Wilwood Front Hubs
 

The Wilwood site has Miata aluminum tapered roller bearing front Hubs at $699.99 "for 2 hubs", Wilwood number 140-15725.

Any have experience with these?

https://wilwood.com/BrakeKits/BrakeK...ata&option=All

https://wilwood.com/PDF/DataSheets/ds1327.pdf


Thanks

I have no experience with these, but both the picture and the parts list indicate that the $699.99 kit is for two front hubs.

Looks like preload is adjusted by the end-user, unlike with the ball-bearing cartridge in the MiataHubs.

They also seem to be using long socket-head cap screws threaded in from the back as wheel studs. Interesting choice, given how many thread-in wheel studs are on the market for European cars.

https://wilwood.com/Images/BrakeKits...0-15725-xl.jpg

https://wilwood.com/Images/BrakeKits...725_kit-xl.jpg

https://wilwood.com/Images/BrakeKits...327_IPB-lg.jpg

So nobody else needs to guess what is on the linked page.

Preload adjustment and hassle just like the MAZDASPEED COMP/STM hubs... Hard pass.

Agree; IMO the BMW hub's recently developed are a strong, reasonably priced fix that looks to be the prayed for end to the issue.

One thing that bothers me, while they don't actually state it. It doesn't look like there are replaceable outer races from the pictures. So if you don't preload it enough and trash a bearing, do you need a whole new hub for 349.50?

Maybe they can be knocked out upon closer examination, but it is hard to tell, and the diagram doesn't show it separated.

It is highly unlikely that the outer races are machined in aluminum; therefore there should be a way to separate them as they got them in there somehow in the first place.

Those look interesting but I'm skeptical as well, just because they work on an e30 doesn't mean they will work for our completely different geometry/loadings/angles/etc plus the studs leave a lot to be desired

I have zero interest in being a guinea pig, he only has like 25 hours on his test pair and someone has already had a failure that sounded like it was almost right away, for the time and peace of mind I'd rather have something that's proven

I didn't mean to suggest that the outer races were aluminum, just that there doesn't look to be a provision to knock them out with a drift. That and the lack of outer races in the exploded view diagram make me skeptical. The pictures aren't great tho :dunno:

To be fair, that was one of the poverty/economy bearings he offers. Unlikely to have that issue with the higher end bearings which he also offers. Not a very good reason to write off the E30 option. Definitely still needs more testing, though.

.

Dunno why you deleted your post.
---Quote (Originally by turbofan)---
To be fair, that was one of the poverty/economy bearings he offers. Unlikely to have that issue with the higher end bearings which he also offers. Not a very good reason to write off the E30 option. Definitely still needs more testing, though.
---End Quote---
That's fair, he is offering them for testing and not as a vetted out solution.
Too bad you need to have a replacement one modified so it's not super convenient either
I guess we'll just see how things shake out

Anyone tried these yet? Half the price of the Miatahubs.com hubs. What's wrong with having to adjust preload? Are people afraid of dial indicators?

I have a spare set of Centric premiums but I have a hard time replacing the OEM units currently on the car with something "lesser".

I don't think the problem is adjusting the preload, its just that some have experienced (on other taper roller bearing offerings) a loss of that preload in a short amount of time.

Must be why they recommend replacing the bearings every 20 hours now

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...cf8a9725be.png

The loss of preload in older hub designs was due to the nyt backing off. The v8r design in the picture wont back off.

Set you preload. And make packing and adjusting part of you maintenance cycle. It will last a long long time.

i saw the wilwood hubs the other day while looking through their website. i am thinking of giving them a try. i am ok with adjusting preload. every airplane i have worked on uses tapered roller bearings and preload is adjusted with every wheel and tire change. we are talking about a machine that weighs about 100,000 lbs hitting the ground at 120mph when landing. so i do not find the idea of adjusting preload a detriment to the unit.

The difference is that the aircraft was designed for adjustable preload bearings. Miatas were not, so the spindles may lack the ability to hold the preload.

I would be skeptical of any company that sells a double taper roller bearing assembly that is specified to have an end play clearance.

Has everyone seen this yet?


