Just realized I don't think I've recalibrated the LC1 in... never.
 

Pretty sure it's been never since I've done this. Calibrated it when it went in the car, forgot the rest.

Was just thinking about this today after I did a few street runs to tune the car on the MS3.

:facepalm:

To be fair I only recently started using it with a Megasquirt so before it was just telling me how badly the car was running and I couldn't do much about it.

Will jack it up tomorrow and get this done.

AEM uego user here, what's this calibration you speak of?
/sarcasm

Hopefully its not too far off, but just stay out of boost until you can verify or something.

Yeah, I've heard that the AEM doesn't need calibration. That seems nice. Though it's not that big of an issue since a friend helped me rig up the button and led right next to the hood lever so I can just pop the thing out of the exhaust and hit the button.

How do you know the AEM doesn't ever need a calibration? and how does it know?


When did you install the LC1? Why the desire to free-air calibrate it?

That's just what I heard. Don't know any more than that.

I installed it probably three or more years ago, hell it might be four or five now. Says in the instructions you're supposed to do it every 10k miles or twice a year?

Let us know if AFR's change after the calibration.

Literature from Innovate recommends periodic cal, but I have not run mine enough to know of it really matters.

I mean, despite the time I've probably put less than 10k miles on the car.

Nor do I. But just because something doesn't "need" calibration, doesn't mean something actually doesn't need calibration :P

The benefit of the LC1 was that you can perform a free-air calibration if you so please. It's designed so the calibration takes place in free-air so it has pure atmospheric oxygen as a reference.

The benefit of the AEM was that it doesn't need a calibration--it was calibrated from the factory and apparently at each startup it calibrates against some resistor or something as a reference. The issue I can see with this, is that if the resistor is always supposed to achieve a certain AFR at a certain resistance, what happens when the conditions are skewed in the environment? like what happens if you seal the exhaust and pour raw fuel in the pipe, then power the AEM...will it alter the calibration because the base reference was off? Or it could be something as simple as when you plug the sensor in, and it's powered, it needs to output a certain resistance once it heats up.

I have no clue either. I was just talking smack, but to be perfectly honest I've had an AEM sensor fail on me (way off calibration, autotune started to ruin my map), so it must not do too great of a job :rofl:

yeah see...if the sensor starts to degrade, but it just calibrates it to show you that it's a-okay, then that's not a benefit.

Here's a question, if there is no cat on the car does it count as "free air" if it is still in the exhaust pipe, but it hasn't been running for a day?

:rofl:

Depends how long the exhaust is, i suppose.

Full disclosure: I haven't recalibrated my LC-1 in over 4 years and 40k miles. Haven't noticed any sort of drift. My exhaust also has no cat and is about... 2.5 feet long at best.

For that matter, i don't even have the stupid calibration test circuit push button crap wired in, so i'm not even sure how i'd calibrate it even if i wanted to.

According to LC-2 book, you should pull it out of the exhaust. I would think similar for LC-1. Instructions available at Innovate, if you don't have your hard copy.

On the LC-2, there is a sequence of un-plug, power, de-power, plug in that runs the calibration program. By un-plug / plug I mean the connection between the controller and the sensor... which has to be done anyway in order to remove sensor from exhaust.

I have it all at the car to run before I re-install the sensor.

I assume LC-1 is similar, but I don't think the LC-2 has said push-button (it has a push-button, but for other reasons, and I don't have than in use).

From AEM's UEGO manual:

"Each AEM UEGO sensor is individually calibrated and a resistor integral at the connector body is laser trimmed with this value. This process replaces the traditional “free air” calibration procedure when changing sensors and implements a sensor specific calibration for unparalleled accuracy."

Curly, so AEM is saying that once calibrated, always calibrated, which Concealer is saying is likely the case with his LC-1 as well. I'm hoping that Harv does his re-cal so that we have another data point on if the re-cal is likely needed, or if Innovate is being overly cautious.

As I understand things, some OEMs are now using the same Bosch sensors with no periodic calibrations, which would indicate some lack of need.

Oh, the other thing Innovate says is that running rich requires more frequent re-cal.

Just to be clear... i'm not saying that the Bosch sensor used in the LC-1 setup doesn't NEED periodic calibration, i'm just saying that i'm lazy and really don't know how to calibrate it because i don't have the test circuit thing installed.

On the flip side, maybe someone can explain to me why a Bosch sensor would never go out of calibration, but the same sensor needs to be calibrated in different setups? It makes me feel dumb.

Personally, i view calibration as a feature. One that i clearly don't utilize because again, i'm lazy, but it's still a feature.

The resistor, AFAIK, is in the wiring for the controller, not the sensor, so it works with any bosch sensor, but is specific to the controller. I'm just quoting manuals here, I'm not expert on the matter. Beyond owning one.

FWIW I free air calibrated my LC1 last week before the first drive of the season and the AFRs are definitely different than they were on the last drive before winter storage. Its showing richer readings than before and the re-cal was the only powertrain change that was made.

Anyone know the calibration procedure for the LC-1 if you don't have that stupid test circuit thing hooked up?

that's not exactly what AEM is saying.

they are suggesting that each unit has its own individually tuned resistor to calibrate the GAUGE unit at the factory in perfect test conditions.

This could mean that in a factory, they input a certain voltage into the sender (probably 2.25v) and tune a resistor so that makes the unit display 14.7 AFR.

How does that help you if your sensor is clogged with soot and is not outputting the correct voltages anymore?
How does that help you if you don't live at sea-level?
How does that help you if Bosch suggests their own sensor...

?

With the AEM, you could start out with inaccurate readings from the start that only get worse over time.

