Replace gauges with Double-Din Android with Shadow Dash?
 

I am a good year plus out on this but I wanted to start the discussion.

I really like my Alpine X305S but it has a couple downfalls. First and foremost, it really doesn't work with spotify that well. I can play spotify on my iPod through it but as soon as I hit the next or previous track button it goes straight to the built in music app. Also, the brightness on the screen is too dim for daylight hours with the top down. Sadly I don't think i'll be happy with anything out there aside from a "kindle paper" kind of display and I don't see any devices that use such a screen.

I like some of the features of the double-din head units, but I would give up my gauges unless I moved them to the pillar, and I like the stealthy look. To me the pillar pods are too "look at me."

So I was considering starting to shop android double-din devices with the intention of running shadow dash on them.

Has anyone done this in the megasquirt community? Anyone have any experience running double-din with big displays in a convertible?

Plusses for me would be: Android based. Must be able to use shadow dash. Nav would be a plus. Needs to work with iphone (music) and androids OR run spotify internally. That would be a big plus. Internal storage (20 gigs or so) would be a plus. Needs to have a fast interaction with the screen. My TomTom has such a delay it is hard to use. BUTTONS for forward and back tracks as well as knob for volume would be a plus. I like touch, but not for features like volume and track selection while driving.

Thoughts? Ideas?

possible to put a nexus 7 or something like this in our cars?

Nexus 7 makes the best in-car entertainment system ever | Android Central

Problem will be the visibility in sunlight. I have a Galaxy tab2 in my car and can see next to nothing, when the sun is really shining...

Yesterday I tried the USB connection with a OTG USB cable on the Tab2 - works like a charme..

There's a guy on the MSM forums that has a kindle in his dash. Looks clean. I think he's currently changing over to a nexus 7.

Audio upgrade round 3(4,5,6? lost track)

If you find an actual Android headunit which meets those criteria, please post up the info! All of the Android "based" headunits which I have found on the net have serious flaws... most actually running dual OS's, one for the radio/audio type features and then separate HW for Android which can display on the same screen. If that isn't a show stopper, most aren't capacitive touch, react slowly, run Android 2.x, have buggy operation, etc

Is the Parrot "Asteroid" head unit not really Android or does it fall into the category that you mention noname?
Parrot ASTEROID Smart Digital media receiver with GPS navigation at Crutchfield.com

Good find. The Parrot Smart actually makes a go at using only Android and comes from a more known/respected company than the other "Android" headunits showing up on the market.

However, the Smart is the equivalent of sticking your 2-3 generation old Android phone in the dash with a larger screen and an audio amplifier. Personally, I think I would try my hand custom mounting a tablet (ex: Nexus 7).

It may work for you, but the lack of RAM and OS/app storage would be problems for me. My email for example would eat up a good portion of the 1GB storage. I suffered through that before upgrading my Sprint Evo 4G to a Samsung Galaxy S3 a year ago.

Parrot Asteroid Smart Review: Android In Your Car's Dash? - Android In Your Dash Via Parrot's Asteroid Smart

Pros:
Easy to side load apps
You can root the device
Doesn't treat Android as gimick (see dual OS units)
Capacitive touch display! (biggest problem in my book with the other "Android" head units on the market)
Price point is reasonable

Cons:
Android 2.3 (it will work for now, but will apps stop supporting this old version in the future?)
2005 era CPU (same as Droid 2 or Droid X)
512MB RAM
1GB storage for the OS and apps
Not that good at traditional car audio (doesn't resume playback, no native XM/Sirrus, works just okay with USB/SD card based music storage)
May have issue with OBDII Bluetooth adapters

Overall, it looks like a fairly well implemented unit, but compromised by the old HW and to a lesser extent older Android version. Using a better CPU/SoC would add some costs, but would be worth it for a buyer who expects "modern" Android running in the car's dash.

I agree. I don't think I would do the Asteroid Smart for now. Maybe in a year or two when they come out with 2.0 model.

As long as the US gov't doesn't outlaw cars with buttons (real or touchscreen) due to concerns about "distracted driving" :-( That seems to be the latest push on the "save people from themselves" front from our friendly officials in Washington.

