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Old 08-19-2015, 10:54 AM   #2961
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M-Tuned also uses Helicoils in their rear brackets.
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Old 08-19-2015, 10:58 AM   #2962
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If we are threading into thinish aluminum, I would use coils too.
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Old 08-19-2015, 11:04 AM   #2963
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V8R uses helicoils for their BBK too. As does 949 I believe.
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Old 08-19-2015, 11:05 AM   #2964
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Helicoils it is.
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Old 08-19-2015, 11:43 AM   #2965
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<p>Received this lovely bit of correspondence in the mail yesterday. This is the restriction. The next bit of mail should contain the suspension. Not sure when that gets here.</p><p></p>
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Old 08-19-2015, 12:42 PM   #2966
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<p>
Quote:
Originally Posted by hi_im_sean View Post
No. For what we are talking about (hard material against hard material), surface area has 0 effect on friction. Its simply: friction coefficient x normal force. Now if we were talking tires.... But more swept area means better wear, lasts longer. On a side note, I was going through reltes thread. Youll notice a guy named &quot;be good&quot; who was banned by brain for suggesting that dynalites are flexy cheap calipers. Well that was johnny C, quite possibly the most knowledgeable brake guy weve ever had on this forum, who has come back under a new screen name. lmao, im glad he has thick skin.
</p><p>To be fair, that johnny C was making claims out of his *** with no data to back them up. Johnny C of today has evidence, engineering, and experience to back up his claims.</p>
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Old 08-19-2015, 01:13 PM   #2967
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My guess would be that the stiffness improvement in the Dynapros comes from the caliper design, not from the radial mount. They aren't Porsche monoblocks, but I'm sure there's still room for a through-bolt design to be stiffer than the old Dynalites.

FWIW, TSE brackets are non-helicoil. I used to have a Goodwin BBK setup, and I had to replace the brackets once because it was pulling the helicoil out of the aluminum, so I'm not sure that helicoils are actually an improvement here.

--Ian
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Old 08-19-2015, 01:22 PM   #2968
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aidandj View Post
<p></p><p>To be fair, that johnny C was making claims out of his *** with no data to back them up. Johnny C of today has evidence, engineering, and experience to back up his claims.</p>
Was he not still right?

Not sure where you got that info, but whatever. Hes not a buddy of mine or anything, I just though tit was funny.

Quote:
Originally Posted by codrus View Post
My guess would be that the stiffness improvement in the Dynapros comes from the caliper design, not from the radial mount. They aren't Porsche monoblocks, but I'm sure there's still room for a through-bolt design to be stiffer than the old Dynalites.

FWIW, TSE brackets are non-helicoil. I used to have a Goodwin BBK setup, and I had to replace the brackets once because it was pulling the helicoil out of the aluminum, so I'm not sure that helicoils are actually an improvement here.

--Ian

I always thought helicoils were stronger than threading directly into the material assuming the coil is of a harder(or tougher) material and its all installed right. They definitely save thread wear for high use fasteners. Not the issue here, just worth mentioning. You dont think the threads would have pulled if the coil wasnt there?
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Old 08-19-2015, 01:33 PM   #2969
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<p>
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePass View Post
The strength of the caliper itself affects overall rigidity by a whole order of magnitude more than the relatively small difference between radial and lug mounting styles - assuming that you have a strong, well engineered caliper bracket in either case - either of those bracket styles could be designed poorly and that would then increase flex. The dynalite's body is just significantly flexible for a &quot;fixed&quot; multi-piston caliper, and this is much improved in the DynaPro. The dynalite is old - like, same caliper that was used in the original Goodwin Racing BBK nearly two decades ago. Tech has come a long way, and the DynaPro brings many improvements with it. Of course the big benefit in staying with the lug mount version here, is the caliper &quot;drops in&quot; to your current kit in place of the Dynalite, rather than having to change to a whole new kit with an alternate mounting design. I've used both the DynaPro 4 Radial mount (as used in the newest version of the V8Roadster BBK) and the DynaPro 4 Lug Mount retrofitted to a kit that came with a Dynalite and pedal feel is similarly excellent between the two, both feeling substantially better than the Dynalite.
</p><p>BAM</p>
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Old 08-19-2015, 01:43 PM   #2970
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<p>
Quote:
Originally Posted by hi_im_sean View Post
Was he not still right? Not sure where you got that info, but whatever. Hes not a buddy of mine or anything, I just though tit was funny. I always thought helicoils were stronger than threading directly into the material assuming the coil is of a harder(or tougher) material and its all installed right. They definitely save thread wear for high use fasteners. Not the issue here, just worth mentioning. You dont think the threads would have pulled if the coil wasnt there?
</p><p>From what I could tell he was banned for offering no evidence and just saying they were shitty. The ban was stupid, but there may have been other reasons.</p><p>My thought for the helicoil was to save thread wear. I **** up threads all the time, watch what I can do in aluminum threads.</p>
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Old 08-19-2015, 01:46 PM   #2971
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aidandj View Post
I **** up threads all the time, watch what I can do in aluminum threads.</p>
Do I see a torque wrench in your future?