With the LC1, you plug in the sensor, you dangle it in free-air, and can accurately calibrate the sensor in your atmospheric conditions whenever you have the 2 minutes to do so.

Turn the unit on with no sensor attached for at least 5 seconds?
ground the black calibration wire for 3 seconds?
Use LM Programmer and push the "reset calibration" button?

I honestly wouldn't do it without using the Logworks software to see what the controller is up to. It will display the progress of the calibration, and then you can know when to put the sensor back in the exhaust for the heater calibration.

Oh neato, thanks!

Back when my turbo seals were leaking into the exhaust I started getting really messed up LC1 readings. I pulled the wb and it was covered in soot/carbon etc. While the sensor was out, I wiped it off with a rag that I sprayed some brake clean on and then did the re-cal, it made a world of difference!

I eventually replaced the sensor with a new one after I rebuilt the turbo because I wanted everything as accurate as possible. Innovate recommends re-cal on a turbo car every 3 months.

This is a good point. I have the cable to hook the laptop up to the controller. I was going to just press the button I have hooked up and watch the LED, but if you say the thing lets you calibrate in the software and tells what is going on I will hook that up and use that.

It's been a long time, but when logger is running, it will display the controller status and any error codes.

so while the free-air is running, it will display "free air" or something and then a progress like 50% instead of just watching a blinking light.

I dunno, rtml?

I recalibrated the sensor. In my case the thing was giving some odd readings at times so I think it was a good thing to recalibrate. The readings are more consistent now and do not fluctuate as much, but now it's showing that I'm running leaner than I thought I was when I'm in boost so it's probably even better that I ran the calibration. It had been a long ass time since I ran the calibration.

Did you use the "unplug and monitor with laptop" method?

I don't know if I was using the software right, but it didn't seem to indicate it was recalibrating when I used the software so I ended up using the button I had put into place.

Well dammit. I don't have the button.

do you have access to the wiring? just ground the black wire, that's all the momentary button does.

I'll fuck with it this weekend i suppose.

If you have the LC-1 and the XD-16 gauge, you can remove the sensor from the pipe, press and hold the button on the gauge for the requisite number of seconds and, blammo, it recalibrates itself.

All I did was hold the button down for 30 seconds and release.

I use the Auto Timer display, because round guages without actual needles make me twitch uncontrollably, and i hate wideband gauges with needles.

Great. I just went out to do some street tuning and during the middle of the run the LC1 just pegged itself at 8.1 and the light started blinking 8 times repeating over and over. Apparently this is error code 8 which means the sensor is busted.

Fantastic.

Good thing I recalibrated it.

:vash:

no. it means heater error. did you perform the heater test with the sensor installed in the pipe? it needs to be, else it can overheat...

The manual specifies two options for #8 which is Sensor Timing error (typically a damaged sensor), heater error where the sensor is overheating or the sensor is bad.

So you think the calibration I did messed the heater calibration up? Because the sensor never got disconnected from the controller, so it shouldn't need heater calibration again. All I did was remove the sensor from the pipe and perform the free air calibration.

What i'm learning here is that i should never ever ever calibrate my LC-1.

it performs a heater calibration after a free-air, IIRC, so it's possible it did it when the sensor was out.

I'd pull the sensor and have it do a heater calibration as outlined in the manual.

doing the heater calibrating outside the pipes will alter the time it takes for the sensor to reach temps compared to when installed, so it can mess up the readings and throw an error 8.

otherwise, error 8 codes almost always happen if the sensor is installed too close to the turbo without a heatsink. Where is yours located and has the setup changed recently?

Did you have the ignition off before you removed the sensor from the exhaust? When the key is on the heater element will automatically attempt to heat up and reach a certain temp which is impossible in free air, it may have burned it self out? Download the lc1 manual and follow the instructions step by step...try again.

I'm not sure how the heater calibration would have gotten reset. It says it only resets heater calibration if the sensor is not connected to the controller and the controller is operated for more than five seconds. The sensor has never been disconnected from the controller during anything I have done.

The first time calibration instructions has the sensor outside of the exhaust for both the sensor calibration and the heater calibration, it specifically says to keep the sensor outside of the exhaust for first time calibration so I'm not sure how it makes a difference if the sensor is out or in for heater calibration. Free air temp and cold exhaust temp will likely be exactly the same.

No setup change. It's downstream, right before the cat location.

I think the sensor just shit the bed. I could try and disconnect it and operate the controller to reset everything and then reconnect and do the first time calibration just to be completely sure, but I'm thinking the sensor is done.

too coincidental to me.

Matt at DIY seems to think new sensor is necessary, but then again he may want to sell me a new sensor. I try not to be too cynical.

With a little searching/blowing one of the parts guys at orielly's you can usually pick up the sensor for less than $40 bucks.

Here's the bosch part number, plug and play. #17014

I probably should have just bought it off Amazon.


But the DIY guys help me out so much that I don't mind buying it from them.

Or at least that is my excuse since I ended up buying it from them already before looking for alternatives.

:loser:

$46.99 from Advance Auto Parts after discount code A124. Might be better codes floating around.

Swapped for new sensor, all seems well.

*knocks on wood*
*throws salt over shoulder*
*sacrifices goat*

tr30 is 30% off.

"The promotion code you entered is not valid. Please check the code and try again"

I think it's trt30.

Edit: Just checked. TRT30 gives you 30% off.

Niiiiiiice. $40 picked up. I like.

ah, my bad, used it last week. thanks.

They change the actual code every 6 months or so, but there is almost always a 30% off code to be found by just googling "advance 30% code". Usually it's hiding on those crazy coupon lady sites.

Ask me how I know...:eek5: