How many members are in the Armed Forces??
 

I know Kotomile and I think MarkP are in one of the branchs.

The reason I ask is that I am filling out all my paper work so I can go into the OCS program for the army. My current date to go in front of the board is Jan 7th.

For all those that are in what is your branch and MOS? Also are you in for life or just for your set time.

Just wonder what you each do and if you enjoy it?

Service - Army
Branch - MI
MOS - currently 35F (old 96B) reclassing to 35P(A) (old 98G)

How long I stay in depends. I'd like to do at least 20 but the nature of the job is such that you can't guarantee that you'll be able to stay the whole time.

Good luck to you, OCS is tough but worth it (not that I know from personal experience, but I know many who do). Why the officer way though? IIRC you don't get to pick your branch, but enlisted you do. You might check out the warrant officer program also, that's another prestigious path and I've never met a warrant who said it was a bad decision.

Well the the man reasons for OCS is pay, and the advantage of student repayment. I was going to in as 25B or 35T but neither offers LRP anymore. The whole lack of picking my branch does kinda suck, but I am hoping that with current degree and if I bust my A$$ during OCS that I should be able to get either of my choices of MI or whatever the main branch for 25B is.

25 = Signal

Thank you. I have the whole sheet of paper at my house, just not in front of me. I need to pick my ten locations and ten branches in the next week.

Can I just say that I think the military is really complicated. Every time I read one of these threads on various forums I cant help but think how confusing the entire system is. I am referring to the names given to everything and the number designations for programs and such.

I cant find any better way to describe my confusion. Maybe its just me.

There are people in the military who don't know even a fraction of the MOSs, myself included. When it comes to MOS identifiers, obscure acronyms, and such, you're not expected to know. All of that crap is on Wikipedia anyway. Some of it is stuff you might only know if you're in the infantry, like designators for types of rounds (there are 7 types that can be fired from an M16/M4/AR15 type weapon and they all have their own code) or things you might only study for a board.

"If the VP is such a VIP, shouldn't we keep the PC on the QT? Otherwise the VC might find out, he could wind up an MIA and we'll all be on KP!"

Half the audience was rolling on the floor, the other half scratching their heads.

- L
(Retired USAF SNCO...)

^ I heard that in the movie "Good Morning Vietnam".

at times i wish i could do something in the miltary. but i am too fat, too slow, have asthma, high blood pressure, and a sissy at times. looks like im out, LOL

US Navy ACTIVE DUTY Lieutenant (O-3)
9yrs
Commission via OCS Pensacola, FL.
Designator (Navy version of MOS): 1320 or NFO (Naval Flight Officer)
Community: Aviation
Platform: E-2C Hawkeye

Now living in San Diego, waiting to check onboard USS Nimitz for sea-duty.

There are 6 Naval Unrestricted Line Officer Designators (warfare designators):
Pilot
NFO
Surface Warfare
Submarine Warfare
SEAL
EOD

There are about 40 Restricted Line Office Designators:
Doctor, Nurse, PAO, Dentist, Intel, Supply, SeaBee, AEDO, AMDO, Physiologist, Merchant Marine, Info Pro, Chaps, JAG, LDO and WARRANT Officers in all major warfare fields, HR, Oceanography, Recruiter... probably a few more I can't remember.

This is my baby:
http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/...op_View_lg.jpg

I've been in the Air Force for almost 3 years, and all that stuff sounds somewhat foreign to me even. Every branch of the military has their own way of naming things. Anyways,

AFSC- 2A656- Electrical and Environmental Systems Specialist

Work on B-52's in Barksdale AFB

Air Force Captain (O-3)
Been in 8.5 years and having a great time.
I am an Engineer by trade = 62E3G (62E=Engineer, 3=experience level, G=project engineer)
Jobs so far:
3 years F-16 System Program Office at Wright Patterson AFB, OH. Worked as lead engineer / program manager for $320B (yes billion) operational flight program for 5 NATO countries. Was responsible for upgrades and maintenance of 300+ F-16s. Got 4 paid trips to Europe while I was there. First TDY (Temporary Duty) in the AF was to Belgium. I love this job!

After that I went to the Air Force Institute of Technology where I spent 18 months full-time getting my Masters in Systems Engineering. Best paid students in the world!! It was a great program and I would jump at a chance to go back for three more years to get a PhD.