Almost every car today has a touch screen. Hell, Teslas have a touch screen. I doubt the lobbyists from the auto makers will allow that to happen. They make too much $$ in upgrading to the touch screen.

Resurrecting this thread: does anyone know a current android pop-up (retractable touch screen so it fits into the 1-Din slot) headunit that works with Shadow Dash MS?

from what I have read on MSextra etc most of the headunits are actually running Windows CE with a ported version of Android and will not fully support the Megasquirt Bluetooth module

Assisting with resurrection: As it pertains to original question, as I am unaware to the current headunit game.

Im running a MS2 with a bluetooth transmitter wired in series to the DB9 output. The display is a generic 9" tablet running an older android release and ShadowDash (MSDroid Pictured). The only downfall to the setup is that fuel gauge and blinker indicators have to be wired seperately.

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...71c518ef27.jpg

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...ae62b06ade.jpg

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...5fd595af8d.jpg

For anyone who's done this, where can I start on researching my options? I'd love to have a tablet take the place of a few gauges.

first decide how big of a screen you want, and where do you want to put it. I chose the nexus7, despite it being three years old it is still very fast, has a 1080 screen, and it's a bout the only 7" tablet that has enough brightness to be seen clearly in full sunlight. The developer community is huge so it's easy to find info you need in order to make it do your bidding.

mine runs a stripped down version of CM11, boots into AutoMate (dashboard app) and Shadow dash as soon as it sees power. A few seconds after I turn the car off, it shuts itself down. It's perfect. The fact that I can do GPS and stream music from my phone is a happy side effect.

Ohh buddy, the auto boot and shutdown is where I fell down. Care to elaborate how you went about getting that to work? Everything I found showed custom code was needed in the bootloader and I sit don't have skills to do that.

Specifically how did you get the tablet to boot up when power was applied.

Power up on boot was easy, but takes some CLI work.

1. Install Android "ABD" drivers on your PC, MAC, or Linux machine of choice.
2. On a Nexus device, boot it into bootloader, plug it into your PC and unlock bootloader, the command is "fastboot OEM unlock" then to set wake on power the command is "fastboot oem off-mode-charge 0"

For the shutdown part, get tasker from app store. Give it root privelges. There are many ways to skin a cat, but here is how I do it.
1. I have a profile that sets variable %LAUNCH=1 on boot, if it has not been set.
2. When power is plugged in, it adds 1 to the %LAUNCH variable. When power is unplugged it subtracts 1.
3. If bluetooth is connected to my car radio, it also adds 1 to %LAUNCH, and again is subtracts 1.
4. I have another task that says if %LAUNCH=1 for <30 seconds, it sends command to shut down the tablet.

I want to re-write it, but thats working pretty good now. I have other profiles in tasker running to start ShadowDash and any other apps I want, so I literally get in the car, just turn the key and once the tablet boots it has connected to megasquirt, my headunit, and is showing the Shadow Dash gauges no problem. I turn the key off 30 sec later and its off.

I'm still working with a couple little niggle issues though. Like if you stall the car in traffic and restart, it freaks the Bluetooth transmitter out. If I shut the car down hard, wait a few seconds then start it its fine. There is an option to power it off external power supply I will try that.

Once it is working 100%, I'm ripping out the cluster and putting this in.

Thank you! I'm already rooted so I'll try those commands on my Acer. I'd really like to continue to use this 8" tablet since it fills the console out so nice but I'm not above sacrificing an 1" of screen space if I can get the auto boot to work.

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...e76f974d84.jpg

That tablet may do it - you just have to try.

Just took a recording of startup and shutdown on my setup. Have a lot of ideas to speed it up.. hope some of it works!

Stealth,

Where did you get that mount?

That looks amazing. However, I won't be allowed to run such a setup in my country of residence, and it would foul my sleeper look.

I'm rather thinking abut something like this:
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...9ca0287988.jpg

stealthy when closed, but does have a 7" display when opened. Apparently it does support OBD2-dongles (think: Torque App), so it might support bluetooth connectivity with the Megasquirt ECU?

It has all the components necessary, just have to be able to load apps on it. Hate to spend the money on it without trying it first.

