Running E85
02-23-2009, 12:24 PM
#1
Running E85
Anyone running E85 in their Miata's yet?
I know some of you are running stand alones and the cars I use to be into which were the 240sx are starting to run E85 with some great results. Just wondering if anyone here is yet.
I know some of you are running stand alones and the cars I use to be into which were the 240sx are starting to run E85 with some great results. Just wondering if anyone here is yet.
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02-23-2009, 03:59 PM
#4
Yeah, second observation I found was that there were a bunch of homo's running around here. Something about Mexican ---- rape in another thread.
Anyways, the guys running E85 are doing really well. Haven't heard any cons about it except for how hard it is to get it. These are guys that are doing track events and just some power junkies. One guy was running it in his RB20, before coming into contact with a dump truck.
One reason I am interested is just the fact against knock, specifically in the heat. Then during the winter switching back to 91. But I already know the tuning aspect of it, was just curious about the people that may/may not be running it.
Anyways, the guys running E85 are doing really well. Haven't heard any cons about it except for how hard it is to get it. These are guys that are doing track events and just some power junkies. One guy was running it in his RB20, before coming into contact with a dump truck.
One reason I am interested is just the fact against knock, specifically in the heat. Then during the winter switching back to 91. But I already know the tuning aspect of it, was just curious about the people that may/may not be running it.
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02-23-2009, 05:10 PM
#5
Just curious why you guys say E85 is a joke? Isn't it like 104 octane? Sure you might lose a few mpg, but you stand to gain some decent power out of it when you're tuned right?
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02-23-2009, 06:16 PM
#7
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Ya I am a little pissy cause **** like you are too lazy to use a ******* search tool, you expect everyone on the interweb to do your biddings for you. Why do I think E85 is a joke? well heavy concentration of ethanol is not good for your injectors, especially if you have been using them for petroleum it tends to gum them up more. I assume more rigorous cleaning of the injection system or a change of injectors might change the outcome.
I probably have more experience with this stuff since I work in the automotive industry...I see cars on a daily basis that have 100 times more power then the most powerful miatas that run on 114 octane gas. You talk to anyone of these guys they would laugh at you for runing E85 in a performance car then again you are preaching to old gear heads stuck in there own way.
I dont know how it is in the US but I dont know any gasoline retailer in Canada so for me I would much rather get 97 octane and add a can of Holley's NOS octane booster there "off-road" blend gives something like 11points to your octane when mixed properly use less fuel and you have a higher ratio.
For me its not worth the hassel and effort to drive all over town to find someone that is selling E85 for $0.07/litre cheaper then gasoline. If its all over knock that you wanna do E85 just run premium with octane booster or get a water/meth injection kit and run on good ol' 87 octane with windshield washer fluid!
This is why I think e85 is a joke its just not readily available or practical...but hey each to there own people still use propane it can make some wicked power too but the mileage sucks.
I probably have more experience with this stuff since I work in the automotive industry...I see cars on a daily basis that have 100 times more power then the most powerful miatas that run on 114 octane gas. You talk to anyone of these guys they would laugh at you for runing E85 in a performance car then again you are preaching to old gear heads stuck in there own way.
I dont know how it is in the US but I dont know any gasoline retailer in Canada so for me I would much rather get 97 octane and add a can of Holley's NOS octane booster there "off-road" blend gives something like 11points to your octane when mixed properly use less fuel and you have a higher ratio.
For me its not worth the hassel and effort to drive all over town to find someone that is selling E85 for $0.07/litre cheaper then gasoline. If its all over knock that you wanna do E85 just run premium with octane booster or get a water/meth injection kit and run on good ol' 87 octane with windshield washer fluid!
This is why I think e85 is a joke its just not readily available or practical...but hey each to there own people still use propane it can make some wicked power too but the mileage sucks.
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02-23-2009, 06:47 PM
#8
twistyz,
You obviously don't have as much experience as you claim in running E85 in a modern gas engine. If you can tune for it it's a great, cheap race gas. All you need is bigger injectors. Buying VP or Sunoco race gas of the same octane is 5 times the price. There's 79 pages of E85 information at the NASIOC Subaru Forum:
E85 fuel FAQ - NASIOC
No Octane booster comes close. Torco is the only one worth a **** and it's expensive and won't raise 93 octane to the 100 level at any safe or affordable concentration.
