Help me seal my oil pan!
 

As some of you may know, my car has been leaking oil for over a year now. It started after I first dropped the subframe and pan to tap for an oil return line. I've pulled the motor 3 times since them in attempts to fix this problem.

It will leak about a quart every 300 miles.
On the latest attempt it seems to only be leaking near the front main bearing.
This weekend will be attempt number 4. I will be putting in a 6 speed transmisson to replace the 5 speed I blew up and dropping the front subframe at the same time.

The block and the oil pan have been honed flat with a large honing stone and I have new oil seals in addition to a new windage tray this time.
I've used rtv blue and also tried rtv black.
Do yall have any tips or tricks that can make this a successfull fix?

We used rtv gray over the weekend. make a nice bead under the windage tray and press it down, then over top as well. you should put a bead around the FMS and RMS curves and replace the curved rubber gaskets in those spots as well.

My rtv had failed at the rear main, looks like it never cured.

Rtv on top of the rubber seals once they are put in too, correct?
Also, rtv around each hole?

Yeah, you should put a bead in the in the curved area, fit the gaskets, there should be a ltittle notch in the middle for them to sit correctly.

Then a continuous bead should be put around the entire perimeter, including the gaskets, and install the pan. I know we made sure to tighten from the middle outward, but the FSM doesn't specify.

Alright I've done all of that correctly in the past attempts. How hard did you press initially and how long did you let it sit before torqing the bolts?

I think the bolts only require like 80-90 in-lbs. so pretty much hand tight on each one. We let it tack up a little before installing, not long. Maybe you need to give it a longer curing time?

Last time I got them finger tight or until the rtv just barely started to squeeze out then waited over night to torque them. That was with rtv blue.

i let mine sit a minimum of 8 hrs before i put oil in it or reinstall it. Do the torque before you let it cure you might have moved something around btw i used RTV black on my last attempt and it has held fine so far.

We went ahead and tightened it once the pan was fit. I think my previous issue was because i was a little overzealous with the rtv, there was a few beads that oozed out and trapped on my pick-up screen.

but rtv ultra gray and black should work best. Ultra black has a lower temp rating, but the label say highest oil resistance. Make sure that surface is clean clean clean clean. We went through 4 cans of brake cleaner cleaning out my pan and various surfaces.

Yes, +1 on keeping everything clean. If you unbolt it and the pan falls into you hand, you did it wrong. It should require some prying with fully cured rtv.

That could be it. I don't recall using brake cleaner to clean it.
I believe the sealant definitely cured well because it required allot prying to remove.
My windage tray got pretty bent up from all of the prying last time I removed it. I straightend it out as best I could but I think that could be why it didn't work this time.

yeah, time to bust out the razor blade too.

The razor blade went to full use. There wasn't a trace of rtv remaining in even the little channels in sealing surface of the pan.

clean all surfaces of all gasket material, but don't gouge or scratch anything. then clean all surfaces well with a scotchbrite pad. then wipe off again with brakleen or whatever you're using. i use black rtv then i just lay the bead. install. i usually wait overnight before filling with oil or running it. also make sure your pan's not bent on the lip or anything

I doubt it, about 110%. Tightening down the oil pan makes that thing flat as a pancake again. There is a failboat making port in Houston TX I believe.

Sure, but not without scraping off some precious sealant in the process. I'd rather be safe than sorry this time. I'm so frustrated that if it doesn't work this time I'm taking the motor to a shop and paying several big ones to have them seal up the pan.

lol nah bryce i had the same issues turns out my leak was a bad front seal pulled the fuckin motor 3 times to find that shit i was so pissed. Clean sur.face good cure time and you are good to go. Oh and you might check your front seal to be sure its not leaking like mine was lol.

W/ Hondas, one of the biggest pains is getting the oil pan to seal properly. The culprit ALWAYS was overtightening of the bolts. Spec is 10lbs. If you make the gasket squeeze out, then it's WAY too much torque.

