Help Me Identify a Nissan Turbo
 

I was hoping someone could help me identify this turbo, or maybe point me to a FAQ, etc... I have searched for "Nissan turbo" "Nissan T25" "Nissan Z31" etc... and I get hundreds of sort of disjointed posts, but none that I can find specifically about this turbo.

I traded a box of Miata intake parts and various left over pieces from a previous turbo build to a guy for a non-running SeaDoo SPI. I got tired of it sitting in the driveway on two tires, so last night I traded it to a guy for a Toshiba Notebook, a new Sony handycam that records on a mini dvd, some new Craftsman air tools, six Nissan 300zx injectors and a Nissan Turbo.

he said that the turbo came out of a JDM :facepalm: 1980's model single turbo Z31 Nissan 300ZX. It appears to be a T25 type turbo, but since I have never really pieced together my own turbo and my previous experience has been with a Greddy kit, I am really not sure about this one and would like you guy's help.

I already have a Shanghi-S kit ordered from BEGI and a MS on it's way from Scott for my 1994 miata build. I was wondering if it might be worth my while to take this thing apart and rebuild it and keep it in reserve in case the Chinese turbo craps out. Since I don't have the Chinese turbo yet I can't even see if the flanges are the same or not.

Any help or links to some specifications, etc... about this turbo would be appreciated.

OH... And I looked and it doesn't look like I can use the injectors on my Miata build, so i wonder where the best place to sell them would be.

After More Research...
 

I found this completed listing on Ebay...

eBay Motors: TURBO T25 TURBOCHARGER GARRETT NISSAN 300ZX Z31 87-89 (item 310129809822 end time Mar-28-09 11:50:36 PDT)

So is that turbo built by Garrett for Nissan? If so maybe I have a decent turbo on my hands.

Pics?

I'll have to get them when I get back home, but the one in the eBay listing I posted is the same one that I have. At least it has the same numbers on the compressor... 17V4 [I think]

Take a pic of the turbine to exhaust flange, and the flange where it mates to the manifold.

I know the Z32 turbos have a different turbine flange and you'll pretty much have to go with a custom pipe to get it to work.

Holy shit the Z31 used a t25 frame, thats a lot of exhaust gas through that tiny little turbine housing.

I am not sure... That is the kind of information that I am trying to find out...

Well according to that eBay link, its true. I'm confused by that honestly but the VG30ET is a pile, I wouldn't be suprised that tiny little turbo is on there, Z31s don't even have any charge cooling!

Yep... that year the 300ZX was a single turbo with out an intercooler. later years they went to dual turbos and an intercooler and I think they were putting down about 300hp at the flywheel.

Still I am wondering about this particular turbo... And whether or not it will be worth my trouble to rebuild it or consider using it.

Another place says its a T3, there is quite a bit of size difference on the t2 frame versus t3 frame.

FS: SR20 Turbo, Z31 Turbo, other SR parts: Engine / Drivetrain (for sale): Nissan Forums / Infiniti Forums - NICOclub
That link talks about 85-87 being a T3 frame.

t3 dimensions (from Honda Society)
108 x 67mm outside
48 x 65.5mm square
87mm and 45mm is what the holes are apart

If its smaller than those, its a t2

first ebay link is a T25. second link is a T3 footprint, but the outlet doesn't look correct for a true t3.

post pics of your turbo.

Here are a couple of pictures...

There is a very small aluminum tag in between the two turbines that reads:

Garrett
Made in Japan
UA 0271J
14420-17V04
444321-6

hmm. It looks only slightly different than the CA18DET t25 but it does look like it has a T3 compressor wheel.

I measured the bolt pattern for the manifold bolts and they are 87mm and 45mm. So it must be a T3 housing.