Frank
You obviously don't have as much experience as you claim in running E85 in a modern gas engine. If you can tune for it it's a great, cheap race gas. All you need is bigger injectors. Buying VP or Sunoco race gas of the same octane is 5 times the price. There's 79 pages of E85 information at the NASIOC Subaru Forum:
E85 fuel FAQ - NASIOC
No Octane booster comes close. Torco is the only one worth a **** and it's expensive and won't raise 93 octane to the 100 level at any safe or affordable concentration.
Frank
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02-23-2009, 07:16 PM
#10
Ya I am a little pissy cause **** like you are too lazy to use a ******* search tool, you expect everyone on the interweb to do your biddings for you. Why do I think E85 is a joke? well heavy concentration of ethanol is not good for your injectors, especially if you have been using them for petroleum it tends to gum them up more. I assume more rigorous cleaning of the injection system or a change of injectors might change the outcome.
Also, if you are able to read, I was asking about people running it in their Miata. I was curious to see if people on this side have started to use it. Yes I could have searched, but what I did was ask if people were running it. If you weren't you didn't 1) have to read the thread and 2) put your little comments in the thread. But you did, and now it seems like someone poop'd in your cereal this morning.
I probably have more experience with this stuff since I work in the automotive industry...I see cars on a daily basis that have 100 times more power then the most powerful miatas that run on 114 octane gas. You talk to anyone of these guys they would laugh at you for runing E85 in a performance car then again you are preaching to old gear heads stuck in there own way.
I dont know how it is in the US but I dont know any gasoline retailer in Canada so for me I would much rather get 97 octane and add a can of Holley's NOS octane booster there "off-road" blend gives something like 11points to your octane when mixed properly use less fuel and you have a higher ratio.
For me its not worth the hassel and effort to drive all over town to find someone that is selling E85 for $0.07/litre cheaper then gasoline. If its all over knock that you wanna do E85 just run premium with octane booster or get a water/meth injection kit and run on good ol' 87 octane with windshield washer fluid!
This is why I think e85 is a joke its just not readily available or practical...but hey each to there own people still use propane it can make some wicked power too but the mileage sucks.
Btw, the guys running E85 over in my land are averaging between 25-30mpg. Running it for a year or so. Haven't had any "gunking" problems.
There is a myth that it is corrosive, but most current fuel lines/injectors already are built to withstand this. And this is in real world applications. Also to run it, you do have to use injectors about 25-30% larger, depending on tune.
Also, it's easier for me to fill up my gas tank and do a quick map retune and drive around during the summer than remember about water injection. Besides, if you can do one thing that gets rid of another, isn't that more logical?
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02-23-2009, 07:25 PM
#11
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lol it was a slight exageration, not quiet 100 times but ya in my division we deal with anything from 400hp hondas to 8000hp top fuel nitro burning dragsters. It was just to illustrate a point.
Who said he was running it in a modern engine? I dont see e85 flex fuel emblems on the back of any miata. My engine is personally 19 years old and I know it wouldnt run properly on e85.
No clue on how cheap e85 is as I mentioned we cant get it here but a 55gallon drum of 114octance runs about $700CAD and 114 octane is over kill. I never said I had lots of knowledge with E85 infact I would have guessed my bashing would hint I stay away from it.
From what I heard around the bean pole here (I work hi performance parts only) E85 is just not what its cracked up to be. I guess it has its place but whats the point to tuning a engine to run E85 I mean its not possible but why? Seems like alot of cost and effort to run cheap race gas.
Who said he was running it in a modern engine? I dont see e85 flex fuel emblems on the back of any miata. My engine is personally 19 years old and I know it wouldnt run properly on e85.
No clue on how cheap e85 is as I mentioned we cant get it here but a 55gallon drum of 114octance runs about $700CAD and 114 octane is over kill. I never said I had lots of knowledge with E85 infact I would have guessed my bashing would hint I stay away from it.
From what I heard around the bean pole here (I work hi performance parts only) E85 is just not what its cracked up to be. I guess it has its place but whats the point to tuning a engine to run E85 I mean its not possible but why? Seems like alot of cost and effort to run cheap race gas.
