nitrous on a miata?
03-13-2009, 05:45 PM
#1
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nitrous on a miata?
I couldn't find much info on nitrous use on miatas. I guess it's not very popular and this may be the wrong forum for asking anyway, but i'd like to try it.
Is there any records of nitrous being used safely on miatas? up to what shot would be considered safe? dry/wet?
Is there any records of nitrous being used safely on miatas? up to what shot would be considered safe? dry/wet?
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03-13-2009, 07:29 PM
#4
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I have a Zex EFI kit. 55,65 and 75hp jets are included in the kit.It's a wet kit, I wouldn't use anything else. I have tried all the jets, currently have the 65's in as 75 make the standard clutch slip, I really like it, I'm on my second bottle with no problems so far. I say go for it ,I always wanted to try it and am happy I did. I'm in the process of turboing so not sure if I will keep it on this car or take it off for the next project.
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03-13-2009, 07:53 PM
#5
I have nos on my turbo miata what do u wanna know man? 
Stockish motors 50 or so hp is considered safe on a simple wet fogger. Direct port wet shots like the setup patsmx5 was using while he was NA should be decent for about 75 or so hp he ran 100 but he also paid close attention to it and has alota history. For a dry shot with a Fpr with i dont realy consider safe given how instant nitrous is i would not go past probly 30 hp. Lets here on what u have and your experience with nitrous in general man so we can help u more. FWIW guys boost activated Nos kicks major *** omfg its like 2-3 more psi just jumped in on top end but im still running the same boost.
Stockish motors 50 or so hp is considered safe on a simple wet fogger. Direct port wet shots like the setup patsmx5 was using while he was NA should be decent for about 75 or so hp he ran 100 but he also paid close attention to it and has alota history. For a dry shot with a Fpr with i dont realy consider safe given how instant nitrous is i would not go past probly 30 hp. Lets here on what u have and your experience with nitrous in general man so we can help u more. FWIW guys boost activated Nos kicks major *** omfg its like 2-3 more psi just jumped in on top end but im still running the same boost.
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03-13-2009, 07:57 PM
#6
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is pat on this forum as well?
greenie, will it slip at any rpm? gear? if thats the case a progressive nitrous controller may help. ive seen a couple of jacobs masterminds go $100-125 on ebay. I'm sure the clutch can handle a gradual 75 shot since turbo guys run more than that on it. it just cant take all the shock at once. Are you doing anything for timing at 75? What jets are you running (orifice size) and at what fuel/bottle pressures?
greenie, will it slip at any rpm? gear? if thats the case a progressive nitrous controller may help. ive seen a couple of jacobs masterminds go $100-125 on ebay. I'm sure the clutch can handle a gradual 75 shot since turbo guys run more than that on it. it just cant take all the shock at once. Are you doing anything for timing at 75? What jets are you running (orifice size) and at what fuel/bottle pressures?
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03-13-2009, 08:07 PM
#7
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Slip's in fourth pretty much as soon as I hit it. New flywheel will be here Monday so I can get my new clutch built, so will fix that problem. For 75hp retard timing 4 degrees from stock (10*). I am running MS now so it can do the the timing retard for me, just have to make a couple of wiring changes to get it going. At work at the moment and can't remember the jet sizes. I have a Walbro 190lph HP pump with standard FPR. Not sure of bottle pressures as I dont have a gauge.
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03-13-2009, 08:11 PM
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my history with nitrous is a 55 dry kit on a civic about 8years ago, gained no knowledge from that experience, and more recently a 5.0 with 125 single fogger. nothing crazy.
so keep at 50 shot with a single fogger? thats pretty weak :(. I originally wanted to destroy this motor on nitrous and turbo a 1.8 but now that I've started parting a diy turbo kit i'm having second thoughts. The nitrous is already installed but I havent ran any through the motor.
so keep at 50 shot with a single fogger? thats pretty weak :(. I originally wanted to destroy this motor on nitrous and turbo a 1.8 but now that I've started parting a diy turbo kit i'm having second thoughts. The nitrous is already installed but I havent ran any through the motor.
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03-13-2009, 08:11 PM
#9
Pat recently got banned from here for well stuff u can ask Rick about.
Your clutch will prob slip if its a standard 1.6 clutch when u hit the Nos. The shitiest part of nitrous however is the expense of filling the bottle. Last time i went and filled mine it was 6 dollars a pound. This might last a half hour of spray time if you run a smallish shot. You realy shouldnt wast the money on a timmer if you just wanna try a cheap system and enjoy it awhile they realy only help in more complicated setups where traction and hp staging is more important and you cant rely on human movement IE switch armed WOT switch activation. Most nitrous setups and bottles tend to be set up for areoun 1200-1400 psi on the tank.
There is still hope throw the turbo on and the nitrous as wells the motorr is most certianly not the weak link in these cars. Done corectly u will shreds more transmissions, subframes, and diferentials, than u will motors. Stout *** block decent pistons given no detonation. Decent rods so long as you stay under 300 whp or so. We dont blow head gaskets either so less worry there.