Hello,



We are reaching out regarding the Miata hubs 140-15725 that you had purchased through Jegs. We would like to arrange to have those returned/exchanged for an updated/re-engineered piece which is much stronger than the original. Please get in touch with me to arrange an RMA and UPS return label.



https://www.wilwood.com/BrakeKits/Br...emno=140-15725





Thank You,

Was that a message you received from Wilwood? Jegs? Something must fail big time for them to be voluntarily swapping peoples hubs for new ones.

Yes, message from WIwood to one of our teammates that purchased a set of the Wilwood hubs. I have since gotten info from another friend telling me about catastrophic hubs failures occurring with the Wilwood hubs.

Interesting. Care to elaborate on the failures? Are these friends members here?

I am not even the tiniest bit surprised.

I think there was one kicking around a couple months ago of a pretty catastrophic failure as the whole flange broke off.

Reviving thread because I just learned about the issues with Miata hubs, especially since I'm considering tracking my car.

I was looking at the Wilwood hubs as a cheaper alternative to the Miatahubs.com hubs, however if they are having issues then it might not be worth considering. I can handle figuring out adjusting preload, I can handle repacking the bearings every 20 hours, but if the hubs have failure issues then that kinda defeats the purpose of the hubs entirely.

Has there been any updates on that since?

Good timing. I'm also in the market for some hubs.
5 weekends (well technically 4.25) on repacked Timkens from RockAuto, on RE71R's...
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...cd3f628211.jpg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...32fa5da64b.jpg

Not much info on the Wilwood front hubs. There's rumors of failures in the handful of threads I found, but a Google search didn't turn up any evidence. No pictures, no first person accounts, just hearsay. I did check and they have replaceable bearings and races. Inner and outer are the same part number. They're about $10 each, so $20 per corner. I'm not opposed to checking preload and repacking bearings, already have to do that with the shitty "non-serviceable" stock hubs.

At $625 they seem like a better option than the $1200 non-serviceable MiataHubs.

I don't like that you need to ship the MiataHubs units back to them to have the bearings replaced. I really don't care that labor is free; I'd much rather be able to do it myself. They won't even sell you the bearing cartridges. If something happens, the hub is a paperweight until I can get it shipped to them. Rather than just punch out the races, grease the new bearings, and throw it back together. I don't like relying on a niche company to be around when I need service. I'm much more confident Wilwood will still be around in a year or two when I need replacement parts.

here you go. Just buy the Miatahubs and quit worrying about wearing them out.


https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...7dbe27fb2.jpeg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...b52c37a00.jpeg

Thanks for pointing out that we need to update our website and install instructions. The required return-for-replacement deal was only during 2019 and was intended as a way for us to learn from any unexpected early failures. We had a few sent back because of crash damage and only one sent back for normal usage wear. In 2020 we started offering replacement bearing service kits to all customers, and Good-win and FM have been stocking them for most of this year.

We had to purchase a VERY large quantity of bearings to get a custom factory production run from SKF, so we won't be running out of bearings any time soon.

Jesus fuckin' Christ riding a bicycle on a piece of toast that's fucking terrifying. At least with the stock hub you expect it to fail, the Wilwood versions are BEEFY and also fail. You'd think Wilwood would make a very high quality product. Has Wilwood addressed this issue at all? Have they issued an updated version?

It looks like people use Centric Premium hubs as better alternatives, but even then they look thin and chintzy.

So looking at photos, it's a little difficult to really discern, BUT looking at where your Wilwood hub failed and comparing the MiataHubs hub and the Wilwood hub:

https://d5otzd52uv6zz.cloudfront.net...a5030d-800.jpg

https://static.wixstatic.com/media/8...99157~mv2.webp

If you look closely, the 'wall' where it necks up from the flange is MUCH thicker on the MH hub. The Wilwood hub looks like it's half the thickness.

That's just one thing, comparing things like alloy composition and that adds alot more to the mix.

I think I might just go MiataHubs on this one.

It looks like they do have a new (thicker) design. Revision date on the install instructions is 5/11/2020

https://www.wilwood.com/BrakeKits/Br...20Kit%20(Race)

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...f0810c55e4.jpg

If you are looking for a more budget solution, Bro Fab has kits for using the beffy BMW E30 front wheel hubs/bearings.

https://www.bro-fab.com/

Well that's good. Not sure if I want to be the guinea pig on this.