Link to product?

e.g.: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Touc...e-31cab9b090e3

it says it supports OBD2 dongle, DAB+ radio receivers and a camera all via USB. Sounds good?

It also supports Herbrew. So that is a plus.

Are there any Android 5+ head units that doe USB OTG?

Never knew, but it looks like there are possibly a few other options on amazon rather than aliexpress from Eswin Automotive Store in mainland china. :dunno:

But you're wanting a stealthy look right? Check this one out - http://www.autopumpkin.com/car-dvd-p...eo-output.html

Has ODB2 support, bluetooth, gps, USB port in front like the other.

Latest Android 5.1 Double Din 2 Din Car GPS Stereo,Android 5.1 Head Unit | Pumpkin

These are neat and shiney.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Top-...4-80046dab1470

same same but diffelent

in a perfect world one would be able to run Harry's Laptimer and hook up a wifi camera and a hi-res GPS mouse directly to the stereo

That is fuckin' cool. It even looks kinda period correct. A bit of 90's rice. If it's running normal android I don't see why it couldn't bluetooth sync to the the MS and auto-start tunerstudio.

Could even run it in the top DIN with some traditional gauges below for some thing. You'd cover the HVAC controls though.

If these are truly Android based units with wifi you can do all of the above. Without WIFI you would only sacrifice the camera control.

I'm doing just that with tablet.

I made it from C channel and angle aluminum stock.

Available through amazon as well:

https://www.amazon.com/Pumpkin-Andro...android+stereo

Worse specs than 4 year old phones. No thanks

Just pointing out that you can order those from retailers based on this continent.

I have a nexus tab I'd like to do this with as well, except I want to be able to keep using it for school too since it's helpful for reviewing notecards and watching review lectures on the go.

So basically, I might be mounting it in a way where it can be easily detached and I want to run shadow dash to look at gauges. I might look into having things going through wifi on my phone so I can run gps or such through that, but I'm content running that through my phone and just using the nexus for shadow dash. Need to read a bit more of running oil pressure and temp sensors to the megasquirt.

Gentlemen, I think I've found the answer: https://youtu.be/8qHvB8bD404

this guy, while suffering from severe vertical video syndrome, runs shadow dash on a Joying 2 DIN radio. It looks like a tablet, but it's an Android 5.1 head unit. so I suppose the Pumpkin 5.1 radios will work as well.

he does however use the USB connection, not Bluetooth. I might run a longer USB cable from the radio into the passenger footwell and connect it to the MS3-PRO there. Whenever I do some tuning I'll simply hook the USB cable up to my laptop.

being able to run MSdroid is another bonus, being able to make adjustments on the fly.

How do I tell if these are USB OTG. I much rather wire up my MS with USB then do bluetooth.

most likely by shelling out 400.- I presume?

joking aside, this is exactly what the guy in the video has done!?

This is why I posted the link to the item for sale on amazon. Much easier to ask questions and field returns if it's bought through them.

You DON'T want this unit!

I got it prior to Xmas and spent 3 days trying to install the bastard in my MSM and here are the problems with it:

1. The unit comes with NO mounting hardware - so I bought a generic Double-DIN cage.

2. Double-DIN units are heavy and name-brand manufacturers include a rubberised mounting pin on the back that slides into a slot in the cavity's rear vertical brace to help support the unit - there was none included but there was a threaded hole in the rear at approximately the right spot so I made a mounting pin from a 5mm Allen bolt, several nuts and multiple layers of heatshrink "heatshrunk".

3. The plastic fascia that comes with the unit looks cheap and looks like it's been sitting in the sun for years - it's NOT black. The fascia is far too wide and a little tall too so you need to trim it a lot, way too much on the sides though because it becomes too thin. I have several fascias from other units but none fit over the unit due to the next problem:

4. The front plastic bezel attaches to the outside of the metal housing so protrudes on all sides. This means that the unit CANNOT be mounted in the generic cage because the plastic bezel stops it sliding far enough forward, meaning that the unit sticks out way too far. Good luck with trying to make your own custom solution too because the plastic bezel is so wide that there's no room on the sides so you can't get any extracting tools in to get it out again if you have snap-lock tabs. There is quite a bit of vertical space though.

