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Or send everything to me and I'll digitize it all. While I do have some T5z and miata 5speed stuff in solidworks, it's not enough for me to feel comfy building an adapter off of. I did them quickly to just have something in my assembly, not to base parts from. I built my adapter from the block models; I made my adapters to convert to a SBFord cranks & bell housing and i'm running all mustang clutch stuff.
But then again, I'm not sure how accurate it needs to be. T5z input shaft was .017" off SBF crank centerline when the bellhousing dowels were aligned.
If you could digitize a miata bellhousing that would be amazing. My currently plan includes the miata bellhousing, chopped of a 5 speed, and welded to a t5 flange. Miata flywheel, miata hydraulics, etc.
But getting the t5 perfectly centered is going to be hard. Current plan is to make a jig that bolts onto the miata bellhousing, and has a hole in the middle to align the input shaft correctly.
I got that already, currently in SW2016. If you need it in an older generation SW file I may be able to find it on a backup. It may or may not be useful to you, but you may as well look at it. But again, if it were me, I'd base crank centerline-to-locating dowels off a digitized block than a transmission.
Your "chop, mill, weld, mill" is exactly how I would do it. The chopped & milled bellhousing and appropriate plate that gets welded to it should be milled with a large chamfer on the edge to facilitate penetration.
I got that already, currently in SW2016. If you need it in an older generation SW file I may be able to find it on a backup. It may or may not be useful to you, but you may as well look at it. But again, if it were me, I'd base crank centerline-to-locating dowels off a digitized block than a transmission.
Your "chop, mill, weld, mill" is exactly how I would do it. The chopped & milled bellhousing and appropriate plate that gets welded to it should be milled with a large chamfer on the edge to facilitate penetration.
Do you have a digitized block also? I kind of assumed they would be the same.
Fixture plate would have dowels like the engine block to locate it on the trans bellhousing. Then slide the t5 in on top of it and get it lined up perfectly. Tack weld it. I think we are in agreement here, but i'm not sure if I understand what you are saying exactly.
Then either see if my 200amp chinaTIG can do it. Or take it to a shop with a bigger welder. We do have a 305amp tig at work. But its older than I am and I'm not very good with it.
Do you have a digitized block also? I kind of assumed they would be the same.
I do not have a digitized BP sorry. They are the 'same' as in the bolt together obviously. But in my limited experience, transmissions are more...sloppy? I.E. I have a ford drawing of the small block windsor. 2 ford blocks we have here matched it pretty much dead nuts. The Ford T5 didn't...was off by .017. That may or may not matter to you. It sounds like you are doing a one off so it probably doesn't matter...make it fit the trans you have.
Fixture plate would have dowels like the engine block to locate it on the trans bellhousing. Then slide the t5 in on top of it and get it lined up perfectly. Tack weld it.
Ahh ok, I thought you were making an adapter in your CAD system then milling/welding it all together. In this case, I"m not sure why you need the Mazda trans CAD info. if you're eyeballing it then go or it
Then either see if my 200amp chinaTIG can do it. Or take it to a shop with a bigger welder. We do have a 305amp tig at work. But its older than I am and I'm not very good with it.
It all depends on how thick your adapter plate is. I've never MIG'ed aluminum though.
I wouldn't be eyeballing it. The plate would be on the face of the mazda bellhousing. and it would have a hole for the input shaft. Input shaft would have an extension on it to center it perfectly in the middle of the bellhousing. Then I know that the bellhousing is perfectly centered on the T5 and I can weld the chopped off bellhousing to the T5 "flange"
Does your digitized bellhousing have the input shaft too? So i know exactly where the middle is?
And yes this is basically a one off. I might be making 2 or 3, but by no means production.
I wouldn't be eyeballing it. The plate would be on the face of the mazda bellhousing. and it would have a hole for the input shaft. Input shaft would have an extension on it to center it perfectly in the middle of the bellhousing. Then I know that the bellhousing is perfectly centered on the T5 and I can weld the chopped off bellhousing to the T5 "flange"
Does your digitized bellhousing have the input shaft too? So i know exactly where the middle is?
And yes this is basically a one off. I might be making 2 or 3, but by no means production.
You should note that you have a 99-03 T5 from a V6. The tail shaft is slightly different for an electronic speedo but can easily be swapped for any gear driven unit and the input shaft has some differences but I can not confirm. Some tailshafts do not have a synchronized reverse.
The T5 was dropped behind v8 mustangs in 1996 when the 4.6 came out, the modular V8's from 96 up had a T45 and then a TR3650 which both have integral bell housings.
The T5 was behind every manual V6 mustang 1994-2010. I have no information on 2005-2010 T5's as this generation of mustang used the 4.0 V6 which has a different
The 3.8 and 4.0 do not share a bell housing bolt pattern.
So I did some measuring and brainstorming with sean yesterday for a TOB solution. And I think I have an idea. The real questions are italicized and bolded.
Here are the measurements:
T5:
TOB Sleeve OD 1.435"
TOB Sleeve thickness ~.1", couldn't really measure it well.
Input shaft OD: 1.054"
Miata:
TOB Sleeve OD 1.296"
My first thought was to turn down the TOB sleeve on the T5 to fit a miata TOB. But that won't work, so my next plan is to press the sleeve out of the T5, and machine a new one, that has the OD of the Miata TOB, with an ID that will fit over the input shaft.
How much clearance should the input shaft have from the TOB sleeve? In reality will the input shaft move at all while supported by the pilot bearing?
Picture of T5 TOB sleeve
I also still need to get my hands on a 90-93 V8 T5 input shaft. Not sure if new or used is the way to go.
Just enough so things aren't touching. 10 thou would probably be a conservative minimum. The shaft should only move around radially as much as the bearings allow. Which should be less than a thou.
There is plenty of room, you could easily have an 1/8" wall at the miata TOB OD, and still have ~20 thou clearance on the radius. This idea works, assuming it all presses apart and together the way we discussed. Torch and press ready yet?
This one was all tommy's idea. Its basically a barbell looking fixture, that aligns on the miata crank, and the t5 flange. This allows perfect alignment, while the miata bellhousing is located to the block with dowels.
The fixture bolts to the crank, then the chopped miata bellhousing gets bolted to the block. The t5 flange then gets aligned on the fixture, and welded in place.
The last direction of alignment is to get the correct "rotational" alignment of the t5 flange, not sure exactly how I'll do that yet.
Aren't their pairs of flange bolts that are normally perfectly horizontal? Sounds like you could just make a plate to hold a digital angle gauge to the trans during jigging.
Aren't their pairs of flange bolts that are normally perfectly horizontal? Sounds like you could just make a plate to hold a digital angle gauge to the trans during jigging.
I assume they are. But I don't like to make assumptions.
F-bodies tilt that flange 18 degrees CCW for ground clearance FWIW, so you have room to play with for packaging constraints. It just affects the shifter packaging.
Jigging the rotation off a vertical rear mount bolt would make for maximum ease of PPF attachment in the small chance this isn't exactly the same as a level shifter base.
A neighbor with a T5-swapped turbo Volvo is starting a swap on his Miata. May have pics someday.
09-13-2016, 11:49 AM
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