k24madness

iTrader: (6)

http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=462522

At $115 each it maybe worth raising the car a 1/2" and trying them out. Not going to break any records with them but could be a fun, cheap DE tire.

pusha

iTrader: (5)

good link bro, I likey

hustler

iTrader: (6)

This tire is only for extreme V8 Miatas with aero, not for unreliable turbo Miatas.

k24madness

iTrader: (6)

LOL....I spoke to the local American Racer dealer. He said the sidewalls were on the softer side of slicks. This makes me think if they work on a porky V8 car then they should be even better for the lighter FI guys.

The real challenge will be the 23.8" height. With that in mind it will never be a record breaking tire. Still a winner at $460 a set if you get 10 heat cycles at R6 level of grip.

olderguy

iTrader: (19)

Other than raising the car, you might find that they rub at the rear of the front wheel wells. Pulling out castor to compensate can make it VERY twitchy.

k24madness

iTrader: (6)

I wonder why Mark has not mentioned any problems there. Maybe the NB sub frame CA mounting points help that.

ianferrell

ooh, neat... I wanna see how the soft compound compares to the a6... though that'd be xp instead of ssm right? (Bias ply non dot)

Rocwandrer

Correct, XP, not SSM. Possibly EM too.

Savington

iTrader: (31)

He hasn't mentioned it because it's not an issue. If you're stupid enough to whine about how your 275mm tires rub ---- at full lock on a Miata, you should just sell the car and give up.

BTW, you can't just "raise the car half an inch" and run a 23.8" tire. You would have to run a thicker bumpstop or do something else to limit wheel travel. Otherwise, the tire will foul the top of the fender and the shock tower in a big way. Even with 700 or 800lb springs we get into the bumpstops on a routine basis. As-is, my 23" tall NT-01s polish the shock towers and rub the tops of the fenders.

jacob300zx

You can just let them rub away too. Like Savington said you would need to add some bumpstop to limit travel, due to the motion ratio it wont be much maybe? .3". Which actually might not hurt anything to much because the sidewalls are softer.

miata_racer

wouldn't adding some packers below the bump stop do the same thing?

I might try some of the mini sprint 22.5 height ones on my 13x9s. That will keep me close to 23" and I'll run a medium compound.

Faeflora

iTrader: (2)

I have something that is 2.75" and slick for u bby

In for incest

hustler

iTrader: (6)

That PerryRace guy knows more than all of us combined. If you're ever at the track with him and the hood is up on your car so it can cool off, he'll let you know how much you don't know. I can't wait to spend time with him at the track again.

ZX-Tex

iTrader: (15)

So I raced on some of these over the weekend at Texas World Speedway. They work, but have a much different feel than a 275 R6 (back-to-back comparison). They require a lot of slip angle to go fast, and I mean a LOT. The car feel is much looser, not as in oversteer loose, but as in more of a floaty feel. Steering inputs and the movement of the car are exaggerated a lot.

They are also big. No way IMO would they fit with just a rolled fender, especially on a NA (I have Autokonexion flares). They are a little narrower than a 275 R6, but are a lot taller, so that is where the clearance issue comes in. For example, I had to bend in the bottom edge of the front quarter panel (behind the tire) on both sides to keep them from rubbing.

I was having to deal with some suspension setup issues that were causing drastic mid-corner and corner exit oversteer. I finally fixed that, but by then the AR rear tires were done, so I switched to R6 scrubs to finish out the weekend. Because I did not try the AR tires after I finally got the car balanced, I cannot say with 100% confidence that they are as fast as Hoosiers, but they are pretty close, say within 2 seconds. They are fast tires, just be prepared for the difference in handling. It is not bad, just different. Also be aware that they require a lot less camber than Hoosiers so to get optimum performance, negative camber has to be reduced by a lot, on the order of 1-2 degrees. So it is not a bolt-on tire.

Savington

iTrader: (31)

"within 2 seconds" is not close. That's like saying NT-01s are "close" to Hoosier A6s in the same size.

Efini~FC3S

iTrader: (4)

That's kind of what I was thinking...

Then again, are they close considering the price difference?

ZX-Tex

iTrader: (15)

Honestly if there was a NT-01, or something like it (grip, longevity, price) in a 245, I would rather use that, at least for track days. But we are all still waiting for that one to appear.

Another variable in this comparison is that I did not add camber back to the car when I switched to the R6s. The resulting tire temperature profiles (inner, center, outer, measured with a probe pyrometer) were sort-of OK, but more camber would have brought more speed. So between that and the big suspension tweak it is hard for me to say exactly how close they are.

ZX-Tex

iTrader: (15)

So I posted this over at m.n and am reposting it here FYI

I just used them again at NOLA near New Orleans, which is a fairly fast, fairly technical track. Everything from above still applies. They work, but as mentioned they need lots of slip angle and the car is very floaty; you have to aim well inside the corner (like a few feet) to hit the apex. They also wear quickly. If I started with a fresh set for the weekend, and ran them in every session, they would be close to done by the end of the weekend (two days, four sessions each day, ~20 minutes per session).

For whatever reason they also take a LONG time to heat up. The first few laps the car wants to understeer and just feels wrong. About 5-7 laps in they come to life. In all of my sessions for that weekend, my fastest lap in TT was set on my last lap, every time which was lap 8 or 10 depending on the session.

All that being said, I did turn in some pretty fast laps, about 7 seconds faster than the fastest Spec Miata lap (same day, same conditions). I had to drive the car very aggressively. Still smooth, but making course changes like I really meant it. Steering effort and wheel angle is substantially higher than everything else I have tried.

I do not think I will be using these again, and will be switching to the purple crack for next season. Dollar per track mile I do not think they save much money over Hoosiers since they wear so quickly. Just my opinion, YMMV. They are worth trying if you go in with the right expectations.

emilio700

iTrader: (3)

FWIW, Formula Atlantic front scrubs are affordable and they work on Miatas. 9's or 10's best.

ZX-Tex

iTrader: (15)

Yep, thanks, tried those too, scrubs from John Berget. I got tired of trying to make them work for me after a couple of sets and gave up on them. I do not know if it is my car setup or my driving style but I could not go significantly faster on FAs than NT-01s.

I know someone else with a V8 Miata (fast) that could not get FAs to work for them either.