random death and now not starting
 

I was on my way to work this morning, I did one medium pull coming off the ramp onto the freeway. Then I was coasting (in decel) I gave the car some gas and nothing, once out of gear the RPMS drop. So I try to start the car turns over but wont start. I noticed a little smoke coming out of the hood where the air filter is.

Once I was pulled over and trying to start it a little smoke would come out of the air filter each time the motor turned over. That stopped after I tried to start it a few times


I checked the spark plugs they seemed normal nothing weird.. changed them anyway.
Sprayed starting fluid.
check all plugs for spark, all good.
Still won’t start.

It turns over without a problem but it won’t fire up at all, even when starting fluid is being sprayed in.
The fuel pump is working I can hear it come on if I move the flapper in the AFM.

As far as I can tell it is getting the three essentials (gas, spark, air) any ideas???

Tow truck is on its way.. :mad:

also checked for oil in the intake tract... nothing

Possibly broke a timing belt. They always break when pulling off the interstate. No idea why, but I could tell you 10 times when belt broke, and 9 of them were pulling off the interstate.

Pull the valve cover and it will be obvious. Also it would crank "funny" cause it has no compression.

I was just thinking that..
the timing belt is brand new though.. will deff check that though

Second thought you wouldn't have spark if the belt broke cause the cam angle sensor is driven off of a camshaft. Hmm. Dunno. I'd do compression test next for sure.

ahh true I didnt even think about that.. I am at home now so i guess I'll take the compression tester to the car while I wait..


Thanks man

I checked the compresion, all four cylinders were good.. not great

Switched the MAF still wont start..

Is there another sensor that would keep the motor from starting?

I cant think of anything else

Make damn sure you got spark on all 4 cylinders again. And check fuel pressure.

is it possible that the coil pack has gone bad so it can't make spark in the cylinder but it can when you check for spark outside the cylinder?

The spark seems fairly strong outside when outside the cylinder.. but even with a weak spark wouldnt the motor at least try to fire?

I am pretty sure it isnt fuel related as the motor wont even run off starting fluid, but I'll check the fuel pressure when I get home from work to see

The plugs should be wet if you're getting fuel. You could do a leak down, but it's weird it wouldn't be running at all. If the MS is sparking, that means you have enough timing information to get something running - it could be the timing is way off, but that's weird.

Dunno, kinda stumped.

could the ECU be fried?

I dont think the timing is messed up, unless the belt skipped. I checked the CAS and it wasnt loose.

Check all your fuses. I think you aren't getting fuel. Were the plugs wet with fuel when you pulled them? You said they looked normal. If you try cranking it and it never starts and then pull the plugs and they are dry, you ain't getting fuel.

I cranked it with the plugs out and you could see the vapor coming out. The plugs were wet when I took them out.

What was the compression when you checked it? Did you have the throttle open when you did the test and have a good charged battery?

Check the cas sensor,mark correct location, remove it and put the wires back on them.

Remove 1 sparkplug at a time, put them back on the cable.
Put ignition on ON, rotate the cas by hand while holding the sparkplug against the metal valve cover.(spark)
Test all 4, or at least both coilpacks (always have 3 inside the engine)

You have spark?

Next replace the afm with a good one...

compression was about 95-100 on all cylinders.. with WOT
(high elevation) battery was probably hurting as I had been cranking the engine several times before I got to the compression test

will try this method tonight..

I did switch the AFM with one I know was working though

thats super low compression

yeah that's really shitty compression. Put the motor at TDC and check the cam gear marks. I doubt it, but I guess it's 'possilbe' it jumped time. But likely, something in your motor broke or something to loose that much pressure. Did you blow a head gasket? Any water in oil, oil in water, water/oil in cylinders, etc? Leakdown test and verifying cam timing are next two things to check for sure.

No alarm system with a loose connection??
Do you have blown an ic hose?? (assuming you are running stock ecu and afpr)
The simptoms off the greddy set after the stock x-over tube is loose..
(check all hoses between AFM and trottlebody)


So do you have spark and fuel??

