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Old 08-22-2016, 02:46 PM   #1
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Default Anyone ran E98?

I have been searching and have not been able to find much on E98 in these cars. I just talked to a local source that sells 55 gallon drums for a little over $300. Is it a huge step from E85 to 98? Obviously need BIG injectors and fuels system but seems like it could be pretty cool. I would set up secondary fuel and spark maps. I am betting gas mileage would be horrible.
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Old 08-22-2016, 02:47 PM   #2
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Curious: what specifically it will achieve over e85.
Considering that even e30 will get you to MBT, and also considering that you still need gasoline pumping through your system to keep it from doing nasty things
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Old 08-22-2016, 02:48 PM   #3
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Nothing. Just go fill up 55 gallon drums with e85 if you need it. Would probably be cheaper.
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Old 08-22-2016, 02:52 PM   #4
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Thats what I was curious about. If there is a benefit. This place sells E85 and 98 for the same price.
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Old 08-22-2016, 02:55 PM   #5
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From what I've read vlad hit a good point with the part about needing gasoline. It lubes stuff in ways that alcohol doesnt. (there is a dirty joke in there somewhere)

You have to go to extreme limits to get e85 to knock.

Jays garage is like $3.00 a gallon for e85. Show up with a 55 gallon drum and spend half the price.
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Old 08-22-2016, 02:56 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aidandj View Post
From what I've read vlad hit a good point with the part about needing gasoline. It lubes stuff in ways that alcohol doesnt. (there is a dirty joke in there somewhere)

You have to go to extreme limits to get e85 to knock.

Jays garage is like $3.00 a gallon for e85. Show up with a 55 gallon drum and spend half the price.
That your EFR plan? Jays?
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Old 08-22-2016, 02:57 PM   #7
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I'll run e85 for some dyno queen numbers, but no way i'll daily it. I also track this car in california, and eastern oregon. And washington soon.
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Old 08-22-2016, 03:27 PM   #8
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You could buy E98 and add as needed if your tuned for real E85 and you get a weak batch (I've heard it fluctuates down to E70 at times) for peace of mind
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Old 08-22-2016, 03:40 PM   #9
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You could buy E98 and add as needed if your tuned for real E85 and you get a weak batch (I've heard it fluctuates down to E70 at times) for peace of mind
To know what concentration of Ethanol you are running would require the flex fuel sensor. At that point just run multiple tables so it can change fuel based on the ethanol content.
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Old 08-22-2016, 03:41 PM   #10
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Yeah I thought about that. Or even blend it down a little more if you would like. Either way you need a flex sensor and very good grasp of tuning to make that work.

A lot of talk when it comes to E85 is that you can run all of the timing. But I think a huge possible benefit to E98 or possibly blend E90 could be ditching the intercooler. I am going to set my car up with tried and true methods until I know what I am doing but I think in the future I am going to try and figure out a ethanol non intercooler type set up at medium boost. I have read a bunch of threads involving water injection and no intercooler and they all seam to end up with a intercooler. Most of the E85 threads tend to be on cars that were already set up traditional and then E85 was added later.
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Old 08-22-2016, 03:43 PM   #11
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I don't think there is enough additional cooling alone from the ethanol to run without an IC, but I could be completely wrong.
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Old 08-22-2016, 03:44 PM   #12
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I don't think there is enough additional cooling alone from the ethanol to run without an IC, but I could be completely wrong.

Do you think it would depend on the amount of boost and turbo?
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Old 08-22-2016, 03:44 PM   #13
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Why do you want to not run an intercooler? The pain and hassle of getting your own gas. Or spending $6 a gallon. Will easily pay for an intercooler when you are getting 30% worse gas mileage.
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Old 08-22-2016, 03:48 PM   #14
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Why do you want to not run an intercooler? The pain and hassle of getting your own gas. Or spending $6 a gallon. Will easily pay for an intercooler when you are getting 30% worse gas mileage.

I already picked one up and do plan on using one but if I really like the idea of not using one unless I have to. Simpler pipping. Less couplers. Less clutter in the front of the car and lower weight. I am by no means saying this thought process is better or for anyone. Intercoolers are great but if I can get away with 275 at the wheels running E85ish without an intercooler and have the detonation safety of high octane I am going to try it. I wouldn't try this with a track car though. This is me just ******* around with a concept.
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Old 08-22-2016, 03:55 PM   #15
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Quote:
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Why do you want to not run an intercooler? The pain and hassle of getting your own gas. Or spending $6 a gallon. Will easily pay for an intercooler when you are getting 30% worse gas mileage.

You are way right on the ecomics of this though. I have a flat bed trailer so it wouldn't be too hard to just get two drums a month of Ethonal. My Miata is only half my daily driver. I use my Landcruiser most of the time because I keep my meal prep in the fridge. I also have a Supermoto bike I use to get to school. I would never consider this if it was my true daily. I would just leave it on gas and move on.
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Old 08-22-2016, 03:56 PM   #16
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I mean Tom@FFS is running close to 300whp with E85 and no intercooler. I don't want to know what his IAT's are though.
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Old 08-22-2016, 03:56 PM   #17
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AIT's don't matter nearly as much with e85 because its so hard to get it to detonate.
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Old 08-22-2016, 04:09 PM   #18
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ditching the intercooler is mind blowingly idiotic, and Tom, as we all know, is a moron
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Old 08-22-2016, 04:10 PM   #19
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for the record, I've ACTUALLY tried this with Toms FFTHUPERCHARGER. cause when I call someone a moron, and their whole forced induction method moronic, I like to speak from experience.

200-220F at cruise, 250-280F at 8psi of boost, on e85, and car made absolutely no friggen power cause it was ingesting lava
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Old 08-22-2016, 04:11 PM   #20
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we also tried the no-intercooler setup on e85 on other cars, and lost massive torque and power.

so no. just no

you need cold/dense air to make power. even on e85
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