This is something about piecing together a kit that has always bothered me. So many little variations from car to car on very similar turbos. Just enough so that it wont work without major fabrication of flanges. I don't know much about Nissan turbos, but I can't see the Z31 having a T3. But perhaps it is. I have no helpful info on this one. If it does work however, and you don't want it... *cough* ;) I'll come take it off your hands for a reasonable price.

Edited FTT!

84-86 300ZX Turbo came with a T3
87-89 300ZX Turbo came with a T25

This information was given to me by a friend of mine who owns an '85 Turbo Z as well as an '88 Turbo Z and is mixing/matching parts to build one car.

that's a t25.

Based on your measurements of 87X45 mm I would go with it being a T3 based on solely on the flange size.

The conversions come out to be on the T3 flange pic below: 85.726 X 44.45 mm for stud spacing.

http://www.jgstools.com/turbo/tk030p.jpg

Based on the pictures or the dimensions?

it might be a T3 inlet, but it's still a t25 turbo.

OK... that makes sense.

I'm going to have to agree...

It's more than likely if it is a Z31 that if the older model used a T3, they wouldn't re-cast manifolds and change the flange just to run a different turbo. They'd instead get a special cast turbine housing.

Why? because they can.

Otherwise I have no explanation.

So... I guess I could order a T3 manifold and a T25 downpipe...

I took the thing apart this afternoon after the Wifee and I went for a drive. I had to go by HF and get some bent needle nose pliers to get the big circlip out.

Over all the insides look really good. The turbines were really tight, before I took it apart, but the bearings and the shaft look almost like new. The exhaust side had some coking at the backside of the impeller and on the little sheetmetal shield. The thrust bearing looks new as does everything else. I'm going to clean everything up tomorrow and put it all back together and see how it spins.

I want to use it now, simply because I got it in a trade basically for free. It will be a nice car story to tell people... "Where did you get the turbo again?"

I may send it to Corky and ask him to build my turbo system around it. He told me to send it the other day, but I had already ordered my Shanghi kit. I'm kind of on the fence...

OK... It's official... I'm Stoked.
 

OK... I'm pretty stoked right now. We got home and had some drinks and I decided to go downstairs into the Man Cave while my Sweetie was cooking dinner and completely tear this thing down.

I took it all the way down to the bearings and the thing is immaculate. The only problem was a very small amount of coking just at the exhaust turbine and the small formed metal housing, but all that cleaned up nicely.

I cleaned everything and oiled everything and put it all back together and the turbine spins freely and there is little to no play in the shaft. It is like a new turbo. I have attached a picture of the inlet and outlet and the turbines after I have partially assembled the unit.

I think I am going to call BEGI on Monday and ship this turbo to them and use it instead of the Shanghi turbo. I think the only change they will have to make is to ship me a T3 flanged manifold.

I have one dumb question for everyone, and I know I should probably do a search, but how do you know what people are talking about when they say their turbo is a 60 trim? If you look at the picture I am posting do you simply measure the diameters of the impeller and the compressor, and whatever diameter they are then that is what you use to determine the "trim?"

Thanks for the help so far guys...

An article for you sir... TurboByGarrett.com - Turbo Tech102

Should explain it thoroughly for you in the first section. :bigtu:

Thanks for the link. That was very helpfull. I am going to take it back apart and measure everything again and do the calculations.

I double checked the flanges and the manifold flange is a T3 and the outlet flange must be a T25/T28.

It will be interesting to see how this turbo will perform. It has waterlines, and oil lines with it too, and a couple of decent heat shields and a cast downpipe also.

Nice... Keep us updated on your progress.

measure the inducer and exducer of both wheels (in mm). post the numbers here.

^ I too am curious about the sizes...

Me three... :giggle:

I am going to take it back apart this afternoon when I get home and I will measure them.

Awesome... That will give us a better scope of the acutal nature of this turbocharger.

Measurements and calculations...
 

Ok Folks,

Bear with me I have had a couple of beers and a couple shots of Appleton rum...

