The Better Bilstein Ebay Coilover Thread - Page 21 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

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Old 02-11-2015, 02:25 PM   #401
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PatCleary View Post
Would people be interested in a 3" long 100 or 150lb tender spring? I'm putting together a set of Ebay coilovers and it's crossed my mind. I've been thinking about calling a few spring venders to see if anyone would make some up for me, hopefully for substantially less than the Eibach's. I'd probably want to order a couple dozen at a minimum though.
These pretty much fit what you described you want. The ID is 60mm so you'd need to check your sleeves. Length and rate fits.

Vorshlag 60mm Tender Spring (each) - Vorshlag LLC

Doubt you'll get 'custom' springs for less.
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Old 02-11-2015, 02:27 PM   #402
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Raceland tenders are zero-rate and 2.25". Not really what we're looking for. If you can get 3" 150 lb flat-wound springs for under $50/pair, I'd be interested. I'm thinking that's not going to be particularly likely in any reasonable quantity, though.
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Old 02-11-2015, 02:47 PM   #403
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Old 02-11-2015, 02:55 PM   #404
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Not sure because that's the exact setup I'm running on my car now (except I overpaid for the spacer...). I'm only using the tender (or whatever the correct term is) to keep the main spring on the seat.
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Old 02-11-2015, 03:01 PM   #405
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That's really all i'm looking to do. I don't want to get into this weird progressive stuff.
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Old 02-11-2015, 03:29 PM   #406
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Anyone know if there's a construction difference between these two Hyperco part numbers?

6B0600

vs

CO6-600

Both seem to be 6" long 2.5" ID 600lb springs. Prices are quite different between the two, though.
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Old 02-11-2015, 03:45 PM   #407
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Looks like the C06-600 is a progressive rate spring that (maybe) ramps up to 1200 lb/in. The CB0600 is just a straight 600 in/lb coil spring.

I don't want a zero rate tender, I don't even know that I actually want tenders. My understanding is that they're properly used to ensure that a shock fully extends in rebound regardless of where a coilover is set. I'm hoping to be able to use the majority of the sleeve to adjust car performance (not a one time set). Hopefully I can get springs that fit, don't bind at full bump and fully extend. If not, I'll add tenders.

The cost on the Eibach/Vorschlag springs is the issue. Maybe I can't beat it, but I'll try before buying tenders that are more expensive than main springs. I don't need to profit off them so there's some advantage.
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Old 02-11-2015, 03:47 PM   #408
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Quote:
Originally Posted by concealer404 View Post
Anyone know if there's a construction difference between these two Hyperco part numbers?

6B0600

vs

CO6-600

Both seem to be 6" long 2.5" ID 600lb springs. Prices are quite different between the two, though.
Apparently 6BO600 is their old coil spring, with the "Dynamic Travel Response" buzzword on the box, and CO6-600 is the new one, that says "Optimum Body Diameter" on the box. I think they'll tell you CO6-600 is better, but I doubt it really makes any sort of difference in practice.
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Old 02-11-2015, 03:47 PM   #409
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Quote:
Originally Posted by concealer404 View Post
Anyone know if there's a construction difference between these two Hyperco part numbers?

6B0600

vs

CO6-600

Both seem to be 6" long 2.5" ID 600lb springs. Prices are quite different between the two, though.
According to the catalog, the 6B0600 is their "Ultra High Travel" but the catalog doesn't give enough information to figure out what the travel actually is.

The C06-600 isn't in the catalog (at least the 2015 one that I have).
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Old 02-11-2015, 03:48 PM   #410
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As long as they're both "linear" i don't really give a ****.

I think the 6b0600/0400 are the new style, actually. They're in their new catalog, and they're more expensive.

I just wasn't sure about progressive ****, because the pictures that some of the vendors have for the CO6 part numbers look like the ricey Eibach prokit crap.



Let me back up a minute here and maybe get some input?

What i currently have:
MSM bilsteins w/ circlip groove moved down 1"
Ebay sleeves/perches
QA1 7" 550/400s
1.5" and 1.0" extended NB hats. (Previously bought this stuff for an NA. I have an NB now.)


Figured i'd invest a little more into this setup in the hopes it'll keep me going for longer than originally planned.

Proposed new setup:
MSM Bilsteins w/ circlip groove moved down 1"
Allstar sleeves/perches
Hyperco 6" 600/400s
Hyperco CS100 helpers
Wideopen tender perches
Use 1.0" extended hats in rear only


Any glaring issues with this setup? Do i need/want rubber isolators for top of helping springs for any reason?

Last edited by concealer404; 02-11-2015 at 03:59 PM.
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Old 02-11-2015, 03:59 PM   #411
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Never mind, Google decided to do thinking for me (that I didn't want it to do). Looks like the CO6-600's are a straight coil.
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Old 02-11-2015, 04:13 PM   #412
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Quote:
Originally Posted by concealer404 View Post
As long as they're both "linear" i don't really give a ****.

I think the 6b0600/0400 are the new style, actually. They're in their new catalog, and they're more expensive.

I just wasn't sure about progressive ****, because the pictures that some of the vendors have for the CO6 part numbers look like the ricey Eibach prokit crap.



Let me back up a minute here and maybe get some input?

What i currently have:
MSM bilsteins w/ circlip groove moved down 1"
Ebay sleeves/perches
QA1 7" 550/400s
1.5" and 1.0" extended NB hats. (Previously bought this stuff for an NA. I have an NB now.)


Figured i'd invest a little more into this setup in the hopes it'll keep me going for longer than originally planned.