Your clutch will prob slip if its a standard 1.6 clutch when u hit the Nos. The shitiest part of nitrous however is the expense of filling the bottle. Last time i went and filled mine it was 6 dollars a pound. This might last a half hour of spray time if you run a smallish shot. You realy shouldnt wast the money on a timmer if you just wanna try a cheap system and enjoy it awhile they realy only help in more complicated setups where traction and hp staging is more important and you cant rely on human movement IE switch armed WOT switch activation. Most nitrous setups and bottles tend to be set up for areoun 1200-1400 psi on the tank.
There is still hope throw the turbo on and the nitrous as wells the motorr is most certianly not the weak link in these cars. Done corectly u will shreds more transmissions, subframes, and diferentials, than u will motors. Stout *** block decent pistons given no detonation. Decent rods so long as you stay under 300 whp or so. We dont blow head gaskets either so less worry there.
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Summer at the moment so low to mid 20's(celcius).
03-13-2009, 08:18 PM
#12
No bottle heater but given my HP my miata doesnt venture out into the cold and snow. Overall so long as you are ove 60 degrees for the most part you should keep fair pressure. They can however help prolong the useage out of a tank a few more sprays so i see bottle heaters as a nice accessory but not a absolute must have.
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03-13-2009, 08:36 PM
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I'll try to contact him over on miata.net, thanks for the info.
a progressive controller, i think, would help with most of those issues (subframe tear, tranny, differential...maybe not the 6" differential) because it doesn't shock the drivetrain with all the power at once. I'm pretty sure traction becomes an issue too unless just spraying in higher gears. the progressive controller allows a "spool-up" of the nitrous based on rpm. not to mention, for $125 you get timing control, some fuel control, and a window switch. once youre done with it, you sell it for the same price. I think its a pretty good investment for a nitrous setup
I'm going to tune for 1000psi bottle pressure, 1400 is pretty high imo. i have a heater with a pressure switch to keep it constant
n2o is $3.50/lb retail here in dallas, but i'd be getting it for about half of that through a buddy that works at a mustang shop.
a progressive controller, i think, would help with most of those issues (subframe tear, tranny, differential...maybe not the 6" differential) because it doesn't shock the drivetrain with all the power at once. I'm pretty sure traction becomes an issue too unless just spraying in higher gears. the progressive controller allows a "spool-up" of the nitrous based on rpm. not to mention, for $125 you get timing control, some fuel control, and a window switch. once youre done with it, you sell it for the same price. I think its a pretty good investment for a nitrous setup
I'm going to tune for 1000psi bottle pressure, 1400 is pretty high imo. i have a heater with a pressure switch to keep it constant
n2o is $3.50/lb retail here in dallas, but i'd be getting it for about half of that through a buddy that works at a mustang shop.
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03-13-2009, 08:49 PM
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you can't expect me to convert that the the american standard :P
I did mean you, I didn't realize magnamx-5 was spraying too, I gigured he was talking about pat's setup. I don't think youre getting the full effect of the shot at that temperature greenie. youre only at about 700psi bottle pressure at 20degrees celcius. lower after each time you spray.
I will take you up on the beer if im ever in NZ though.
magnamx-5, i think you underestimate the difference bottle temp/pressure makes. if youre still spraying, I suggest warming the bottle by submerging it in hot water (tub, bucket, whatever works) to 100F, just to see what difference it makes. its not short ram vs CAI difference...you WILL feel it.
I did mean you, I didn't realize magnamx-5 was spraying too, I gigured he was talking about pat's setup. I don't think youre getting the full effect of the shot at that temperature greenie. youre only at about 700psi bottle pressure at 20degrees celcius. lower after each time you spray.
I will take you up on the beer if im ever in NZ though.
magnamx-5, i think you underestimate the difference bottle temp/pressure makes. if youre still spraying, I suggest warming the bottle by submerging it in hot water (tub, bucket, whatever works) to 100F, just to see what difference it makes. its not short ram vs CAI difference...you WILL feel it.
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03-13-2009, 09:00 PM
#16
no i dont underestimate it just the noss is alil extra for me and i keep my pressure above 1k or get it refilled. If i had a bottle heater i could go longer but like i said the cost of nos keeps me from using it in excess. LOL i know all about pressure deferentials flow rates etc man but a digestion here would be wasted on most.
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03-13-2009, 09:10 PM
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Pressure inside the bottle remains constant until about 80% empty. The liquid nitrogen is pressurized by the gas inside the bottle that expands under heat. Pressure doesn't have a linear relationship to bottle content.
Heres the temp to pressure replationship from 100%-20% full bottle
Temp °F Pressure (psi)
-30 167
-20 203
-10 240
0 283
10 335
20 387
32 460
40 520
50 590
60 675
70 760
80 865
85 950
97 1069
Heres the temp to pressure replationship from 100%-20% full bottle
Temp °F Pressure (psi)
-30 167
-20 203
-10 240
0 283
10 335
20 387
32 460
40 520
50 590
60 675
70 760
80 865
85 950
97 1069
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03-13-2009, 09:18 PM
#20
lol well **** here i thought we had your average 15 year old wanting to be stuper fast with naws and u bust out actual good information proving u are infact quite knowledgable and probly have more xperience than me with nitrous equipment andimplementation i bow to superrior knowledge of science man well done. Scot we should change there user designations these 2 do not seem to be newbs at all to me.
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