Timing belt walking
 

I kept hearing a noise coming from under the timing cover. Pulled the valve cover to see the timing belt was sitting flush on the back side of the cam gears and a groove had been put on the belt. Changed the belt and idler and tensioner as well as a new crank gear. The belt is still want to walk to the back side of the gears up against motor. Does any one know what could be going on with it. Its a 1.6l.

thanks
geo

Since its a 1.6L I am going to guess something to do with the crank.

/\yup. short nose?

yes i believe it is the short nose. What would cause it to make the timing belt to shift to one side.

geo

The timing belt gear is far enough back on the crankshaft that it shouldn't be affected, should it? I would have guessed it to be bad bearings on the pulleys or the mounting points for those pulleys aren't square or true. Or maybe something on the cover is pushing the belt rearward.

Yea you're probably right. I thought maybe the gear could be walking out a little, which believe it or not can cause the belt near the top side (cam gear area) to walk in towards the motor. But unlikely.

Op did this just start happening? Or was it after something was done?

Since you have replaced almost everything, im going to agree with Six, that something isn't flat or square somewhere. IIRC doesn't the idler bolt to the water pump? Was that replaced recently?

Check the condition that f your tensioner,then work your way down to the crankshaft. Problems with either will cause a tilt towards the back.

OP says belt, both idler and tensioner and even the crank gear have been replaced.

I am thinking something is not installed properly.

the belt walked to the back of the motor and put a groove on the belt that'swhyi replaced it with a new timing set (belt, tensioner and idler). Installed every thing including a new (used) crank pulley. Turned the motor over a few times by hand and everything seemed fine. As soon as i put it back together and started car it i could hear the rubbing noise again. Pulled the valve cover off and yes it had walked again. So I pulled it all apart again this morning and can't see anything that is going on with it. Gonna replace the water pump this time and see if this makes any difference since the idler and tensioner bolt to it. Any other suggestions would be appreciated.

thanks
geo

First off, always do a water pump when you replace the timing belt, unless you're only fixing a mistake from a WP/TB job you just did.

2ndly, take pictures of everything apart and post them here. Crank pulley, timing pulleys, installed belt, crank key way, woodruff key, etc.

Only saying that because I'm willing to bet money that replacing the water pump won't fix your issue.

​​​​​​Wait, why replace the wp every time? Don't folks typically replace the TB every 50-60k miles? Sounds low for a water pump!

Cause most people go more like 80k.

Plus let's say you do the timing belt at 60k, then the water pump leaks at 80. Would you rather spend $30 at 60k or save $30 for 20k so you can tear it all apart again to change the water pump?

Have fun doing the job over again 20k miles later when the WP leaks. It's a $49 part.

Its standard practice on any engine with a timing belt driven water pump to service them at the same time.

Ah, my understanding was that the TB was to be done every 50k and wp every 100k. I guess it makes sense to do both earlier if you're putting your car through the paces a bit more as most folks do here.

A little update. Took the car apart on Saturday (removed cam gears water pump and all.) Looked everything over and saw nothing that looked out of place. put in new water pump and installed every thing. (suck because my jass performance cam tool came in today and boy i could have used it Saturday oh well) after all that the car seems to be running fine and I don't hear the belt rubbing so what ever I changed seemed to work. So now I can get back to installing my coil overs, steering wheel and all my jass performance interior pieces. Also finish soldering my diypnp megasquirt. Hopefully my next post will be pics of the car. One question is i put an offset wheel that i didn't really like but loved the look of the wheels. I see all of the different fender rollers that I can order doe's anyone have any experience with a particular brand or website.

thanks
geo