My follow-on assignment (current) is at the Global Positioning Systems Wing in Los Angeles. The weather is nice for convertibles, but the people and the housing suck. Been here for 3.75 years, only have three more months on my sentence to LA. LA sucks. Have I said that before? :) Anyway, I was the Chief Architect of the GPS III system and my team constructed the underlying architecture of the next generation GPS satellites and control segments. You all will get the benefit of my work in about 10 years :) Job wise, this is a good job. Office work, but that is all I have ever known.

Moving to Nebraska in the Spring. Yes, the Miata will spend more time in the garage than it does here, but it is closer to family. Seriously, if any of you have any questions, let me know.

--- No, I don't get any discounts on GPS receivers. I have to pay full price too. ---

... and that, ladies and gentlemen, is why I didn't join the Air Force.

Haha, kinda reminds me of all the sailors I met in Qatar who never thought they'd be guarding detainees in Basra.

Touche, Koto. I made fun of all my buddies in high-school who got ROTC scholarships and Naval Academy appointments... I thought they had been brainwashed by TopGun and were just scared to try and get a real job. Then I found myself with an uninteresting degree and nothing to show for my first 2 post-college years except for a wicked tan... suddenly free medical forever and retired at 45 sounded like the fucking deal of the century. I haven't looked back. My plan is to retire at 23 years as a Commander... making sure my last duty station is Pensacola or Panama City. I'll have 150ft of waterfront for myself and buy a small apartment complex and market heavily to SEALs and Helo Pilots. I'm sure you've got the same idea... 30yrs SgtMajor and couple acres outside of Bragg doesn't sound so bad!

Here's what I get to do for the next 2 years:
http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/8922/z5custompr6.jpg

Yea I agree it taken me a few to days of reading over a different jobs and noticing how close some where and what differences they had in there code to start to figure out the difference.

I get to go take my physical and all my test Monday.

Samnavy.. I agree with you, when my friends joined right after HS I laughed at them and now with the gaming market hurting so bad, I can't find a job in my field. So that LRP and free housing and medical suddenly looks really good even if only for 3-4 years.

Army, 96J - 96B, 4-year walk.

Currently I am working for DHS detached to USCG HQ in DC. Everything is COMPLETELY different from Army...

I do however love the military life and will be getting back into shape for re-enlistment shortly.

Nebraska is awesome. Yes, there are some cold winters, but so does most of the world. It is a great job and is the closest to our families that we will probably ever be. Oh yeah, and did I mention that I can actually afford a house there? By the way, LA sucks :D

After reading this thread, I sent off for a packet to join the Army Health Care Corps. I need a change.

As a lifetime resident, I think that is the first time I have ever seen such words typed or uttered.:)

Marking my time until I retire and move south-ish. Thinking Eastern TN or KY.

Ah, but you underestimate my disdain for LA and CA in general. Too many crazy people here. Some good folks (most have miatas), but the rest are just wierd. I value things like grass in my yard, and it taking 10 minutes to get somewhere that is 10 miles away. You know, the simple things.

Shack! (For you non-Military types, "Direct Hit!")


SamNavy / Koto -

None of the services would let me go SOF due to my eyesight, leaving the technology advantage to the AF and the USN. The AF Recruiter found a training slot for me first. Never regretted the decision. In fact, the only reason I punched at 20 vice 30 was for the family.

- L

PS - Offutt *sucks*; any place the tank on the back of a toilet can freeze solid and crack in a heated house is NOT on my list of inhabitable locations.

Kinda. Mine involves WoC school and about 30 years in though, and I'd retire in Jacksonville. I already have one rental property too so it looks like we think alike.

Congrats on the shooter position, looks like a blast!

Did you just make a funny? I get it... "blast"... this guy kills me, and he'll be here all nite ladies!

Wasn't trying for a funny actually, I just wanted to use a word other than "cool".

Sam, you're working as a shooter specifically for the next two years, or flight deck operations in general?

Image of Dr. Hiedi Kraft - Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting

Sam, talks about being a line officer vs a non-line officer... Even the Navy Psychologists carry guns. :) See above.

Anyway, I'm Navy, MSC (non line), and will be a Navy psychologist someday in the near future. I'm an O-1 (Ensign) with 10 years and previously was enlisted in the USAF. I should be O-2 (Lieutenant J.G.) sometime in the next 6 months.

Mark

Mark, Did I just read that right. You're an O-1 after 10 years of service? Or you have 10 years ahead of you?

I still consider the Navy or the Air Force sometimes even though I just graduated with my B.S.

