I think MS hates me
I have been installing a FMIC and a MS on my car over the past week or so. I got the FMIC mounted up and all, tightened everything up and then I fired it up to make sure I did everything right. It fired up and ran great...other than at idle because the idle control valve was sucking in unmetered air. I cut it off and then proceded to install the MS system. It is using the stock ECU to control the idle and AC stuff. I got it all together and tried to fire it up...no luck. It came with a program already installed so at this point I had not changed it yet. I then went into megatune and tried to use the base tune for it. I unlpugged the ignitor and burned it on the MS, plugged it back up and still no fire. I just now disconnected the MS and went straight to the stock ECU and it will not crank. What do I need to do to start troubleshooting?
EDIT: Important info! 1992 1.6L - Greddy Turbo - |
will not crank? Or cranks but wont fire? Fuses are always a good first place to check. If it cranks and won't fire check for spark and fuel
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Sorry about that...it cranks but won't fire.
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Check fuses, then check for fuel and spark and repost
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Check to see if you're getting a tach reading while cranking, should be close to 300 rpm. I suggest loading the original base map from mspnp.com for your year mspnp. Who knows what firmware and/or msq is on it as of now.
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This may sound stupid but check that all of the harnesses are plugged all the way in.
So: DB-37 to MS Both of the plugs into the ECU Both plugs from under the dash to the jumper harness Make sure all of the bastards are plugged in all the way. So it didn't fire with the MS, now it doesn't fire with the stock ECU? |
Originally Posted by cjernigan
(Post 274151)
Check to see if you're getting a tach reading while cranking, should be close to 300 rpm. I suggest loading the original base map from mspnp.com for your year mspnp. Who knows what firmware and/or msq is on it as of now.
No tach reading with only the stock ECU plugged in. I am also not getting any spark. Is there a fuse between the coils other than the big 80 amp one? |
If you aren't getting any RPM, the MS won't fire the coils or the injectors.
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Originally Posted by jwx
(Post 274760)
If you aren't getting any RPM, the MS won't fire the coils or the injectors.
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Are you not getting a tach reading on the dash tach or on MegaTune's tach?
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Originally Posted by Drewkeen
(Post 274875)
I am getting RPM...the engine is obviously spinning just as fast as it did before...I am just not getting a tach reading. Not trying to nit pick or anything...I just want to make sure that I was clear earlier. If I am not getting a tach signal where do I need to start looking?
How is your ms setup? diyautotune's input mods? posting your msq would help too. |
Originally Posted by Matt Cramer
(Post 274876)
Are you not getting a tach reading on the dash tach or on MegaTune's tach?
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I would guess your igniter is toast.
Check to see if one of the solder points broke. Open the MS and look at the wires and resisitors specific to the ingition mods. If you'd like I can email you a UPS label to ship it to me and I'll look it over. The MS is a pre-built unit from Protocar that I mod'ed using the faq on this site. I verified everything was working, literally, minutes before dropping it into the box and shipping it out. So either something came loose in shipping or the flashing process went awry. It may very well be the second, in a PM you mentioned the AFM having issues (fuel pump might not prime) and the car turned over briefly when you squirted some ether into the intake. After that you flashed it and then nothing with the stock ECU and the MS both. |
When you mention unplugging the igniter are you referring to a plug near the back of the head or one on the passenger side shock tower?
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Originally Posted by PAT!
(Post 274927)
I would guess your igniter is toast.
Check to see if one of the solder points broke. Open the MS and look at the wires and resisitors specific to the ingition mods. If you'd like I can email you a UPS label to ship it to me and I'll look it over. The MS is a pre-built unit from Protocar that I mod'ed using the faq on this site. I verified everything was working, literally, minutes before dropping it into the box and shipping it out. So either something came loose in shipping or the flashing process went awry. It may very well be the second, in a PM you mentioned the AFM having issues (fuel pump might not prime) and the car turned over briefly when you squirted some ether into the intake. After that you flashed it and then nothing with the stock ECU and the MS both. I was unplugging the plug by the firewall. Is that not the correct one? The strange thing is that just between unplugging the stock ECU and plugging in the MS stuff it didn't work. I never hooked up a laptop to flash a new program or anything of that sort. Thanks for all of the help with this, I have never had this kind of confusion when installing a tuning device. |
Originally Posted by Drewkeen
(Post 275084)
I was unplugging the plug by the firewall. Is that not the correct one?
http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/1281/unpluggb3.gif |
Looks like it is time for a new ignitor then. Can I replace it without replacing the coils or do I have to fix it all?
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Yes, you can replace it and leave your existing coils - those are usually fine. (This is for the '90-'93 1.6; 1.8 cars have the coils and ignitors combined into one unit.)
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you could go direct drive from the MS, there are instruction in the MS-extra manual on how to go about it.
otherwise that ignitor is around a 100 bucks from rockauto.com |
I wouldn't recommend modifying the wiring to have the MS drive the tach unless you are also adding something like a coil on plug setup. If the ignitor has been damaged enough that it won't drive the tach, it will usually stop driving the coils too within a few weeks.
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Matt, I think Jamie was talking about direct-drive of the coils themselves via the MS, using VB912s, rather than merely driving the tach via the MS (which he'd also need to do in that case).
It does strike me as a viable but complex solution as compared to just replacing the stock igniter. |
Yeah, I will stick with the easy route and replace the igniter. I'm glad it only kills the igniter and not the coils, too.
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New ignitor in...it works off the stock ECU now, but not when I have the MS hooked up. I am also not getting a RPM reading on the computer when I am trying to start the car with the MS hooked up.
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Ok, looks like it's time to work on the RPM signal. How is your wheel decoder set up?
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I have no idea...
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If you post your current MSQ, I can see the answer in that file.
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I am using the one that is supplied with the megatune for MSPnP on 90-93 cars with the AFM.
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Ok, then, check the wiring from the MS to the CAS or stock harness and make sure you're bringing things in on the right pins. You may even want to take the CAS off the car, rotate it by hand, and check the inputs at the MS with a voltmeter to make sure you're getting the signal.
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