I think getting a smaller torque wrench that is more accurate w/ lower torque settings would be best.

Permatex Ultra Gray is rec'd, but only in certain areas of the pan. Less is better here.

Blue loctite on the bolts is rec'd, since w/ such low bolt torque, they would back out.

This is all for a B18c1.

That's all well and good on a Honda where you have a rubber gasket. The miata has no such gasket and the seal is made entirely of rtv. We have already detailed the correct proceedure. If he is following it 100% and still having issues then he has other problems. I recommended oil dye in his last thread to see if the leak was coming from higher up and from what I gather it never happened.

:facepalm:

Progress!
Attachment 203177
Attachment 203178
It leaks right about there.
Attachment 203179

It still leaks.


Drove it for about 10 minutes to dinner today, and there was a small puddle underneath it. looked like it was from somewhere in line with the front of the engine. I just wouldn't believe it if it was the crank seal, it's brand new. Maybe the cam seals? But this leak started when I first dropped the pan to tap it. I'll do some more investigating tomorrow.

It's not entirely bad news though as I now have a six speed that is the smoothest shifting transmission I've ever driven. I just can't believe how great it is! Thanks a billion to Rharris.

I also put in a set of MMR motor mounts. My girlfriend was getting a little, no, very excited. They'll be coming out ASAP though as it just isn't right to have every single interior panel vibrating as I'm driving down the street. The NVH isn't so bad if it weren't for all the noise from the panels rattling. That and the tachometer is twitching when cruising at 2K RPMs Words don't do it justice. Video is necessary.

If you put a good enough of a bead of RTV it shouldn't still leak. Sure its not from the oil pump? I guess its just a luck thing perhaps. When I put mine back together both surfaces were scarred up from me using screw drivers and shit to pry them apart. Same for the front main seal surface and I have had no signs of leaking after over 10k miles. I hope you get it fixed though. Nothing more frustrating that something small like that throwing a wrench in your progress. Especially when you aren't 100% sure on whats causing it.

Check all your seals its not the pan.

Like I said forever ago in a different thread of yours. Put in some oil dye, break out your uv light, and then that baby on. This will be the fastest way to track down your leak. You might as well kill yourself for not having done this first.

dude i bet you a hamburger that this is from your front crank seal check that before you do anything else plz. Also Why oh why do you persist in pulling the subframe that makes the job 10 times harder.

Oil dye huh? Sorry I don't remember you mentioning that. There's just something about having UV dye all over my car that I don't like.

The reason I resealed the oil pan this time is because I witnessed oiling coming from the pan seal itself, not dripping down from above. Now it seems the leak is smaller and dripping down at the timing cover seal on the drivers side of the engine now. That points to the front crank seal. It also didn't leak until I took it off the wheel ramps under the front tires and had it on flat ground, which also points the front crank seal. It just makes me wonder because I've replaced that seal twice during my crusades to fix this leak.

Attachment 202994


It shouldn't be the oil pump, I resealed it with new gaskets the last time I tried fixing the leak.

I like pulling the subframe. I feel that it makes the job 10X Easier.


Thanks for the help and suggestions guys, I really appreciate it.

Magna, I'll get your paypal address if it really is the front crank seal. ;)

UV dye all over the place? I'm | | that close to labeling you a complete noob at this point. You drop a small bottle into your oil, and it shows you exactly where the leak is coming from. The only way it gets all over the place is if you start flinging it all over the place like a fucking monkey.

Work smart, not hard.

Ordered some dye.

You can buy it at advanced auto...

Agggghhh! Of course the one place I don't check has it!

I feel your pain. I have been fighting multiple seals trying to get the leaks to stop. I need to re-seal the entire front of the motor but Ive given up for now. I keep an eye on the level and early spring i plan on pulling it out, resealing everything possible with OEM gaskets and grey RTV ... and adding a coolant reroute.