Mark was in the AF some time ago... I think he had a break. In any case, if his AF time transfers and is counted, he will actually be an O-1E. "E" stands for PRIOR ENLISTED. It's worth a little extra pay and housing allowance. Plus it tends to carry a little extra weight with the troops to know you were one of them once.

Joe, I'll be shooter on the Nimitz.

IIRC you can have the "E" designator on your grade all the way through O3, but once you reach O4 it goes away.

"Mark, Did I just read that right. You're an O-1 after 10 years of service? "

Mark is just a slow learner, that's all.... :)

Seriously, I was honored that Mark asked me to administer his oath when joining the USN.

I graduated from Army Airborne School as an officer cadet back in August of 1981 (gig pits, PT in boots, and men exercised bare-chested). I'm still in the Army (currently mobilized...again) and intend to stay in until I'm forced out. Signal Corps 25A - one-size fits all Signal Officer. I wouldn't trade my experiences for all the tea in China....

Barry

"What does 3 up and 3 down mean to you?!?!"

"End of an inning?"

That movie was hilarious...Robin Williams is one of my fav actors. I'm trying to think of one movie I didn't like. I can't come up with one.

SIGO in the HOUSE!!! All of my SIGOs were fucking awesome. By far the coolest officers I had run into while I was in, and I found most officers were pretty cool.

I don't think so. I wager he's a masochist. He's getting "re-started" at the age many of us retire from the Military...

- L

(BTW Barry, it's about time you showed up!)

I always had that much more respect for the officers who I knew had been enlisted before. Same with Warrants, because they're almost certain to have had enlisted service. With RLOs you can't tell by looking at them if they have or not, unless maybe if they're in their class As.

I think all officers should be required to do 2yrs as an enlisted soldier. That way they get an idea of how things work from the bottom first, then when they start being at the top they can understand what they are asking their enlisted soldiers to do.

Let them come in as an E-4. Imagine the respect the LTs would get if they were able to make E5 in their 2 yrs, on top of what they would get for having done the crap jobs as a junior enlisted.

Ray, I don't know what your military background is, but your sentiment is very similar to what I hear from a lot of my junior enlisted. I'm going to give you the same insight I try to give them.

A lot of my new young troops (and I get a lot straight from Great Lakes direct to my shop) feel entitled to stand on equal footing as officers the day they show up. "Why does he get to go to lunch for 2 hours and I have to stay and grease this fitting?" I'll tell you why having an officer corps comprised of a significant number of prior enlisted would badly hurt the military.

If you'd ask a WWII or Vietnam enlisted man where they thought they stood the day they showed up to their command, the feeling would be vastly different than todays soldier/sailor. The effectiveness of the chain of command of the past lied in the belief that officers are better than enlisted. It's not me talking here, but centuries of the military rank structure that dictates an enlisted life is not equal to an officers life. A conscript or draft military exaggerates this belief to that of inscrutible fact. This goes back historically to times when a man's "commission" was exactly that... his father was wealthy enough that his "officership" could be bought by sending him to a military academy for training. If you had the money, you could be an officer. Enlisted men did not come from that same social caste, and whether on the street or in uniform, simply held a lower status in society. That gap has gotten smaller and smaller as political correctness and other social evolutions like it have progressed from the civilian sector to the military. Mandatory equality however, has no place in the military.

The relationship between boss and secretary is different than LT/Grunt... especially in a combat team. I'm an aviator, and the crew of my plane is all officers... but I promise you, there comes a time for all warriors when YOU ABSOLUTELY DON'T WANT TO KNOW WHAT IT'S LIKE TO BE THE OTHER GUY, and YOU DON'T WANT HIM KNOWING WHAT IT'S LIKE TO BE YOU! Whether that time is in combat or later back at HQ filling out the paperwork.

The middle-ground between officers and soldiers/sailors are non-commisioned officers. Chief's and Sergeants are the leadership that has a foot on both sides of the fence. Good NCO leadership, and a good relationship between the officer and the NCO, means the Officer never needs to know the toils and trials of "what it's like" to be Enlisted. If the officer did know just how shitty the troops had it, he might not feel like ordering them into battle, or ordering them to clean the latrine. The entire CHAIN OF COMMAND collapses right there. It doesn't even have to got that far... the instant an officer starts to feel sorry for the troops over the fact that it's less fair for them to grease shit while he gets lunch... things get ugly. NOW, an officer who doesn't take care of his troops is a piece of shit who needs to get his ass kicked by his Chief, but Senior Officers should recognize the lack of potential in a Junior Officer and unfuck that guy... or the Chief should go to the CO and unfuck the CO.