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02-23-2009, 07:28 PM
#12
my understanding is that it cleans things better than the additives in normal gasoline and that most cars won't see a problem with it as "gasoline" has had like 10% ethanol in it for a long time. also people have been reporting not much of a penalty in economy which mathematically doesn't make sense unless it can run similar a/f ratios for idle and cruise that gasoline can. that being said i have no first hand experience because the closest place is about 30 miles away.
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02-23-2009, 07:41 PM
#13
Who said he was running it in a modern engine? I dont see e85 flex fuel emblems on the back of any miata. My engine is personally 19 years old and I know it wouldnt run properly on e85.
Engines do the same thing...regardless of how many cylinders it has or year constructed. Running E85 allows the person to run higher boost on a cheaper source. Some of the guys running their cars would need to use 100+ octane, which is over $7/gallon if not more now here. Now compare that with E85 which right now is about $2/gallon...yeah it's cheaper overall, even with a mileage decrease. But again these guys are getting 25-30mpg with 300-400rwhp.
No clue on how cheap e85 is as I mentioned we cant get it here but a 55gallon drum of 114octance runs about $700CAD and 114 octane is over kill. I never said I had lots of knowledge with E85 infact I would have guessed my bashing would hint I stay away from it.
From what I heard around the bean pole here (I work hi performance parts only) E85 is just not what its cracked up to be. I guess it has its place but whats the point to tuning a engine to run E85 I mean its not possible but why? Seems like alot of cost and effort to run cheap race gas.
About it cleaning the engine...IDK. We haven't broken down and engine before and after it. But in theory it sounds like it could.
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02-23-2009, 07:43 PM
#14
Forgot to mention, people in the grain belt, E85 is more plentiful and cheaper. My buddy from Omaha said E85 was like $2 something a gallon when he filled up at the time normal gas was $4/gallon.
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02-23-2009, 07:45 PM
#15
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Actually I wasnt really pissed until now...
Well thanks for imputing about Canada's problems...this is the US I was talking about. Sorry for the confusion...eh.
And Americans wonder why 90% of the world thinks they are arrogant and big headed, you are the model example of why....
GFY with a cheese grater
Actually since you don't have it...as you stated above...I guess you don't have to worry about driving all over town. I do know of places near and around my house, you might wanted to have taken that into consideration. Also when gas spiked at $4/gallon here, E85 was running around $3.50/gallon.
Ya we dont have E85 cause our dog sleds dont run off it, its probably sold somewhere at one of these igloos, but I could careless where...And dont bitch about gas prices when its your presidents fault...next time dont **** off the oil rich countries and gas will still be at $0.55/litre like it was 10 years ago...thanks for your country ******* it up for all of us for nothing....THANKS!
And if you are looking for wicked power, mileage is going to suck regardless.
Not Always...Depends on how your are making the power
Also, it's easier for me to fill up my gas tank and do a quick map retune and drive around during the summer than remember about water injection. Besides, if you can do one thing that gets rid of another, isn't that more logical?
WTF do you have to remember about water injection, you install it and keep your water tank full...sounds pretty easy to me and you dont ever worry about E85.
I dont really want to argue with some kid over the internet about this as it seems pretty pointless so why dont you just try it out and see how it works for you. If you **** your **** up you know we were right and if it works well then you got a cheap alternative to race fuel.
Well thanks for imputing about Canada's problems...this is the US I was talking about. Sorry for the confusion...eh.
And Americans wonder why 90% of the world thinks they are arrogant and big headed, you are the model example of why....
GFY with a cheese graterActually since you don't have it...as you stated above...I guess you don't have to worry about driving all over town. I do know of places near and around my house, you might wanted to have taken that into consideration. Also when gas spiked at $4/gallon here, E85 was running around $3.50/gallon.
Ya we dont have E85 cause our dog sleds dont run off it, its probably sold somewhere at one of these igloos, but I could careless where...And dont bitch about gas prices when its your presidents fault...next time dont **** off the oil rich countries and gas will still be at $0.55/litre like it was 10 years ago...thanks for your country ******* it up for all of us for nothing....THANKS!
And if you are looking for wicked power, mileage is going to suck regardless.