Exhaust Turbine:

Inducer = 52.8mm
Exducer = 41.4mm
Trim = 162.655

Compressor Wheel

Inducer = 41mm
Exducer = 51.4mm
Trim = 63.627

I also measured the turbine Area and Radius as best as I could, because:

"Turbine performance is greatly affected by changing the A/R of the housing, as it is used to adjust the flow capacity of the turbine. Using a smaller A/R will increase the exhaust gas velocity into the turbine wheel. This provides increased turbine power at lower engine speeds, resulting in a quicker boost rise. However, a small A/R also causes the flow to enter the wheel more tangentially, which reduces the ultimate flow capacity of the turbine wheel. This will tend to increase exhaust backpressure and hence reduce the engine's ability to "breathe" effectively at high RPM, adversely affecting peak engine power."

I tried to measure the turbine inlet as close as possible, but the area that you need to measure is up in the turbine housing and you kind of have to hold your calipers up there and eyeball it.

So to the best my measuring capabilities:

Area of the turbine inlet = 1800 square mm
Radius of turbine = 60mm

Which would give us an A/R = 30

This would seem to indicate to me that this turbo will spool rather quickly and produce a pretty decent amount of low end torque, but it would limit the amount of top end horsepower that it would make.

If my numbers are correct and my interpretation of the data is correct, I may have stumbled onto a turbo that will get me to my modest goals of 225rwhp and a fast spool and loads of low end torque.

What does the braintrust think?

it's a T25 turbine. (same/similar to the 2554)
the compressor wheel is about the same size as a GT2252.

expect it to perform like a 2554.

http://www.turbobygarrett.com/turbob...52187_comp.gif

you have the ID/EX reversed on the turbine...it's a 61 trim turbine.

no imprint on the turbine housing inlet with the A/R stamped on it?

I was wondering the same thing about the turbine, but according to the turbobygarrett.com website, the larger of the two dimensions is the inducer and smaller is the exducer. Am I reading that picture wrong?

For the intake, the inducer is small and the exducer is big. For the turbine, the inducer is big and exducer is small. It follows the airflow; IN to EX.

Exactly... [Didn't you just state the the same thing that I did and just word it differently?] And the calculations on the website show the:

(inducer^2/exducer^2)100 = Trim

So for the Turbine housing:

Inducer = 52.8mm
Exducer = 41.4mm

(52.8^2/41.4^2)100 = 162.655
Trim = 162.655


So, are you guys saying that regardless of what the website says it is always the (smaller number^2/Larger Number^2)100 ?

I'm not argueing... Just trying to learn something, and just going by what the Garrett website shows...

Just rough numbers, but that turbo on a 1.8L would be something akin to this:

http://www.squirrelpf.com/turbocalc/...&product_id=25

If so, a-junkyarding I will go! Awesome score b&t

Well... I'm hopefull. We'll see.

I emailed Stephanie and called since I started out with the Shanghi kit, now almost everything is deleted except the manifold and downpipe. And I have added WBO2, S.S. lines, etc...

I can't wait until I get the stuff here and can start work on this new project. I still need to figure out what I want to do for an exhaust and which ebay intercooler I want to buy. I need injectors too.

B&T, I have never noticed that before in the calculations, but it does appear that it is always small number^2/large number^2 * 100. I guess it is dependant upon the turbine blade itself, and not how the air flow through it. Which would make sense since the Trim is a direct measure of the compressor and turbine blades and not airflow through them.

On a sidenote, good call on the T25 Braineack. I was wondering if that was what the compressor housing was after I saw the turbo disassembled. So it looks like a T25 compressor housing with a T3 turbine housing... Hrmmmmmm

It makes you wonder why we don't start a database of some sort in a sticky for older turbos as we discover this stuff and post up what we know. this way when we are searching the junkyards we kind of know it when we see a jewel in the rough.