Anyways, here's why you don't want what you're asking... here's the thing most troops who wish Officers knew what it was like to be them never think of:
I know a lot of "PRIOR E's", and I can tell you that there are only 1 type. The type that knows every fucking trick in the book and doesn't take any shit from anybody... especially a troop trying to pull some shit. If I ever had a situation I couldn't handle, or a sailor who was saying some shit I'd never heard about before, I'd just go ask one of my "Prior-E" Lieutenant friends who would say "Let me handle that guy"... and few hours later, that sailor would come into my office and apologize for being a douche... and there would be no more problem... that is if I didn't necessarily want the Chief involved. Mandating Prior-Enlisted time to become an officer is the last thing any Enlisted wants to happen... you couldn't get away with shit ever again... EVER!

You mention respect, and I tell you that it has nothing to do with where you come from. I know plenty of Prior-E's who are raging douche's. They were shit as enlisted and they're shit as officers. They made rank by stepping on anybody not as ruthless as them... and the troops hate them because a reputation like that you cannot escape. On the other hand, some of the best officers I know come from wealth... and I mean filthy fucking rich and pay $300 for an oil-change in their BMW, and the troops know it and they still love them and would charge into a raging fire to pull him out of it and try not to mess up the guy's $100 haircut. There are an equal amount of good and bad examples from all walks.

Anyways, I hope I made some sense. You know I do my own oil changes and all... so I hope I don't sound like some asshole officer who "doesn't get it".

Ray -

I *somewhat* agree with SamNavy. You don't want ALL officers to be prior enlisted. A mixed bag tends to find equilibrium pretty well. However, I do agree with the USMC approach; all officer candidates should complete enlisted boot camp prior to attending officer candidate school. - This gives the fresh LTs (Ensigns) a taste of the grunt's world and in turn each grunt on the line knows, if nothing more, the junior officer telling him to "charge that hill" has walked a mile in his shoes.

In each branch of the Service there are definitely those wired to be bottom-of-the-barrell, tech-savvy and leaders. Not every Non-Comm is a leader, nor is every commissioned degree-bearer. (This is why the Army used to have a Tech-tier and a NCO-tier; increases in pay-grade, but not necessarily responsibility.)

Thankfully, the NCOs (and especially SNCOs) tend to police themselves; grooming those with potential, mentoring those that "don't get it" and minimizing the impact of those that "don't belong". And the Officers tend to do the same within their ranks. Sometimes, you'll find cross-pollenation where an O will grow an E or vice versa.

All in all, a well disciplined, highly motivated group of volunteers doing complex jobs in adverse conditions for moderate pay and variable appreciation from the masses they support.

OK, time to get off the soap-box...

- L

LOL, Well said Sam.

I agree, you do not want all your officers to be prior enlisted. Regarding respect though, I do seem to get a bit more credibility when dealing with enlisted guys in my profession... I am also expected to be a bit more together than the average O-1. The problem with all new O-1's being prior enlisted is that you also lose some of the flexibility that junior troops have in getting over on young officers. Nothing worse than finding out your new O-1 is prior enlisted, because A: He's gonna know every trick in the book and B: You're gonna be expected to do more by him.

A small percentage of prior enlisted officers is a good thing, like senior NCO's they provide a bridge between the communities. They provide hope for the average enlisted person who really would often rather be an officer (at least until becoming an NCO.) The military is by design a caste system, but the opportunity for the masses to advance forward is important, even if only a few are afforded the opportunity.

Now with regards to Barry's comment (and Larry too): I am a masochist and a slow learner, so slow in fact that they needed to put me through 4 years of school and a 1 year internship before setting me free on the troops. Speaking of which ... 2 years will be coming up this July and I will be advancing to JG.

Mark

PS - Hope you all are having a great holiday and Barry glad to see you back in service.

Actually, I have at least 9 years ahead of me (more if they allow it), and yes, I am possibly one of the oldest O-1's in the Navy. Although I am sure someone beats me out... I wonder... Is there a BEOTN (Bull Ensign of the Navy?) Sounds like a possible position to be filled... with a jumbo ensign's insignia.

I love being in the military, much more as an officer, the opportunities I have had were tremendous. My career is atypical, and the military certainly is not for everyone!

Mark

Good observations about the troops not wanting all officers to be prior-E, I hadn't thought of that. I'm kind of a goodie-goodie though (managed to rack up a few oak leaf clusters on my AAM in my short time and I'm also Battalion soldier-of-the-month currently) so I hadn't considered that.