MS3 Basic Tomfoolery
 

Enclosed is a log of MS3 basic shennanigans. I'm completely at a loss as to what is going on - the CLT is where I went "Mind. Blown. I need help."

I don't know what kind of (if any) proprietary features your MS3 has, but I would first ensure that there's not something goofy in the coolant temp sensor calibration. Recalibrate it (under the "tools" menu). Go from there.

Already done, which is what has me going wtf?

Does the temp sensor have a polarity or something?

It looks like a broken sensor or a bad sensor ground.

Does that include the rpm stuff when I try to start it, Rev?

The sensor is brand new FWIW.

This is for a '94 engine to a '05 VVT swap - I'm not certain I did some parts of the wiring correctly, although I did follow Sav's instructions on the topic of the swap. The log is of several attempts to start the vehicle.

One thing that confuses the hell out of me is while I'm cranking, I can see the tuner studio rpm start at 400ish, then bounce to 100ish rpms up and down, then go to 0, then go back up to 400rpm and rinse repeat cycle while I'm cranking.

it appears youre not even really syncing. Your RPMs are always showing a pattern, not true rpms, looks to me like more than a few things are out of whack.

I agree with you there, Braineack.

Problem is, however, I'm unsure of where to start - I've followed Sav's instructions on the swap pretty closely, and I've hooked up the bare minimum just to get the car started at this point.

Does anyone have any advice on where to start? I'm at a loss at this point.

Did the car work correctly before the swap?

Yes.

Disconnect everything except your timing input. Check with logger and see of that's OK.
Timing and MAP are the most important inputs to get the engine running. Everything else can wait.

Enclosed are logs with only the crank MAP and the water temp sensor connected, the cam MAP and water temp sensor connected, and cam/crank/temp/MAP connected.

Also enclosed is the msq. Any advice?

What could be causing the crank/cam signal to give a false rpm signal? I'm trying to think of what it could be, but I'm at a loss - researching over the past week has given me nil for potential causes.

Even if I fucked up the wiring on the sensors, it shouldn't be doing this.

As I think about it, could it be a bad sensor? The crank and cam sensors are brand new, but..

Or perhaps it's a setting in the msq? I'm at a loss for what else it can be now.

How about a composite log?

Composite log is enclosed

Why do you say it's a false RPM signal? It looks like an actual rpm during cranking in the log.
Looks like you are getting good signals from crank and cam.
The weirdest thing I see is your MAP signal right now. Are you using the onboard MAP or an external one?
Without the TPS connected, your coolant temperature seems to indicate correctly. Looking at the NoTPS log, the engine should run, assuming that the MAP is somewhat accurate. Does it fire up?

Brainy mentioned it wasn't true rpm.

Onboard MAP is being used. It worked perfectly prior to the new engine going in - I can try a different place for the signal source I guess?

The engine does not fire up.

his RPM signal is in a pattern. look at each time he tires to crank it- exactly the same rpm pattern.

Got any suggestions Brainy?

I'm kind of at a loss, short of something going wrong with the fuel pump install. I am going to check the fuel pump and fuel pressure later today, but I'm at a loss for how to diagnose this.

There's fuel pressure, and the fuel pump works.

However, I am getting no spark. I do not know if the injectors are even firing.

I tested the cam and crank sensors for proper wiring, they appear to be correctly wired and a multimeter checks out the expected values.

Is it something in my .msq that is screwing things up?

At this point, I would put the MS on the stim and try if it works wiht that.

It was a built MS3 Basic from Rev, Stefanst. I have no ability to do that.

It also worked perfect with a '94 engine prior to this TSE-built block with VVT head install, but electrically everything appears to check out.

I can send you my stim. PM me if you want it.

This composite log shows poor crank signal. You need to check your crank sensor / trigger wheel gap, trigger wheel orientation, wiring between ECU and sensor, etc.

ACTUALLY, I retract the previous statement. The crank signal LOOKS LIKE A CAM SIGNAL when zoomed in. You wired crank and cam backwards.

Oh christ.

Thanks Ben, so it was with my wiring after all. :facepalm:

Thank you again, I'll try it this Friday!

Okay, I have great news!

I am getting a true rpm signal now, and everything else checks out.

I have bad news, but I'm down to one last thing starting the car. The rpm signal seems to "conk" out in time to a noise coming from the steering column/dash, so it gets true signal, goes to 0, true signal, goes to 0, etc. as you can see in the provided logs.

Major thanks go to Ben for pointing out the reversal of the cam and crank - but what is the source of this last problem?

Enclosed are logs, both standard and composite, of this.

Something looks odd with your crank signal. It should drop back to 0 right away (I think). Not stay up at 1 as yours seems to do on occasion.
Try and adjust the pot?

The MS3 Basic was built by Rev, and worked perfectly prior to this engine swap.

Is messing with it really the best solution in this case? I mean, if it's a problem with the crank signal, shouldn't I be trying to adjust the crank sensor first?

Any chance the crank trigger wheel is not correctly installed? The crank and cam signals are phased too much apart. You also need to switch from falling edge to rising edge when switching from 4G63 to Miata 99-05 mode.

Right now, it's a stock crank trigger wheel on a stock crank pulley that should be untouched, Rev.

Is there anything that can be incorrectly installed in that case? Could it be my crank sensor installation?

Thank you.

Then have a look at the setting I said above. Change the ignition input capture to rising edge.

Comrades! Great News!

Everything is reading fine. I'm not getting it to fire up, but RPM is clearly reading correctly now!

Anything that I have left out with a stock VVT setup swap to a '91 NA in my msq, or is it a problem with my wiring? Enclosed are logs of the attempts to start.

Thank you!

Have you rewired your injectors for full sequential injection? If not, revert back to semi-sequential.

The injectors are wired for full sequential, and are unchanged from the previous engine where they ran perfectly. Does anything need to be changed in this case?

The ignition has been changed from full sequential to wasted spark and went from toyota COPs to the stock VVT COPs. Do I need to change anything further in this case?

Thanks Rev.

Are the coils wired correctly? Test with output test mode.

Will do right now.

Thank you.

I'm seeing no spark.

Injectors work fine, fuel pump is great, spark is no bueno in test mode.

Now THAT is weird.

Only two injectors, A and B, will fire. Is this something in my settings Rev?

Double checked coils. They are wired properly according to https://www.miataturbo.net/useful-sa...writeup-12704/ and Mostly MIATA: 1999 to 2001 VVT Engine Swap Ignition - the only place I deviated from the instructions given was an additional ground, but I fail to see how that would change things.

Got everything working after some diagnosis and the people in this thread last Sunday.

It ran awesomely. That is all. /thread

Due to work being insane (oh boy...), I've not been able to follow up on this.

I got 50 miles of AWESOME driving in last weekend. It was blissful and operating well beyond my expectations. Then the Miata suddenly started firing on two cylinders. Megasquirt was giving me a vvt1 error.

Nothing wrong in the engine as far as I can tell. Enclosed are composite logs.

All I could find on the engine bay was an oil leak on some wiring from during those miles (eek!), and I didn't have time to clean it last weekend. Could this be the cause?

Thanks!

Correct me if I am wrong, but perhaps the car can run (albeit on batch injection/ignition) without a cam sensor?

VVT1 error is an error that I get when I run my ECU on a stim with the standard (01-05)trigger wheel settings but without changing the cam-in settings on the stim.

I'd look at your cam sensor and the associated wiring. Is this a new sensor or the old one? If it is an old cam sensor, I'd pick a new one up because even if this one isn't bad yet, it will eventually fail and keeping a spare in the trunk is cheap insurance.