Air Conditioning: low side too high. pressure switch?
 

OK AC Nerds, help me out here.

My miata (2001) a/c worked a month ago. After letting the car sit for a couple weeks, it doesn't work at all. $hit blows hot air.

I did a little diagnosis.

First I verified that the compressor does not spin with the vent fan and AC button pressed. The button lites up, both cooling fans are on.

I pulled the connector on the pressure switch near the low side fill valve and jumped it. The relay clicks and the compressor loads up the motor. I forget if the center of the compressor spins. I did not leave it long enough to test for cold air blowing out of the vents.

I then tried to jam a dye charge into the system but couldn't get the nozzle to seal against the fill valve because of space constraints due to intercooler piping.

I grabbed the recharge can with hose and gauge and snapped that on there and it showed the gauge in the red "WARNING" region. This is the low side--should be 15-20 lbs at 68F ambient. I think the gauge said around 100 psi.

...

So clearly something is causing the low side pressure to increase, but the factory service manual isn't really clear on diagnosing it. You can test the switch itself but that doesn't mean it is the problem or if something else is causing the problem.

Based on my inexperience, I'd guess something in the low pressure side is preventing flow into the compressor OR the pressure switch is bad and the system just wont cycle on and pump down the low pressure side.

halp.

Pressure switch is probably bad.
The low side pressure switch prevents the compressor from running if the suction pressure is too low.
A high side pressure switch prevents the compressor from running if the discharge pressure is too high.
The pressure you show is about right for the static 134 pressure in a system without the compressor running.

When you measured the low pressure side, was the compressor spinning?

Here is what the FSM says. Is this switch on the high side line? The diagram is confusing to me.
https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...1&d=1338912170

No, I haven't tried that. I was somewhat concerned that there would be damage bypassing the pressure switch. If I get enough responses to the contrary I'll try it.

Incidentally, I do vaguely remember seeing nothing in the sight glass.

I have nothing helpful to add to this since I know jack about A/C, but:
I've a crapton of 01 AC parts if you need anything.

Sounds like a bad pressure switch because the pressure you are seeing with a/c off sounds normal.

The FSM diagram appears to be for a hi side switch.
The set of numbers below the sketch describe the size of the hysteresis band.
The ones above are where the dots are located.

I guess that's what confused me. the top numbers give a range and then there's a hysteresis value (or range?!) on the bottom too? Plus the words under the bottom "range" that say "OR LESS".

I read it like this:
There is continuity from about 28-32 psi UP TO 427-483 psi. If pressure drops below those lower fuzzy (tolerance) values there is no continuity, it has to come up to 31.56-35.56 before there is continuity again.

Similarly, above 427-483 somewhere, there is no continuity. continuity returns somewhere 57-113 psi below that.

IF it is a bad pressure switch, that's a big pain in my ass.

and wallet.

unless someone wants to loan me some recovery equipment.

paperclip. i have a bunch, ill bring some home from my desk.

fwiw- the 15-20 psi is for the low side when the compressor is running, otherwise the system tends towards equalizing pressure for both sides.

UPDATE after slightly more checking.

The pressure switch appears to be working. When it is plugged in, the fan comes on, the relay clicks, the idle... uh... ups.

For some reason, the compressor clutch doesn't engage and start pumping.

If I turn the car off and connect the R134a can and gauge to the low side, I can turn the center of the A/C pulley by hand and watch the gauge needle move slightly.

I suppose the next thing to check is the wires at the magnetic clutch.

ac wiring here
http://www.miataforumz.com/1990-200-...C%20System.pdf

Did you jump the relay to see if the clutch pulls in? If it does, jump it while the car is running and see if the air gets cold. If it does, swap the relay and see if that fixes it. If it doesn't, it's most likely low enough not to allow the compressor to kick on.

Normally, with the car running and the compressor cycling you should see readings on the low side of between 20-50psi(factors vary) alternating with each cycle. When shut off, you could see as high as 70-100psi.

I've seen the A/C compressor and condenser fan relays getting EXTREMELY corroded in least 3 different cars. Maybe that is your problem.

Check for power at the AC compressor. If it has power, the clutch might be getting weak. In the Jeep world, we pull a shim out of the clutch and try again. Pulling a shim or two works about 50% of the time. If it doesn't, bend over and get a new compressor/clutch combo.

I'm actually having issues where the high side is at 150 (I kept charging it to get it up to 250 though in 90 degree heat) and the low side never drops below 50psi. Duct temps sit at 50 degrees and won't get any cooler.

relay is activating, you can hear it click on. I'm thinking its the clutch.

Search eBay. I had to replace the clutch on my Jeep, and it only comes as an assembly (with the compressor) from most places. Ebay had the "rebuild" kit with nose bearings and clutch for about 70 bucks.

the relays are fine. one turns on the fan. I swapped the connectors and the other one turns on the fan. so there is power going through both relays.

I will stick a feeler on the clutch tonight or sunday and see how big my gap is. In theory, someone who removed their A/C would have a spare clutch and be generous enough to HOOK A BROTHER UP perhaps!

would the one off lars's 94 fit?

The clutch is shimmed- so you might determine if the magnetic clutch is in activating when voltage is applied. It may just be worn shims vs. a bigger issue. I just picked up a last gen NB compressor and bench tested the clutch with 12v.

I have the old compressor from my '02... the seals are bad, but besides that it worked fine when I removed it. You're welcome to it if you want.

I may take you up on that offer. I can probably re-seal it or use the clutch if mine is bad.

Dump that R134 into a bag and huff it.

Just let me know, I should be able to have it in the mail within a day or so. I am 99% sure I didn't throw it away.

I just checked, I do have it, so it's yours for the cost of shipping, just say the word.

the word is: grease

actually, i'm curious if the pulley comes off easily. the FSM says some BS about a special service tool...

that word has groove and meaning.

The pulley uses a tool similar to what you'd use for an angle grinder- easy enough to make or improvise. Just need to counter the unscrewing action.

I've got a giant pair of channel lock pliers...

and telepathic powers :rofl:

MOAR update:

mag clutch clearance is within spec. On the small side. I'm sure it's fine.

no fuses are blown. related to the AC system.

I have continuity from the relay output to the compressor clutch, so that's good.

I can provide 12V to the clutch and it kicks the AC on and the low side pressure immediately drops below 40, so that's also good.

But for some reason, the relay is not powering the clutch.

Which may SEEM like a simple bad relay (of the other 3 wires, 2 measure 12V and one GND) except that when I swap the relays for the condenser fan and the ac clutch, the AC stays off and the fan runs. Whichever relay is on the fan side, the fan runs and the AC does not run.

The current to the AC clutch is not particularly high. I forget the number but it had a lot of zeroes in front of it.

Brainy is bringing me a spare relay to test.

More ideas?

Bad switch?

you know, someone had an issue with AC working on their MS3.

I'm going to try updating firmware.

I pulled my AC so if you need parts let me know. And since I'm AC retarded, give me a pic of what you need and I'll rummage through the parts bin.

megasquirt is not grounding the a/c output. derrrr.

OK megasquirt IS grounding the output. Until I connect it to the car.

Verified this on two separate outputs.

What would cause that? Bad relay? Remember the same relay works fine with the fan (and output on the megasquirt controlling the fan).

not sure what happened but I fixed it/it fixed itself.

went back to original wiring i had used but with a new TIP120 and it works. it didn't last time I tried it that way, but what do I know?