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-   -   Alternator suddenly red hot? (https://www.miataturbo.net/general-miata-chat-9/alternator-suddenly-red-hot-100584/)

SpartanSV 07-20-2019 07:31 PM


Originally Posted by sixshooter (Post 1542794)
As a reply to you and DKM:
Not resistance across the coil, unfortunately. That's the 30 to 87 resistance while contacted.

And I didn't grab the new alternator to check if warm.

That's bananas.

Got a link to the relays you're using? Did you use your clamp meter to take a current measurement before the relay?

sixshooter 07-20-2019 07:35 PM


Originally Posted by SpartanSV (Post 1542796)
That's bananas.

Got a link to the relays you're using? Did you use your clamp meter to take a current measurement before the relay?

Yes, and it was very similar to the reading closer to the fan, to my recollection. There was some slight fluctuation while running so it would be tough to be exact, but I can try it out tomorrow.

Here's the relays:

SpartanSV 07-20-2019 08:11 PM

If the current measurement before and after the relay is similar then you can't have 151 ohms across the contacts.

I just measured a very similar relay at 0.2 Ohms across the contacts.

sixshooter 07-20-2019 09:26 PM

I'll try a different multimeter tomorrow.

DNMakinson 07-20-2019 09:46 PM

You my just not be using the meter properly. It sounds as if you are trying to read ohms across the contacts while the fan is on. That won't work. It is confusing the Multimeter.

The correct thing is to measure the amps, and then also measure the voltage drop across the contacts. Then you use Ohm's law to the resistance: Ohms = Voltage / Amperes

DNM

sixshooter 07-20-2019 10:34 PM


Originally Posted by DNMakinson (Post 1542810)
You my just not be using the meter properly. It sounds as if you are trying to read ohms across the contacts while the fan is on. That won't work. It is confusing the Multimeter.

The correct thing is to measure the amps, and then also measure the voltage drop across the contacts. Then you use Ohm's law to the resistance: Ohms = Voltage / Amperes

DNM

You're right, I was touching 30 + 87 while the fan was engaged. I didn't realize that would make the difference to anything. For some reason I didn't think the meter was supposed to be bothered by things like that.

I just realized it was DNM and I put DKM earlier. My apologies. I certainly knew there was a K in it but it was in the middle of your last name.

Ted75zcar 07-20-2019 11:46 PM

DMMs use a very small current source to create a voltage across the resisance being measured. If there is already a voltage there, it will muck the reading. I am glad to hear this is the reason for the reading you reported.

DNMakinson 07-21-2019 12:12 AM


Originally Posted by sixshooter (Post 1542813)
You're right, I was touching 30 + 87 while the fan was engaged. I didn't realize that would make the difference to anything. For some reason I didn't think the meter was supposed to be bothered by things like that.

I just realized it was DNM and I put DKM earlier. My apologies. I certainly knew there was a K in it but it was in the middle of your last name.

No worries. We’re just trying to get you to the Gap.

sixshooter 07-21-2019 06:37 AM

2 Attachment(s)

Originally Posted by Ted75zcar (Post 1542815)
DMMs use a very small current source to create a voltage across the resisance being measured. If there is already a voltage there, it will muck the reading. I am glad to hear this is the reason for the reading you reported.

Aha! I'll measure it with the contacts closed and the high current leads removed.

This is how the new wiring was done without a fuse holder. Thankfully it runs much cooler than the store bought holder.

sixshooter 07-21-2019 02:20 PM


Originally Posted by DNMakinson (Post 1542810)
You my just not be using the meter properly. It sounds as if you are trying to read ohms across the contacts while the fan is on. That won't work. It is confusing the Multimeter.

Why are you the only one who knew this, lol?

Bench testing the relay in the closed position with no high current leads attached yields an ohm reading of 0.1 to 0.0 on the same meter.

I'll try doing the voltage drop and amperage measurement method you described in a bit.

sixshooter 07-21-2019 02:52 PM

25.1 amps inline

High current poles on relay during operation:
14.00v
14.02v

What does it all mean?

Ted75zcar 07-21-2019 03:00 PM

Relay is fine

Edit: now measure voltage from relay output to fan input.

3 measurements
Relay out to chassis
Fan in the chassis
Relay out to fan in (mV scale)

All with fan running and associated current measurements

sixshooter 07-21-2019 04:27 PM


Originally Posted by Ted75zcar (Post 1542860)
Relay is fine

Edit: now measure voltage from relay output to fan input.

3 measurements
Relay out to chassis 13.95
Fan in the chassis 13.85
Relay out to fan in (mV scale) 115.0mV

All with fan running and associated current measurements

Relay out to chassis 13.95
Fan in the chassis 13.85
Relay out to fan in (mV scale) 115.0mV
At 25.8 amps measured at fan input.

Ted75zcar 07-21-2019 04:29 PM

Length of wire between relay and fan?

sixshooter 07-21-2019 05:13 PM


Originally Posted by Ted75zcar (Post 1542868)
Length of wire between relay and fan?

18-24 inches I'm guessing. I'm on a run for parts right now.

Ted75zcar 07-21-2019 05:15 PM

Pick up a 40A fuse while you are at it. The relay/wire situatuon sounds fine.

Do you have a thermocouple or an IR temp gauge?

sixshooter 07-21-2019 05:35 PM


Originally Posted by Ted75zcar (Post 1542875)
Pick up a 40A fuse while you are at it. The relay/wire situatuon sounds fine.

Do you have a thermocouple or an IR temp gauge?

I have both. Thermocouple with multimeter was how I measured temperature earlier in thread.

Ted75zcar 07-21-2019 05:44 PM

Great. Take temperatures of the components in question after heat soak, as well as other (preferably like materials/colors) surfaces in close proximity to the areas of interest.


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