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-   Engine Performance (https://www.miataturbo.net/engine-performance-56/)
-   -   pricing on valve seals (https://www.miataturbo.net/engine-performance-56/pricing-valve-seals-80025/)

rleete 07-17-2014 12:53 PM

pricing on valve seals
 
Can anyone give me a rough estimate of how much it would cost to have the valve seals replaced on a 1994 1.8L? Also, is this something you would trust to a standard repair shop (i.e. Firestone, etc.), or would you limit it to either A)Mazda dealer or B)machine shop/engine builder?

What's the going rate these days for machine shops? How the hell do you find one you can trust to do the work properly, in a decent time frame and for a reasonable cost? I don't race, so talking to other guys to get recommendations is not an option.

Starting to hate my oil burning car. Help me before I torch it.

hornetball 07-17-2014 02:13 PM

I replaced the valve seals on my car with head in place. It was surprisingly easy, although you do have to buy a tool from Amazon. Took me a couple of evenings after work including engine timing teardown and beer drinking. Details (including Amazon links to the tools used) towards the end of the Red car build thread.

In my case, this did not fix the oil consumption.

duffbuster243 07-17-2014 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hornetball (Post 1148994)
I replaced the valve seals on my car with head in place. It was surprisingly easy, although you do have to buy a tool from Amazon. Took me a couple of evenings after work including engine timing teardown and beer drinking. Details (including Amazon links to the tools used) towards the end of the Red car build thread.

In my case, this did not fix the oil consumption.

Tried the same thing with no success, seals did look pretty rough upon removal but changing them had no effect on the oil consumption.

18psi 07-17-2014 04:56 PM

might be a ring problem OP

rleete 07-17-2014 05:23 PM

Yeah, I am afraid of that. Haven't gotten around to doing a compression test yet.

duffbuster243 07-17-2014 05:27 PM

compression test might turn out good. My old 1.6 drank oil heavily, compression tested good and even across all cylinders. The oil control rings seem to get stuck on these motors.

TheScaryOne 07-17-2014 06:50 PM

This is something I'd farm out, unless you have considerable tools. Doing it with the head on the engine in the car requires an air compressor (or a good coil of soft rope). You'd remove both cams and all of the lifters and shims (keep them in order, DO NOT MIX THEM UP.) then pressurize cylinder number one, remove the valve retainers, springs, etc. Pull off the old seal (curved needle nose work fine if you're careful, get the seal pliers if it'll make you feel better) install the new seal (you're supposed to have a special seal installer tool. I don't. I press on them until they feel like they seat.) reassemble. Move to next cylinder. If you forget to block the valves they will fall down into the piston, and you will be pulling the head to get it back out.

I'm planning on using a magnetic valve retainer tool similar to Lisle 36050, but have not gotten around to the job yet. Removal should be cake. Installation? Who knows.

rleete 07-17-2014 08:16 PM

Actually, these are some of the tools I wouldn't mind spending money on. As to the procedure, I know it well, having done it before. First time was my 1974 Duster with a slant 6.

The problem is motivation to tear into the engine.

hornetball 07-17-2014 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheScaryOne (Post 1149073)
I'm planning on using a magnetic valve retainer tool similar to Lisle 36050, but have not gotten around to the job yet. Removal should be cake. Installation? Who knows.

Even caker!! You're not going to believe how easy it is. Put the retainer in place, lightly press the keepers into their space with your thumb, put the install adapter on the tool, press and "CLICK," take a swig of beer and admire your work!

By valve #16, I was doing the entire valve disassembly, seal replacement and assembly in about 3 minutes.

If only it had fixed the issue.

Awesome tool for head work though. Now I'm eyeballing Supertech valve springs knowing I can install them anytime I like.

rleete 06-03-2015 12:21 PM

Props and thanks to hornetball for the link to the tool kit. Ordered and received from Amazon yesterday. Seals and head cover gasket on hand, so I am preparing to get the job done. Smoke on startup is pretty bad, so it's time.

Which brings me to the next question: HLA's. Do I disassemble to clean, or can they be done without taking them completely apart per m.net garage article? Or, is it worth the cost to replace them? I have read that there is a cheaper Kia part that works, but have been unable to find the number yet. I really don't want to throw more money in this pit than I have to. Lifters so far have been relatively quiet.

So, replace or just clean? If just clean, then do the inner plungers (with the tiny ball and spring) need to be disassembled, or can they be done sufficiently without doing so?

dieselmiata 06-03-2015 12:32 PM

I just finished the full m.net teardown/cleaning of them last night. It's surprisingly easy, albeit time consuming. I even went as far as taking apart the little ball/spring thingie. As long as you keep close control of your parts, it's cake. Keep a magnet around to stick the little ball and spring on though.

If you do go down this road, go down to the dollar store and pick up 2 bottles of "Totally Awesome" cleaner. It will remove all of the varnish and gunk in about 5 minutes of soaking. Shit's aptly named.

Edit: The m.net article has the dude pulling the plunger out with needle nose pliers. If you just smack the lifter down on a piece of wood they will pop out far enough to remove with your fingers.

rleete 06-03-2015 12:47 PM

I'm assuming you don't have it back together yet, so can't really comment on how it helped/hurt the lifter tick?

I guess I really want to know if it's worth the effort, or is it more jeffbuc gotta clean everything disease?

dieselmiata 06-03-2015 02:34 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Little of column A, little of column B. I haven't updated my build thread in quite some time, but I have Jeff Bucc syndrome badly. Enough that he's given me compliments and props a few times. :party:

I have done it before on another motor and it did help noticeably with lifter tick. The little piece that houses the ball/spring gets gunked up with varnish and sticks. For me though, it's more of a "while I'm in there, why the fuck not" deal. It's only 2 dollars worth of soap and a couple of hours time.

For reference, before and after:
https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1433357528


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1433357528

rleete 06-03-2015 05:27 PM

Oh, I have the disease as well. Put in a new CAS O-ring last Saturday. Time to change O-ring, 15 minutes, tops. Time to clean the CAS and wipe down the firewall, another hour.

I guess I'll take the time to do it. Thanks for the pics.

dieselmiata 06-03-2015 05:40 PM

1 Attachment(s)
MUST....BE.....CLEAN........:yippee:


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1433367639


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