Good thing I have all these tools from when the motor this one replaced blew up.
:vash:

no alarm

no blown off hoses

no loose anything

spark and fuel as far as I can tell

I'll be home in two hours to start testing again

have you varified that the timing belt works? You say there is spark but where in the cycle does it spark? A timing light should tell you that. Maybe it's off by some amount causing it to fire when there is no fuel in there. that would be hard though, since it's a wasted spark system anyway.

I am going to check the time first thing when I get home.. I am really hoping that is the problem.

I dont want to deal with sending the engine back in for warranty issues

I did this but I couldnt get a spark when I moved the CAS

there is a spark when cranking the engine however

How wet should the plugs be after cranking it?? I can smell the gas on them but they arent visibly wet.

Yeah - low compression will keep a motor from working.

Cam timing being way off would do this. So would messed up valves.

It's hydralic lifters? What's the past like on this head? I'm thinking head gasket or valves.

I didnt see any oil in the coolant.. I havent had a chance to do much with it... hopefully today I can check out the timing belt

ok I think I found the problem, the timing belt is loose as hell. I'm really really hoping it just jumped..


will update shortly

This can't be good:
Attachment 210185

I'm thinking that's the reason my belt has a nice cut out of it.

The timing is no where near being right, you cant even see the notch on the crankshaft when the cams are lined up

You're gonna wanna fix that.

That's going to involve taking the crankshaft out isn't it

Negative. 22mm bolt in that pic is what holds that little gear on the crank. Remove that bolt, and it will come off with some effort. Slide a new one on. But figure out why the belt got loose before. Was the tensioner torqued down? Timing belts are not rocket science.

Change the water pump too while you got it all apart, unless it's like Really really new. I'd just change it anyways so you don't have to worry about it. And camshaft seals, change them too.

Second thoughts, that pic don't look right. I'm no expert though, but it looks like that gear is too far back. I could swear that big bolt should hold it in place, but it doesn't appear that way from the pic. I dunno.

All these things were changed before I got the engine.. so maybe... 4 or 5 months?
I should have checked everything before I put it in..

The one off the long nose crank wont fit will it?

I guess if I have to I can swap the crankshaft to a longnose one.
I'd really rather not though.

I will go tinker some more and see what I can find out

Just leave the engine in...No the gears from the longnose crank won't fit...

Remove the bold (you can use the starter motor to undo it, put a big wrench between the passenger underside of the bodywork...)
Replace the gear... It is easy when it comes off...Somitimes they are stuck. Ive seen 2 off these in the last couple off years. They couldnt get the gear off so they tried to remove it using a screwdriver. Guess who won...
Also have a heatgun ready when the gear is stuck.. 5 minutes heating and 2 screwdrivers and the gear will be loose.

Replace timingbeld!

Dont you have to take the oil pan off to get the oil pump out?

I heat them up with a blow torch. hehehhe. I did say heat, not cut off. And you have to be fast.
If you do do it this way. Do it like super quick or you will catch something on fire.

It's just a timingbeld gear that need to be removed... not changing the oil pump...

cool thanks guys

check to make sure the woodruff key is set well in there too when you pull the gear off. You'll want to replace it (and probably the crank) if it wiggles at all. It looks good in the picture, but pictures can lie.

As I was attempting to pry off the sprocket I heard something fall and hit the ground...


Attachment 210168


Freaking awesome!

How did you do that!?
(ps you can also use the 10mm bolds to get the gear off , bu t i assume it is already off.

to get cogs off in the past, it has helped me to tap the perimeter of the gear with a hammer LIGHTLY!! in order to dislodge any rust holding it in place. Those things are always bitches though.

It just broke off.. I'm guessing it was cracked already..
Still havent gotten it off

Nicacus...

Just noticed you're in West Valley. If you still haven't got this sorted by Saturday I'd be happy to give you a hand. PM me if you need anything.

-SC

Changing the timing belt fixed it.
I would have had it done on friday but, the retard at the dealer put my order in late so i had to wait until monday to get the parts.

Total cost was about $240
Changed the tensioner pulley, idler pulley, tension spring, crankshaft sprocket, and woodruff key.

Not nearly as difficult as I thought it was going to be.

behold the array of shiny new parts!

Attachment 210079