Since there is no room on the sides, I made a top and bottom shelf out of 2mm aluminium with small lips on the front to hook onto the fascia and joined them with a square-angled u-brace that was mounted to the cavity's rear brace and included a hole for the mounting pin to pass through, The unit slid in and sat well but protruded a little too far for my liking but that was going to be as good as it gets. I still had NO idea how I was going to secure in place, custom locking tabs onto the top and bottom shelf were going to be my only option.

Some of the rear cables plug in close to that rear vertical cavity brace so I connected them and slid the unit in for a test fit - unfortunately they prevented the unit from going all the way. Most of the offending wiring was audio and since I only have from speakers and an amp in my car, I cut off all the unwanted wires from the plug and STILL had the same problem - the socket is hitting the rear brace so can't go in fully.

When I pulled the unit apart, I found that there is only a single motherboard in the bottom of the unit - the rest is just empty.

At this point I gave up on trying to fit it and ordered this instead: https://www.amazon.com/Android-Bluet...&tag=wow085-20

It's a single-DIN unit with a detachable screen.
The unit comes with a single-DIN mounting cage - unfortunately the screen protrudes too far since the cage's front lips hook onto the sides of the fascia.
You can adjust the screen's mounting points (the 4 mounting clips can be screwed into any of the vertical screw-points)
This unit is not as deep as a Double-Din unit and the whole unit, including the screen, fit inside the head unit cavity so I'm in the process of trying to make a bracket(s) to fit it so that it sits flush.
The detachable screen and smaller single-Din housing make this job much easier, I can actually see what I have to work with (you need to jam a Double-Din unit in so have no idea).

Also, one of my generic mounting kit fascias fits nicely over the screen so I should be able to make it look neat.

FYI: I installed a Mazda 3 EONON Double-DIN unit in my Mazda SP23 (see EONON GA5151W install into 2005 SP23 - MazdaSpeeders.com for details) and even though it has a custom panel and custom mounts, I still needed to do some work to make it fit properly/securely. It's something that the Chinese manufacturers really need to get a handle on because Android head units are so useful in a car.

Bottom line: If you're going to get a Chinese Android unit:
* try and get one with mounts/panel specific to your vehicle
* otherwise custom mounting is required (if you get it done by someone else, don't be surprised if it ends up looking crap, they charge you a lot for it because it's a custom-mount, and the head unit protrudes too far)
* Aim for at least Android 5.1
* Get the biggest resolution you can find (typically 1024x600 today - my SP23 only has 800x480(WGA) which isn't enough when you have Apps with buttons on them).
* Use Apps designed for Landscape mode - most Apps are designed for phone's in Portrait mode and are painful to use in Landscape mode eg, if the App uses lists, scrolling through them takes forever

Will it Megasquirt?

Yes it will - even via USB OTG - I got one of these in my 99 Miata with MS3Pro - running Shadowdash perfectly fine.

Though you should be warned - I got a different Android 4.2(?) unit before and it only lasted 1.5 years...
This can be bad luck but you never know...

Greets

Great info, thanks!

side note: funny to see once again both of us doing the same builds. I'm currently waiting for my EFR 6258 kit from SPS. Once it it built, along with the elise seats, the android head unit and other parts our cars will look like twins :-D

After a few days, I'd cooled down over the Double-DIN Android fiasco and got on eBay to see what else was available and found this 1024x600 Joying Single-DIN unit:
Attachment 182268

The screen is detachable, has multiple vertical mounting points and is shallower than most Double-DIN units so I figured I should be able to fit it - somehow.
The unit has a single-DIN mounting cage which latches onto the OEM fascia.
Unfortunately because of this, the detachable screen sticks out too far, I wanted it flush with the fascia.

Luckily the screen fits inside the NB's Double-DIN cavity so I figured I should be able to come up with something:

DIY mounting braces:
Attachment 182269
- that rear 3mm aluminium bracket is an absolute bitch to get in since those OEM side vertical braces have rolled edges and the brace fits flush against the recessed flat centre section.

