative candidates will help reverse our nation’s death spiral into fascism. Bob |
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