Proposed new setup:
MSM Bilsteins w/ circlip groove moved down 1"
Allstar sleeves/perches
Hyperco 6" 600/400s
Hyperco CS100 helpers
Wideopen tender perches
Use 1.0" extended hats in rear only


Any glaring issues with this setup? Do i need/want rubber isolators for top of helping springs for any reason?
The Allstar sleeves will allow you to drop a fair amount just using them alone. See my earlier post in this thread.

The Hyperco tenders have a pretty small block height (I can measure in a day or so to tell you exactly). My point is there isn't much to compensate in the perch height setting.

Are you thinking the 6" just to go lower? I use 7" only because that seemed to be the suggested length but I don't try and drop the car that much and run NB top hats only.

I use top isolators (glued to the top hat underside) only because I think it's good practice and keeps everything quiet.

Let me know if you need any measurements of the setup I have as everything's back off the car while I do work on the bushings.
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Old 02-11-2015, 04:36 PM   #413
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bahurd View Post
The Allstar sleeves will allow you to drop a fair amount just using them alone. See my earlier post in this thread.
Yep, hhammerly cut my shocks to lower the clip, mostly to avoid having to cut the sleeves. He did the same thing on his, works well.

Quote:
The Hyperco tenders have a pretty small block height (I can measure in a day or so to tell you exactly). My point is there isn't much to compensate in the perch height setting.
Yeah, my only concern/reason to use them is just so the spring doesn't unseat.

Quote:
Are you thinking the 6" just to go lower? I use 7" only because that seemed to be the suggested length but I don't try and drop the car that much and run NB top hats only.
Mostly. Doing some rough eyeball math on hhammerly's setup (though he has... 150 or 250lb helper springs, don't remember which) using 6" main springs, it should be able to hit 949's "Dual Duty" alignment specs, but with not a huge amount of leeway, which is why i'm ditching the 7s. Not entirely sure i can hit it with 7s. Maybe i can, but i know his setup will do it, so that's what i'm sortof modeling my stuff after at the moment.

Quote:
I use top isolators (glued to the top hat underside) only because I think it's good practice and keeps everything quiet.
Source? Or are you just using OEM deals?

Quote:
Let me know if you need any measurements of the setup I have as everything's back off the car while I do work on the bushings.
I appreciate the offer, but i think i'm ok at the moment. I appreciate the help!

Last edited by concealer404; 02-11-2015 at 04:50 PM.
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Old 02-11-2015, 04:46 PM   #414
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Quote:
Originally Posted by concealer404 View Post
Yeah, my only concern/reason to use them is just so the spring doesn't unseat.
They won't. The Hyperco CS100 springs are 4" long (free length)


Quote:
Originally Posted by concealer404 View Post

Source? Or are you just using OEM deals?
Summit; http://www.summitracing.com/parts/ens-9-6103g

I understand on the height. The 6" should at least let you have adjustment UP on the collars.
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Old 02-11-2015, 04:50 PM   #415
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bahurd View Post
They won't. The Hyperco CS100 springs are 4" long (free length)




Summit; http://www.summitracing.com/parts/ens-9-6103g

I understand on the height. The 6" should at least let you have adjustment UP on the collars.

Cool, thanks!

Yeah, i'm also trying to "future-proof" this a bit if i decide to roll with it long term and get some revalved Bilsteins. Then all i have to do is swap the front 600s for 700s.

Though to be honest, hhammerly's car felt just fine with the 600s on much older Bilsteins than mine. That may just be my uncalibrated suspension butt dyno not knowing any better, but i was pretty impressed with it in general. Far more capable than my driving is, that's for sure.
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Old 02-11-2015, 05:24 PM   #416
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Honestly, with the NB on NB bilstein style shocks, you will want as much travel in the front as possible if you are going to be running 4.5" ride heights. Definitely use the 1.5" tophat in the front.

also, helpers like the 949 Xida ones can be had online (ebay link). (Another ebay link with size & rate choices).

You maybe able to find an american supplier of them (or similar springs) to get a decent dual spring setup (rather than ones to hold your main spring up). They are made in 2.25" and 2.5".
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Old 02-11-2015, 05:29 PM   #417
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seefo View Post
Honestly, with the NB on NB bilstein style shocks, you will want as much travel in the front as possible if you are going to be running 4.5" ride heights. Definitely use the 1.5" tophat in the front.

What? Really? The longer hat in the front?
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Old 02-11-2015, 05:40 PM   #418
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Quote:
Originally Posted by concealer404 View Post
What? Really? The longer hat in the front?
my experience with NB shocks is they are a little under 1" longer shock bodies. Running at 5" at the pinchweld basically put me about 10mm away from a cut NB bumpstop (the stiffest 1/3).

If you plan to run realistic bumpstops and want to have suspension travel, You will want to gain back as much of your front travel as possible.

I didn't have any issues getting reasonable travel on the rears though. I know the MSM Bilstein shocks are slightly different from the NB sport, but I suspect you will have a similar issue.

This is a 99 on NB tophats btw.
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Old 02-19-2015, 02:06 PM   #419
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i have an nb so let me get this straight on the bilsteins that came on this chassis

hard s (black body)
sport s (yellow body)(b8)
msm(gray)

b6 is yellow body and available separately?

main question is what does everyone recommend from this list?
still researching these things

Last edited by awdracer; 02-19-2015 at 02:46 PM.
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Old 02-19-2015, 02:29 PM   #420
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Hard s are yellow.
MSM are grey/silver.

B6 is the the HD shock and B8 is the sport shock, both are available separately.
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