Head Unit bracket:
Attachment 182270
- getting the angle correct was time-consuming, the unit needs to be solidly mounted to get it right
- the unit must be inserted sideways into the cavity, then rotated into place

Here's how the brackets connect:
Attachment 182271
- getting the depth correct was time-consuming, once again, the unit needs to be solidly mounted to get it right
- I used Allen bolts since they were the only 5mm bolts I had on hand

Attachment 182272

To tighten those three Allen bolts when the single-DIN unit was in place, I needed to mod a spare Allen key to shorten it:
http://i490.photobucket.com/albums/r...psprx6hkqx.jpg
- I've got heaps of these from various kits in the past, glad I didn't just throw them out.

Side view with the screen attached:
Attachment 182273

Front view, no bezel:
Attachment 182274
- I really like this look so might just mask the unsightly gaps behind the screen (ie. a DIY bezel behind the screen)

Front view with bezel:
Attachment 182275

I spent a lot of time figuring out where to mount the GPS unit.
On my SP23 there's a hidden flat shelf above the centre console, underneath the dashboard that seems just made to place a GPS unit.
There's nothing like this in an NB so I toyed with the idea of placing it on the rear parcel shelf or mounted on the dashboard as far forward as possible, near the driver's A-pillar.
Didn't like any of these options so pulled apart the instrument cluster to feel if there was any space under the dashboard (there's none on the passenger side with the airbag in the way).
The best place I could actually access was on top of the right centre air vent tunnel - picture the rounded instrument cluster hood, it's forward of the hood at about the 10 o'clock position.
I used velcro to mount the GPS on top of the air vent tunnel - if you don't think that's strong enough I say BOLLOCKS! Trying to get the GPS unit positioned correctly was a pain in the arse in that cramped space, every time the velcro surfaces touched they'd lock tight and I'd have to get them apart again.
I found using an old credit card between the velcro surfaces worked well, once the GPS was in about the right spot, I slid the credit card out.
That GPS unit isn't going anywhere.

Still not sure about where to put the microphone - very useful for Andoid voice commands.
The A-Pillar seems to be the most common place but that would look odd since it looks like a small round foam ball - like a "booger".

Great job, looks clean and very OEM-like! Now get shadow dash and MSdroid running in case you run the Megasquirt ECU!

is the GPS unit very positioning-sensitive? I would have glued it anywhere underneath the plastic dash, without giving it much thought

re: mic position - why not simply stick it onto the wiper stalk/steering column surround, above the steering hub/below the gauge cluster? Voice command and calls will probably not work anyway, at least at speeds beyond 50 kph

I opted for a slightly more DIY but less obvious approach and used a RaspberryPi with a custom python script and 1.3" OLED display mounted in a 52mm gauge blank to read live data from my MS2 over the RS232 port. In an ideal world I would have used done this using CAN but I was trying to spend as little as possible.

Lokiel, that is so awesome. Can't wait to see what it looks like with shadow-dash!

Any idea what the unit was called? I'm going to try seeing if it's available via amazon/ebay here!

Thanks - this took a LOT longer than expected since positioning/alignment is so important and the unit must be solidly mounted to get right.
If it's loose when you do your measurements they will be out of whack when everything is tightened up.

If I was to do this again, I'd want to find a wrecked NB's front console, remove its side plastic trim so that I could get at the sides and behind it.
I'd make that rear U-Brace and lower shelf all one piece of aluminium too.

Model/Manufacturer Part Number: JY-ULS03N2
7'' 2GB Universal 1 Din Android 5.1 Car Stereo Head Unit GPS SAT Navi Navigation | eBay

I did something similar with an Arduino and two blue OLEDs mounted in the instrument cluster's fuel and water temperature gauge slots:
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...c6d525361e.jpg
See Lokiel's "Gina" (2004 Titanium SE) - Page 53 - mx5cartalk.com and onward for full details.

Wow, I might have to take some inspiration from yours Lokiel, that is a whole lot cleaner looking than mine

This looks awesome. How is the visibility from the driver position? Is it good in bright light? Ideally I want something I can read on the straightaway even in direct sunlight.

I'm using the same OLED for exactly the same purpose mounted where the stock oil pressure gauge is on my NB, even on the brightest of days its still perfectly readable