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He's already shown that the cam timing issue is relative to the keyway, not just the TDC mark. Also, in the ATI product photo I posted above, you can actually see that the keyway isn't lined up with a cog 'valley' like on the OEM gear.
Sorry, I was a little slow on the pickup there- edited post accordingly. I still wonder about the position of the timing wheel relative to the keyway.
The amount of high $ aftermarket **** that shows up on this forum that has glaring issues is staggering. There are tons of people running stupid power on OE crank balancers, it gets you thinking.
Yeah no kidding, but it's even worse specifically with this product: over the years they've made a LOT of mistakes specifically with the ati damper, not just this.
What about repairing it? That rear plate is removable and installs with a small swage pin. I could drill the hole for the pin in removable plate.
BUT - I'm at work and not looking directly at it, is the woodruff key - to the - gear teeth a permanent thing?
The rear plate with that notch pin is just a marker, it has no effect on the operation of the engine. The issue is that the keyway is broached into the crank gear in the wrong orientation. All of the other TDC marks (rear timing wheel guide and TDC/10/20 marks on the damper itself) are then keyed off that incorrect keyway location. ASSuming the two pieces can be separated (damper and gear), you could separate them and replace the gear, or even re-broach the existing gear with a keyway shaper, assuming the gear can be re-installed in a different orientation. Lots of ASSumptions there.
If the two pieces can't be separated, you would need to rotate the damper roughly 172deg, re-broach the keyway, and add your own scribe marks for TDC.
Originally Posted by Schroedinger
Sorry, I was a little slow on the pickup there- edited post accordingly. I still wonder about the position of the timing wheel relative to the keyway.
My educated guess would say that the wheels themselves are consistent, since I'm sure they're either waterjetted or laser cut from a CAD file. There is a substantial possibility of error in the bolt hole location on the damper itself, though. I don't know if I have the parts in the shop to adequately determine whether or not that orientation is correct, since I'm not sure whether FM's wheel is a scratch design or whether it uses the Protege 36-tooth orientation.
Originally Posted by 18psi
Yeah no kidding, but it's even worse specifically with this product: over the years they've made a LOT of mistakes specifically with the ati damper, not just this.
OEM dampers still like to fling themselves from the motor at modest power levels (325whp+) so that's no bueno. What other issues have ATIs had?
The amount of high $ aftermarket **** that shows up on this forum that has glaring issues is staggering. There are tons of people running stupid power on OE crank balancers, it gets you thinking.
This. At times it drives me pretty close to jumping ship.
IIRC: ID too small making it a royal pain to install/remove, many also arrived damaged (not from shipping). I'm thinking there was at least 1 more issue but can't recall atm
BHJ's Mazda 1.8 race damper is the preferred Harmonic Damper at Jesse Prather Motorsports. Shown here in Eric Prill's F Production Miata. Click here for Jesse Prather Motorsports.
I have Jesse Prather's balancer, but the car has not run with it yet. I checked the timing belt clocking, and it is like factory. Here are a few things I have noticed however:
First, there is little to no coating on the steal surfaces, and it started to rust quickly. I will have to sand the rust off and paint it, which pisses me off after spending over $800.
Second, it was borderline to small to fit over the crankshaft. Hoping it wont be an issue when i pull it off. Next time I install I will try heating it in an oven.
One of the ignition wheel fasteners was bad and had to be replaced. Not that big a deal, but for the money I spent, damn!
The trigger wheel clocking is different from the original Electromotive trigger wheel kit I got years ago. Not sure whats going on there unless there has been a change in where Electromotive mounts the trigger. That or one of them is F'ed up. BHJ balancer and trigger wheel is set up for Electromotive management that Jesse Prather helped develop.
So do we have any dampers that we know are good to go now? I know BHJ and now ATI have issues
Is there a link to the issues with the BHJ dampers? The Supermiata damper thread says that there were quality control issues so they stopped using BHJ - but that could mean anything between some of the the dampers were square instead of round, to cosmetic issues that don't affect it's performance...
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