I'm an idiot help me?!
EVERYONE is saying.
06-22-2012, 09:11 PM
#85
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turbodiesel or a lot of these newer direct injection turbo cars make great low end powa and not a lot of revs. I had a mazdaspeed 3 and that's exactly how the stock turbo powerband is. Cobalt SS with its newer turbo and twin scroll even more so out of a little 4 banger. to get the kind of response you're looking for you're probably going to need to do more than just upgrade the turbo...which you seem very against doing. good flowing manifold, short ic piping, modern small turbo... with a small budget what you want just might not be possible. or get a PD supercharger.
Pretty much no one does dyno pulls in 1st/2nd gear, because:
1) its dangerous
2) its pointless
3) it won't tell you much
You realize gearing, weight, etc will render a plot like that useless, EVEN IF you managed to get someone bored enough to try something like this, because it still won't tell you how YOUR car will load up the car in 1st gear on teh street and how YOUR 1st gear will feel.
Reason people do it in the 1:1 is because it gets rid of like 100 variables, and even then there is a WILD variation between similar cars and similar dyno's.
1) its dangerous
2) its pointless
3) it won't tell you much
You realize gearing, weight, etc will render a plot like that useless, EVEN IF you managed to get someone bored enough to try something like this, because it still won't tell you how YOUR car will load up the car in 1st gear on teh street and how YOUR 1st gear will feel.
Reason people do it in the 1:1 is because it gets rid of like 100 variables, and even then there is a WILD variation between similar cars and similar dyno's.
2: why is it pointless?
3: why won't it tell you much?
I like how you say it won't tell you how it will load up on the street despite people posting dynos here. Like I've said I await acceleration G data from the various setups shown here.
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06-22-2012, 09:22 PM
#88
1 Wheel spin and uneven hookup, can go right off the side of the rollers.
2 A inertial dyno like a dyno jet just wont load the car like real life. A mustang type dyno might have shootout mode which would give you a simulated 1/4 mile but they're complete BS, like 2 seconds faster than real life.
3 see answer 2
2 A inertial dyno like a dyno jet just wont load the car like real life. A mustang type dyno might have shootout mode which would give you a simulated 1/4 mile but they're complete BS, like 2 seconds faster than real life.
3 see answer 2
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06-22-2012, 09:38 PM
#89
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1 sure its a possibility. Though very doubtful on a rwd miata with the setups shown.
I guess its more chance on the dual rollers.
2 dynojet can have load cells.
3 you are gonna end up doing fine tuning on the road and \ or at the event, but a dyno helps get close without having to do a lot of tuning on the road. Now if we are talking tuning the car sure that can't be done on dyno.
I guess its more chance on the dual rollers.
2 dynojet can have load cells.
3 you are gonna end up doing fine tuning on the road and \ or at the event, but a dyno helps get close without having to do a lot of tuning on the road. Now if we are talking tuning the car sure that can't be done on dyno.
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06-22-2012, 10:05 PM
#92
Well, the guy gets alot of advise from SJMarcy if that tells you anything.
He wants a turbo that spins up faster in lower gear, since they accuse turbo people of padding their numbers and making their boost threshold and powerband look better. For some reason, the ability to make the power required to spin in lower gears is not enough, and you need more torque, lower, to be able to take advantage of it.
He is also trying to avoid being beat by STS cars in autocross, and apparently, SJMarcy's car will out accelerate him, allegedly. Yall might help out with that weight distro problem he is having that is causing it while you're at it.
http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=457529
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06-22-2012, 11:25 PM
#94
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Uhm, you're doing it wrong.
Seriously, if you think you'll get a turbo 1.6B series MAZDA engine to make 220tq at like 2000rpm then I want what you've been smokin' in that crack pipe. I would LOVE to have a delusion like that.. Get a different motor? Different car? Different hobby? I hear R/C airplanes are fun.
Here, I'll make a suggestion of a motor..
