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-   -   DP Stud and fastener issues - Suggestions? (https://www.miataturbo.net/race-prep-75/dp-stud-fastener-issues-suggestions-95870/)

codrus 11-26-2018 08:19 PM

FWIW, while I've had many, many issues with my turbo track Miata, the FM hotside hardware hasn't really been among them.

Andrew's stuff is really nice though.

--Ian

Tran 12-16-2018 07:13 PM


Originally Posted by nitrodann (Post 1512479)
Piss your gaskets off and use inconel and stage8 on everything.

Solved.

Dann

Update - I couldn't get stage 8 fasteners in time, but inconel studs on the turbine to DP flange with Nordlocks and Philidas lock nuts (the best recommendation from Owen Developments, the local Garrett distributor) seems to have resolved the issue. Though this is with a couple of caveats.

1. I wasn't looking for the issue before, so maybe took more than a day to develop
2. I never tried more than low boost (~250whp) since I was going to wait to the afternoon for high boost in case of running into issues (that way I'd only lose a few hours of track time, not half the day!) but a rain shower just after lunch removed all grip for the rest of the day so I didn't try more boost.

Though despite this, the seeds of doubt have been planted so maybe I should be planning for a TSE kit in my future....

Does anyone know which MX5 series in the UK is closest in pace to spec miata? I'm trying to work out how hard many people have pushed this kit and comparing back to spec miata lap records seems to be the benchmark. (For reference, the track was Rockingham International Super Sports Car and I was lapping just under 1:35s on 205 Federal RS-R on 8s (and 225 Federal RS-RR on 9s -oddly no faster), ~250whp and ~#2750 weight since I was taking (heavy!) passengers all day)

Savington 12-17-2018 01:57 PM

Are you asking how hard people have pushed TSE kits, or how hard people have pushed FM kits?

I can answer the former pretty definitively - an off-the-shelf TSE kit is the basis for the fastest Time Attack Miata in the world (949Racing's car). Roughly 20 seconds faster than a Spec Miata on a 2-minute course

Tran 12-17-2018 02:29 PM


Originally Posted by Savington (Post 1515266)
Are you asking how hard people have pushed TSE kits, or how hard people have pushed FM kits?

I can answer the former pretty definitively - an off-the-shelf TSE kit is the basis for the fastest Time Attack Miata in the world (949Racing's car). Roughly 20 seconds faster than a Spec Miata on a 2-minute course

Apologies, I meant how hard has the FM kit been pushed. We've all seen how hard the TSE kits have been pushed with the various 949 and TSE cars!

AutoFreak57 12-17-2018 02:33 PM

I've been having these same issues on my FM2 kit at 220hp. Also have lost center section bolts before. 1 weekend at NCM and every bolt was loose down to the down pipe. Including my FM inconels.

Have a TSE inconel set and going to try resbond on everything down to the down pipe this year. Also planning on adding another exhaust hanger. Right now its unsupported to the rear subframe. If I can't get more than 1 weekend still, it's time for the EFR.

BMWidmer 12-17-2018 06:12 PM


Originally Posted by Tran (Post 1515279)


Apologies, I meant how hard has the FM kit been pushed. We've all seen how hard the TSE kits have been pushed with the various 949 and TSE cars!

No qualm's against FM but if their kit worked really well on track; Andrew from Trackspeed engineering wouldn't have a business model.

codrus 12-17-2018 06:57 PM

Again, the studs & other fasteners on my (resbonded) FM hardware have not been an issue. No loosening despite 300+ rwhp and Laguna Seca lap times a second or more below the Spec Miata record. No, I'm not as fast as Andrew around that track, but that's got more to do with my driving and the suspension that was on the car than anything related to the motor.

AutoFreak57: did you resbond the FM studs?

--Ian

Savington 12-17-2018 07:21 PM

FM doesn't include resbond AFAIK.

codrus 12-17-2018 09:37 PM


Originally Posted by Savington (Post 1515338)
FM doesn't include resbond AFAIK.

I believe that's correct, so it would only be resbonded if AutoFreak57 did it himself.

--Ian

endura 12-17-2018 10:52 PM

I'm sure the Trackspeed kit is bulletproof, however, my FM manifold/downpipe has been bulletproof for the past 3 years. And yeah, it's been Resbonded.

AutoFreak57 12-18-2018 12:36 AM

Mine was no resbond. Main turbo studs won't last a weekend. The downpipe bolts make it 2 with cheap studs.

I'm hoping resbond is the magic glue everyone says it is. Efr is better, but I need good enough for st4 power.

codrus 12-18-2018 12:41 AM

Do you monitor EGTs?

--Ian

AutoFreak57 12-18-2018 12:45 AM

No. 14psi, 220whp on a dyno dynamics. Never had issues until I tracked the car (imagine that).

codrus 12-18-2018 12:56 AM


Originally Posted by AutoFreak57 (Post 1515374)
No. 14psi, 220whp on a dyno dynamics. Never had issues until I tracked the car (imagine that).

14 psi is plenty of boost to get 1800F+ EGTs if you don't have enough timing. Might be worth adding a sender to monitor it.

--Ian

bbundy 12-18-2018 02:30 AM

TSE Inconel has worked well on the manifold for me. Nord-Locks on the downpipe and a good transmission attachment has been critical.

endura 12-18-2018 08:23 PM

Correction. No resbond. . There is a down pipe-transmission brace. Gt2860. Yr 1-2 @12psi. Last year 16psi. It's done 4 3hr. W2w mini enduros/30 min. Sprint races + lapping. Pretty sure we just copied bbundy's downpipe brace setup. Fm stuff works just fine for me.

codrus 12-18-2018 11:33 PM


Originally Posted by endura (Post 1515623)
Correction. No resbond. . There is a down pipe-transmission brace. Gt2860. Yr 1-2 @12psi. Last year 16psi. It's done 4 3hr. W2w mini enduros/30 min. Sprint races + lapping. Pretty sure we just copied bbundy's downpipe brace setup. Fm stuff works just fine for me.

What octane do you run?

--Ian

AutoFreak57 12-19-2018 11:41 AM


Originally Posted by bbundy (Post 1515384)
TSE Inconel has worked well on the manifold for me. Nord-Locks on the downpipe and a good transmission attachment has been critical.

That's good to hear. Gives me hope in my setup. Can you share a picture of your trans attachment?

bbundy 12-19-2018 07:07 PM


Originally Posted by AutoFreak57 (Post 1515725)
That's good to hear. Gives me hope in my setup. Can you share a picture of your trans attachment?

Don't have a picture of it handy. It attaches to a factory trans side bracket with a custom made clamp around the pipe about 1.5" wide strip. A U-bolt clamp wont work it will just crush into the pipe. Too high of contact stress when tightened and it will never stay tight. welding a bracket directly to the pipe also won't work it will just rip out the welds. long bolts are your friend factory uses a bolt that's about 4" long connecting the clamp to the transmission bracket try to use something similar.

Side note I use a long runner mild steel schedule 40 weld ell manifold. It's is not near as robust as a cast Iron short manifold like TSE's It needs even more protection from the weight of the exhaust system. It is not without troubles. after some design refinement and reinforcement to the collector portion of it and a good design for a support bracket for the turbine housing It will generally last about a season of track use at best. The mild steel does allot better with thermal expansion than stainless but eventually enough heat cycles will crack it.

endura 12-19-2018 10:01 PM


Originally Posted by codrus (Post 1515647)
What octane do you run?

--Ian

Usually 93, if I screw up logistics, 91. Canadian, don't know if that's the same as the states. This is a stock B6 btw.


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