Not Always...Depends on how your are making the power
Also, it's easier for me to fill up my gas tank and do a quick map retune and drive around during the summer than remember about water injection. Besides, if you can do one thing that gets rid of another, isn't that more logical?
WTF do you have to remember about water injection, you install it and keep your water tank full...sounds pretty easy to me and you dont ever worry about E85.
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02-23-2009, 07:49 PM
#16
Actually I wasnt really pissed until now...
I dont really want to argue with some kid over the internet about this as it seems pretty pointless so why dont you just try it out and see how it works for you. If you **** your **** up you know we were right and if it works well then you got a cheap alternative to race fuel.
I dont really want to argue with some kid over the internet about this as it seems pretty pointless so why dont you just try it out and see how it works for you. If you **** your **** up you know we were right and if it works well then you got a cheap alternative to race fuel.
Have some insecurities about being Canadian? It's ok, many do.
Oh forgot to mention...we didn't screw up the gas...demand goes up for a product, so does price. Economics 101. Thanks!
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02-23-2009, 07:56 PM
#17
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Well heres the only difference between RWD and FWD
RWD = Fun to Drive
FWD = Better traction cause the weight is on the drive tires
I consider a modern motor to be anything that has some method of fuel injection on it. Not to mention a lot of cars from back in the 60's and 70's could have pretty mean problems fixed by simply plugging a vaccum line, cant do that nowadays. E85 just doesnt seem like its worth it but w/e people told me that about upgrading a greddy turbo kit and I didnt listen so you gotta do what you want to do
RWD = Fun to Drive
FWD = Better traction cause the weight is on the drive tires
I consider a modern motor to be anything that has some method of fuel injection on it. Not to mention a lot of cars from back in the 60's and 70's could have pretty mean problems fixed by simply plugging a vaccum line, cant do that nowadays. E85 just doesnt seem like its worth it but w/e people told me that about upgrading a greddy turbo kit and I didnt listen so you gotta do what you want to do
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02-23-2009, 08:02 PM
#18
Actually I wasnt really pissed until now...
I dont really want to argue with some kid over the internet about this as it seems pretty pointless so why dont you just try it out and see how it works for you. If you **** your **** up you know we were right and if it works well then you got a cheap alternative to race fuel.
I dont really want to argue with some kid over the internet about this as it seems pretty pointless so why dont you just try it out and see how it works for you. If you **** your **** up you know we were right and if it works well then you got a cheap alternative to race fuel.
Edit:
E85 is cheaper because you're subsidizing it out of your taxes. If you were a bleeding heart about it you'd know that more energy goes into the production of ethanol from corn than you get out of it. But hey, what else are you gonna do with all that corn? Can't fit any more in your ***.
As for gas prices going up, that was a supply issue which was caused by *politics*, it's not like everyone suddenly started driving two cars at once.
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02-23-2009, 08:29 PM
#19
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Wha? perhaps in some FWD buckets of crap there is more weight on the front wheels, but any car made to have relativly decent handling will have near 50/50 weight distribution, and when you accelerate there is a large weight shift to the rear wheels.
Also, WTF man, your claiming to work on 8000 HP Drag cars, and you think a FWD car will have better traction? Also, typical octane boosters don't really do much, and the "points" they typically advertise are 0.1 octaine rating, meaning that 11 point stuff will make 94 into 95.1. They are also typically rated to increse the octaine rating from Zero to whatever points... zero being the more likely end of the scale.
Sweet Jebus, someone make me a "Canadian Face Palm" poster.....
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02-23-2009, 11:49 PM
#20
Yes the E85 is cheaper...you made my point valid?
BTW, the E85 has already been proven...but that wasn't my original question...it was, "who is running it?"
Also the demand of gas increased over a great period of time. Then the investors started to hedge against it, driving prices up...
It's not like Obama went out to all those countries and said, "I love you" and BAM, the gas prices dropped...the economy took a crap all over the place. People started to drive less. Prices started to drop. Interesting that how oil is around $40/barrel and gas is still around $2/gallon. Because the price you see in the stock market is based off of what is called the "texan standard." It's a really weird process in which they rate and sell oil.
But we can argue all you want about what caused the prices of oil to increase and there will never be a correct answer. China and India would be thrown into the mix for the amount of driving they do now.
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