Let me see what I can dig up on thread insert theory. If there is no benefit in our case, then no reaso to waste money and time.

Did you know you can get heli-coils in inconel?
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Old 08-19-2015, 01:47 PM   #2972
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<p>I blew out my last caliper using my torque wrench....I don't torque them to 60ft/lbs anymore.</p><p>I WANT INCONEL HELI-COILS.</p><p>For the ******* dick swingingness of it.</p>
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Old 08-19-2015, 01:52 PM   #2973
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aidandj View Post
<p>I blew out my last caliper using my torque wrench....I don't torque them to 60ft/lbs anymore.</p><p>I WANT INCONEL HELI-COILS.</p><p>For the ******* dick swingingness of it.</p>
I was looking at them for my manifoild, they are kind of affordable to if you can find someone selling them individually, which proved impossible. You can find random left over sizes on ebay sometimes. HeliCoil only sells them in bags of 100, I think it was about $300 for a bag.
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Old 08-19-2015, 01:53 PM   #2974
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<p>That makes me want to helicoil everything I own.</p>
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Old 08-19-2015, 02:04 PM   #2975
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hi_im_sean View Post
I always thought helicoils were stronger than threading directly into the material assuming the coil is of a harder(or tougher) material and its all installed right. They definitely save thread wear for high use fasteners. Not the issue here, just worth mentioning. You dont think the threads would have pulled if the coil wasnt there?
I had always read that too. OTOH, the Goodwin instructions say not to over torque the calipers due to risk of pulling out the insert. After the first time it happened a couple years ago I got religious about using the torque wrench on here, but, as you can see, it wasn't enough:



This was after Laguna Seca last year. The brakes got good and hot -- maybe it's a thermal expansion issue? I dunno.

Andrew says he's never seen a thread-related failure on the TSE brackets.

--Ian
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Old 08-19-2015, 02:05 PM   #2976
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Quote:
Originally Posted by codrus View Post

Andrew says he's never seen a thread-related failure on the TSE brackets.

--Ian
Thats about all I need to know. Thanks Ian!
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Old 08-19-2015, 02:06 PM   #2977
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<p>
Quote:
Originally Posted by codrus View Post
<br />Andrew says he's never seen a thread-related failure on the TSE brackets.<br />--Ian
<br /><br />That has absolutely zero bearing on whether or not I can break them.</p>
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Old 08-19-2015, 02:17 PM   #2978
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aidandj View Post
<p><br /><br />That has absolutely zero bearing on whether or not I can break them.</p>
Why are you torquing them to 60 ft-lb anyway? The factory spec is 37-50, and that's going into a cast iron bracket.

--Ian
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Old 08-19-2015, 02:18 PM   #2979
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<p>I was talking about the caliper spec.</p><p>I just have a habit of destroying things on accident.</p>
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Old 08-19-2015, 02:49 PM   #2980
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deezums; Relte calculated the pad area about 10% higher than 11", which is about 10% more than 1.8L stock brakes, so it might be beneficial to lower pad force [U
to keep the calipers tapering as much[/U].

At least that's how I understand it, am I close to right?

The 4 piston calipers fix the pad tapering issue since you are evenly applying pressure to both pads instead of just with one piston as is the case with factory caliper. What ever flex you will get due to slightly less stiff dynalites will be nothing compared to the pad taper you see on OEM calipers that make pads useless with 1/2 the pad still unworn.
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