That enough torque for you, buddy? It'll only cost you $4000 for the motor, another $1200 or so for the transmission, Few hundred for a differential, about a grand for axles, and somewhere around $4-5000 for all the supporting mounting hardware.
Or you could follow the advice of experienced people on the board who actually have driven real power making cars, follow their example, and learn to drive? Sorry, I've driven several different setup (S/c and turbo) miatas, and quite honestly I don't EVER spend very much time under 3000rpm accelerating. If you think an extra 40# of torque at 800rpm is going to SERIOUSLY out-accelerate a significantly more powerful car, again, I want what you've got in that crack pipe.
Seriously, if you think you'll get a turbo 1.6B series MAZDA engine to make 220tq at like 2000rpm then I want what you've been smokin' in that crack pipe. I would LOVE to have a delusion like that.. Get a different motor? Different car? Different hobby? I hear R/C airplanes are fun.
Here, I'll make a suggestion of a motor..
That enough torque for you, buddy? It'll only cost you $4000 for the motor, another $1200 or so for the transmission, Few hundred for a differential, about a grand for axles, and somewhere around $4-5000 for all the supporting mounting hardware.
Or you could follow the advice of experienced people on the board who actually have driven real power making cars, follow their example, and learn to drive? Sorry, I've driven several different setup (S/c and turbo) miatas, and quite honestly I don't EVER spend very much time under 3000rpm accelerating. If you think an extra 40# of torque at 800rpm is going to SERIOUSLY out-accelerate a significantly more powerful car, again, I want what you've got in that crack pipe.
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or, maybe he is looking for a completely different car?
06-23-2012, 04:07 AM
#99
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http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=216061
Justin, your build thread inspired me to turbo charge my car more than the "do it this way or you will die" threads
The TD04-13t has good low end grunt and might be worth considering?
It's pretty common for the WRX's TD04, properly tuned and with appropriate supporting mods, to get 200 ft/lbs (measured at the wheels on reasonable dynos) before 2k rpm, on even the 2 liter WRX's. On the 2.5l WRX's it's just ridiculously undersized.
They typically max out at around 240hp; with 250hp being a goal that many have but few hit.
Flange difficulties aside, I think it'd be a great pick for a 1.8l and even do respectably well on a 1.6.
They typically max out at around 240hp; with 250hp being a goal that many have but few hit.
Flange difficulties aside, I think it'd be a great pick for a 1.8l and even do respectably well on a 1.6.
I've got one and love it. Spool is instant and builds decent enough power. BEGi used my setup to make that adapter they are selling, nothing but a bolt-on subaru flange to Tx(T3 for me). I like them because of OEM quality, water cooled, and as cheap as a chinese turbo if not cheaper.
Justin, your build thread inspired me to turbo charge my car more than the "do it this way or you will die" threads
The TD04-13t has good low end grunt and might be worth considering?
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06-23-2012, 05:49 AM
#100
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Well, the guy gets alot of advise from SJMarcy if that tells you anything.
He wants a turbo that spins up faster in lower gear, since they accuse turbo people of padding their numbers and making their boost threshold and powerband look better. For some reason, the ability to make the power required to spin in lower gears is not enough, and you need more torque, lower, to be able to take advantage of it.
He is also trying to avoid being beat by STS cars in autocross, and apparently, SJMarcy's car will out accelerate him, allegedly. Yall might help out with that weight distro problem he is having that is causing it while you're at it.
http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=457529
He wants a turbo that spins up faster in lower gear, since they accuse turbo people of padding their numbers and making their boost threshold and powerband look better. For some reason, the ability to make the power required to spin in lower gears is not enough, and you need more torque, lower, to be able to take advantage of it.
He is also trying to avoid being beat by STS cars in autocross, and apparently, SJMarcy's car will out accelerate him, allegedly. Yall might help out with that weight distro problem he is having that is causing it while you're at it.
http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=457529
Yeah I get info and help from sjmarcy, I"m after going faster and learning.
And yes I bet pretty much any standard turbo miata has weight distrubution more to the front. While I would like a higher % to the rear. 45 52 front rear.
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