The wilwood hubs are also aluminum, so the thickness relative to the "thin and chintzy" centric premiums isn't really relevant. The Miatahubs are suuuuper thick AND steel, so there's a reason they don't break.

Hey guys, BroFab checking in here. Haven't been active much on the forums seems the world has moved onto facebook groups much to my disappointment. I'm still churning these things out and moving a decent amount of them. Still no idea how long the Timkin/FAG/ SKF bearings will last, no one has worn one out yet, so safe to say they are firmly proven at this point. The economy bearings....well they are economy bearings. We've had 7 wear out prematurely now out of 300 bearings sold, so they are aren't 100% effective as expected. Seems big hoosier, big aero or high brake heat tends to push them past the heat treatment depth and shows up as a noisy bearing or little wheel wiggle. None of that scary breaking in half stuff you're seeing from other hubs. I don't feel my recommendations have changed for them, still a viable option for most non serious track rats looking for a cheap option that doesn't try to kill you. Easy enough to upgrade to a German bearing if you find your application warrants it.

Sorry about your luck fmcokc, and thanks for posting! I would have never seen it if it was on Facebook.

Guess it's MiataHubs FTW. I didn't realize they were steel. That isn't mentioned in any of the descriptions, so I figured they were aluminum like the Wilwood hubs.
I see the bearings listed separately on Goodwin Racing. Will be nice to keep a spare in the trailer. I'll be ordering shortly!

Wow, I was debating between these two and totally forgot about your kit. Glad you stopped by, I just ordered a set from you.

Actually the Miatahubs website doesn't make any claim about the material of the front hubs, only that they are billet. They appear to be aluminum, but idk.

They're steel. Professional Miata Parts Guy Ed™ has the good advice :)
​​​​​​​

​​​​​​​That explains why they're so damn expensive!

If you look on the description of the rears it states:

"These are a ground up design and made of the same premium quality high carbon Billet steel that you know and love from the front hubs. MADE IN USA!"

So you're right that it doesn't state the material on the product description of the front but they are clearly standing up to abuse that aluminum would not.

Well steel rear hubs are common because of the space constraints and all that. Even the V8R hubs are steel.

MH could be using aluminum in that area and get away with it because there's more space to work with, and judging by how thicc everything is, I wouldn't be surprised. After all, it wouldn't require significantly more thickness in steel for it to be strong enough to handle track duty. The similarity in design with the Wilwood hubs kinda backs that up.

I'll wait for an official word from the MH guy on what material it is. Regardless, they're a proven part that's ready to roll.

EDIT: Seriously, who tf gave me a negcat? Are you seriously THAT petty? Is "waiting for an official response from the actual manufacturer rather than speculate or use information derived from a different part" actually a problem?

We made some hubs last year that we wanted to fit in around the Wilwood price point, but then Wilwood came out with theirs and we shelved it. I haven't heard anything bad about Miatahubs other than price, and they seemed too heavy. Now that Wilwoods are failing left and right, would anyone be interested in us releasing a set of hubs around the $699-799 price point? The prototypes we made are 440C which is very high carbon but for production we might chose something more compliant. In CAD these were something like 10x stronger than stock on the flange. Now that the season was starting again we were asking a buddy to test them, but with no real urgency.

The bearing is a cartage style and is basically the OE size.

Let me know if there is interest.

Thanks, Roy - RBR

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...6c45b73ee3.jpg

Why not

They're steel.

Every decision we made on our hubs was about maximizing life and eliminating hubs as a failure point on the NA/NB. Cost and weight were less important.

<3

Thank you for the response

If you've got something that matches (or at least closely matches) MiataHubs I think you've got a winner at that price.

Interested
 

Keep us posted.

Anyone a member of a track club that gets a ton of track time? I can send them to them for testing. I can't fit testing these into our race schedule.

In for updates.

I recently purchased Brofab racer front hubs. Miatahubs look awesome but I couldn’t justify the 100% higher cost.