^I agree fully... However, I don't have the time since I only have internet access at work. :(

Well... I carefully packed it up and shipped it out to BEGI yesterday. It looks like it will take the place of the China Charger on my Shanghi kit.

Sweet deal! That reminds me that I need to pack mine up and send it to BEGI as well to have it test fitted on an S4 manifold and have an external setup put on the manifold using a a feed from each runner to the 38mm wastegate. Corky, believes that will cure the problems they once saw with the external gates on the S4 manifold. We'll see I guess...

I downloaded a copy of a T25 exhaust outlet flange and mine didn't match it, so that is one of the main reasons that I went ahead and shipped it to them. I know that it is a T3 inlet and I guess it si a T3 5 bolt outlet as well. We'll see.

I guess that since you are going with the S4 manifold and an external wastegate, you are planning on some pretty good power.

Yeah, that was probably a good idea so they would have a basis to go off of on your turbocharger so you get all the right parts the first time. Yeah, I should be making roughly 350WHP @ 18-20psi. It will be a dedicated track car though... Mainly looking for good mid-high power and torque for coming out of corners. The turbo I have, INCON GTBB37 should work well for this application (click to enlarge).

Pics of the INCON GTBB37:
http://thumb9.webshots.net/t/73/173/...9swkVNB_th.jpg
http://thumb9.webshots.net/t/75/75/0...9wODZQq_th.jpg
http://thumb9.webshots.net/t/62/662/...9RwOeyi_th.jpg
http://thumb9.webshots.net/t/66/766/...9prnSYk_th.jpg
http://thumb9.webshots.net/t/75/75/0...9VrQdxq_th.jpg

Compressor Plot on 2.0L (Mine will be 1.9L, so should be 'similar')
http://thumb9.webshots.net/t/59/659/...9QSHGUN_th.jpg

Incase you were curious, here are the measurements and specs on it...

Incon Systems GTBB37
Compressor --- Ind. X Exd. 55 mm X 76 mm 52 trim A/R .60
Turbine --- Exd. X Ind. 53.5 mm X 56.5 mm 90 trim A/R .86
Dual Ball Bearing
Water Cooled center section

CHRA Part # = 700177-0011

Well... I got an email from Stephanie at BEGI today. She said that they would need to do some modifications to the turbo to work with the Shanghi Kit. She said it would take about 4-5 hours at $75 per hour to modify it, so to hell with it. I just told them to go back to plan "A" and furnish the Chinese turbo with the kit. It's probably for the best anyway.

The good news is that Corky checked it out and it is worthy to install on my car. It still seems like a nice starting point for someone who is going to do a DIY set-up. It comes with a pretty nice bell mouth partial downpipe that could easily be tied into with an exhaust flange, and it has a T3 flange at the manifold. If I had found this turbo first, before I ordered the Shanghi kit, I may well be doing that myself.

As soon as it gets back from BEGI I will take some complete pictures of all the goodies that go with it and post it on the For Sale forum.

I just wanted to sort of bring this thing to a conclusion. Thanks for everyone's input and help on this.

Haha... I got quoted at a rough estimate for the S4 Manifold and the work I would need done on it. Came out to just shy of $1000...

I hope no one thinks I was being critical of BEGI. They are in the business to make money and I certainly understand that they have to charge for their time. For the expertise that they have I thought $75 per hour is a fair price.

I was actually having second thoughts before Stephanie's email about changing stuff to work with this turbo, seeing that it is fairly rare and if I ever wanted to change the turbo out I would need to either find another one with the same flanges or modify my downpipe.

So I am kind of glad things worked out the way they did.

It looks like I'm a gonna' git Shanghied! ;)

Don't worry, I know you weren't being critical of their work as it is top-notch. And $75/hour labor be custom jobs is not bad considering it would cost that much or more per hour to take it to a local fabricator that might have no idea how these types of things work or should be designed and then you have an expensive POS on your hand...

Out of curiosity, what were they going to have to modify to make it work?